Windows 10 - It's heeerrre! and it's free for some

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  • SimonJMSimonJM Posts: 5,970
    edited August 2015

    My first attempt went well - spent a while witing for it doign the preparing andf all and finally hit the 'something happened' error and it stopped.

     

    Oh and I was also amused by the fact you 'need' to create a bootable device and then it asks what languages you want and the tells you not to boot from it, but start WIndows normally and run the setup!

    Post edited by SimonJM on
  • acanthisacanthis Posts: 604

    Have you seen this in the M$ EULA

    To the extent necessary to provide the Services to you and others, to protect you and the Services, and to improve Microsoft products and services, you grant to Microsoft a worldwide and royalty-free intellectual property license to use Your Content, for example, to make copies of, retain, transmit, reformat,

     display, and distribute via communication tools Your Content 

    I know I keep banging on about this and it's very boring - but this is exactly what I have been trying to draw attention to. And don't forget, this applies to the Operating System - the software that you need to use your PC, not some optional social media site where we know that we have no privacy.

    This is saying that the Microsoft Corporation can take any data of yours that they want and use it as they see fit without restriction or recompense. That means EVERYTHING in your OneDrive folder and anything else that they choose to transmit back to Redmond under the guise of diagnostics, profiling, customisation, personalisation or any one of a hundred other BS euphemisms!

    Welcome to Microsoft Windows 10. You wanted the "Best Windows Yet"? You got it. sad

  • LeatherGryphonLeatherGryphon Posts: 11,453
    nDelphi said:

    People keep mentioning other OSes as though they are truly an option, they are not. Unless they can run applications that only exist for the Windows platform, and they are many, there is no other OS to consider. To help break the Windows and Apple monopolies software companies have got to start moving their applications to an open source platform, in droves. And that is not ever going to happen.

    Absolutely right. Expecting "normal" people to adopt Linux is a pathetic pipe dream.  Most "normal" people still can't change their passwords on Windows and you expect them to deal with Linux?.  The only choices for complex computation/display/design services are Windows or Whatever Apple is calling what they're currently using.   The way to deal with the monopolies is to litigate them into submission.

     

     

  • Peter FulfordPeter Fulford Posts: 1,325

       The way to deal with the monopolies is to litigate them into submission.

     

    The creative destruction of the market seems to be doing a fine job of dealing with Microsoft. They are having their lunch eaten, digested and passed whilst being forced to watch.

    Jon Honeyball's column in the latest PC Pro mag mentions the "talk" in IT circles about Microsoft walking away from the "home" market altogether, because it doesn't make any money from it anymore. Most "normal" people get everything they need from an iOS or Android device and simply have no need for the "desktop". Microsoft could provide a simplified, locked down version of Windows as a mere boot loader for Office 365 and its browser – with no third party application support except for pre-installed things like Facebook and Twitter. They could then concentrate on retaining their small/medium business and corporate enterprise markets, which do make money (currently).

    That would be a massively radical development, and the success or otherwise of Windows10 may be the decider. When MS announced the free upgrade, I thought it had less to do with encouraging people to get up to date, and more to do with the difficulty of charging people for something they don’t need. When Google’s business model enables them to offer desirable hardware at cost with a free OS, and “normal” people are happy to trade their privacy for those shiny beads, it’s difficult for the old business models to compete.

    Maybe there’s enough of a rump creative “home” market for someone/s (a collection of hardware makers and third party developers?) to make a properly de-geeked version of Linux without all the hateful “always connected” / social meeja spying and spamming garbage.

    Who knows? Not me, that’s for sure. But I do know big change is coming one way or another. If I was running a company selling 3D content primarily to Windows users, I’d not be snoozing right now.

     

  • nDelphinDelphi Posts: 1,853
    edited August 2015

    ReactOS is about the only hope we have of an OS compatible with Windows binaries. Sadly, it has been in the alpha stage for like 10-years. I still keep my eye on them, may be Microsoft's new strategy will make people more willing to provide them with the resources to help them reach the goal.

    https://www.reactos.org/screenshots

    Post edited by nDelphi on
  • SimonJMSimonJM Posts: 5,970

    Now up and running Win 10, and now trying to chase down all the settings to turn them off! :)

  • SixDsSixDs Posts: 2,384

    "companies have got to start moving their applications to an open source platform"

    Of course, that is a chicken and egg situation, nDelphi. Unless people switched in large numbers, software developers will have no more incentive to port to alternative operating systems than they do now. Meanwhile, users will be reluctant to switch until the software is supported. Catch 22.

    Collectively, we may not get the operating system we want, but we probably will get the one we deserve.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,157
    SimonJM said:

    Now up and running Win 10, and now trying to chase down all the settings to turn them off! :)

    http://www.yamicsoft.com/windows10manager/w10mdownloadterms.html

    Watch the YouTube vid closely when setting up the program.  It's not free but once it's set up and your windows is booting fast and annoying stuff is off you can uninstall it.  I did that and all my changes are still in place. 

     

     

     

  • jag11jag11 Posts: 885
    edited August 2015

    For those that are really concern about the EULA and to peace your mind, I'd suggest go find legal advice, show the License agreement and ask all kinds of questions regarding the activities that you do and how might affect you. This is precisely what M$, DAZ and others do and in the long run prevent they won't get sued for drying your cat in the microwave.

    Your rights end where others rights begin and always keep in mind Laws are there to enforce your rights, and Privacy is one of them.

     

     

    Post edited by fixmypcmike on
  • Peter WadePeter Wade Posts: 1,618

    If Microsoft do give up on the home market that would cause a major upheaval for some people (probably most of us here) but probably not much for the majority of people.

    When I started with home computers they were very much a minority hobby. When people started selling games for the 8 bit machines they became more popular, but up to the time of the Amiga home computing was still very much a nerd hobby and the PC was just an office machine. Once PCs became mainstream and the internet was opened to the general public the home computer became a common household item. Applications like Poser, Carrara, Daz Studio, Bryce etc effectively rode on the back of this, it is a minority hobby but computers powerful enough to run them are easily available. If the current type of home computer dissapears most people will still be able to do all the computing they want on a tablet or a phone, but I don't see much chance of running Carrara or doing Iray renders in Studio on an Android tablet. Maybe home computing could shrink back to a minority hobby again if there are companies making the hardware for the much smaller market. I'm sure the Linux and Open Source people would keep on going as long as they could still get computers to run their stuff and it would be up to each commercial software house if they wanted to switch or just give up and do something else.

    Maybe a bit of a gloomy post, but who knows?

     

  • I've just extracted the Win10 nagware from my 8.1 system. I dont think I'll be interested in the full blown data colection that is Win10.

    Just my opinion. If this gets deleted, it wont be the first time!

     

    Ivy +1

     

  • IceCrMnIceCrMn Posts: 2,126

    That really depends on what metric you use to determine "complex" The top 500 fastest supercomputers on earth mostly run linux.There is one windows machine (currently ranked #360).All the others are running linux,BSD, or UNIX.

    Windows 10 just doesn't bring anything to the table that I didn't have already.Windows 10 is more of a game console OS than anything else.It has several new features, but they have no value for me.

    I have no use for Cortana.I can type my searchs faster than it can figure out what I'm saying to it.I can also highlight something and right click to get a list of search engines to plug the words into if I want to seach something I found on a page.

    I don't have a computer powerful enough , nor the hardware ,to make use of the hologram toys.I don't think there are any programs using it right now, and it's more or less just a technology preview at this point.

    DirectX12 is mostly for video games, so I don't think much of it will make it's way into Daz Studio.Maybe some of it will,,I don't know.

    Cortana, holograms, and DirectX12 just aren't compelling enough reasons to move to W10.

  • LeatherGryphonLeatherGryphon Posts: 11,453

    In comparison to changing Windows passwords. DAZ Studio and programs of the same ilk are "complex".  Yet Microsoft seems to be going the other direction and attempting to make things more and more idiot proof.  My feelings are, however, that idiots should be permitted to shoot themselves in the foot and other painful places as the situations arise.  I learned long before I retired that there are always bigger idiots and catering to them only makes them breed faster.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 40,941
    bigh said:
    kyoto kid said:

    ..letsee 2 bad Nvidia updates that overwrote the existing ones and caused serious issues for a lot of users, and in the span of just a couple weeks?  I consider that a pretty bad track record especially since the bloody thing has barely got ourt of the gate.

    Doesn't make me confident in the "nanny" who thinks they know what's better for my system than myself (who also built it by the way).

    heck if you want by that you wouldn't use any of Daz software .

    but you are !

    ...a single programme and an OS are two different things.

    Daz isn't forcing me to accept updates, I can stop at any time.  If I do update and something doesn't work right, I can file a support ticket, and if it really causes major issues I can always roll back to the previous version just by uninstalling the suspect version and loading the older installer from my archive into the DIM.  True, any scenes I started in the newer edition won't open but once a proper fix is issued I can then go back to them as well as open and work on any scenes I created during the rollback.  Furthermore, a bug in Daz studio is unique to that software and doesn't affect any other programmes I use.

    Also, Daz studio does not load device drivers and security updates on my system. The only process it affects is the CMS which is unique to it and Carrara.

    With MS and Win10 it is a totally different story. Let's say, just for argument's sake, they force yet another faulty Nvidia driver update that creates a conflict resulting in a BSOD after boot up (three's a charm).  Not only is Daz Studio affected, but everything else my system as well.  Oh I can reset my system to an earlier time (losing whatever work I had done during that period) only to have Auto Update start the whole mess all over again when time "catches up" and I have to go through the whole routine again, and again until MS gets ir right as I cannot defer the update, nor can I choose not to accept it (I have 7 home edition which would mean I'd get 10 home edition). I'm in this by the skin of my teeth, I cannot simply drop 199$ on a commercial copy of 10 Pro (which while it does let me defer, still does not permit rejection of unwanted/unneeded updates).

    To roll back an OS is no where near as simple as doing so with a single programme. I don't have to do a full system backup and pull out my Win7 install disk and set everything up from scratch again, just to roll back to Daz 4.7 if I so chose.

    It basically comes down to a bug in Daz may be annoying or frustrating, while a bug in Windows can be crippling if not critical to the system.

  • bighbigh Posts: 8,147
    kyoto kid said:
    bigh said:
    kyoto kid said:

    ..letsee 2 bad Nvidia updates that overwrote the existing ones and caused serious issues for a lot of users, and in the span of just a couple weeks?  I consider that a pretty bad track record especially since the bloody thing has barely got ourt of the gate.

    Doesn't make me confident in the "nanny" who thinks they know what's better for my system than myself (who also built it by the way).

    heck if you want by that you wouldn't use any of Daz software .

    but you are !

    ...a single programme and an OS are two different things.

    Daz isn't forcing me to accept updates, I can stop at any time.  If I do update and something doesn't work right, I can file a support ticket, and if it really causes major issues I can always roll back to the previous version just by uninstalling the suspect version and loading the older installer from my archive into the DIM.  True, any scenes I started in the newer edition won't open but once a proper fix is issued I can then go back to them as well as open and work on any scenes I created during the rollback.  Furthermore, a bug in Daz studio is unique to that software and doesn't affect any other programmes I use.

    Also, Daz studio does not load device drivers and security updates on my system. The only process it affects is the CMS which is unique to it and Carrara.

    With MS and Win10 it is a totally different story. Let's say, just for argument's sake, they force yet another faulty Nvidia driver update that creates a conflict resulting in a BSOD after boot up (three's a charm).  Not only is Daz Studio affected, but everything else my system as well.  Oh I can reset my system to an earlier time (losing whatever work I had done during that period) only to have Auto Update start the whole mess all over again when time "catches up" and I have to go through the whole routine again, and again until MS gets ir right as I cannot defer the update, nor can I choose not to accept it (I have 7 home edition which would mean I'd get 10 home edition). I'm in this by the skin of my teeth, I cannot simply drop 199$ on a commercial copy of 10 Pro (which while it does let me defer, still does not permit rejection of unwanted/unneeded updates).

    To roll back an OS is no where near as simple as doing so with a single programme. I don't have to do a full system backup and pull out my Win7 install disk and set everything up from scratch again, just to roll back to Daz 4.7 if I so chose.

    It basically comes down to a bug in Daz may be annoying or frustrating, while a bug in Windows can be crippling if not critical to the system.

    thats not all ways true about Daz software

    just ask those who update ( say Carrara ) then try to use the

    old version - its doesn't work like it used to .

    believe me we were not happy .

    same with DS - if you want the to use the new models they don't work

    if you don't have the news version of DS .

    and they don't work at all in Carrara .

    and I think you can turn off updates in windows 10 if you want to .

    like I said before 10 works fine for me .

  • SimonJMSimonJM Posts: 5,970

    RAMWolff said:

    Now up and running Win 10, and now trying to chase down all the settings to turn them off! :)

    http://www.yamicsoft.com/windows10manager/w10mdownloadterms.html

    Watch the YouTube vid closely when setting up the program.  It's not free but once it's set up and your windows is booting fast and annoying stuff is off you can uninstall it.  I did that and all my changes are still in place. 

     

     

     

    Thanks, I'll give that some thought!

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,157
    edited August 2015

    Does anyone know where they have MS Edge exe stored?   I wanted to add a shortcut to my Object Dock app from Stardock!

    Post edited by RAMWolff on
  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,157
    edited August 2015

    OK.. found the solution....

    Right click or press and hold on an empty area on your desktop, and click/tap on New and Shortcut
     Copy and paste the location below into the location area, 


     %windir%\explorer.exe shell:Appsfolder\Microsoft.MicrosoftEdge_8wekyb3d8bbwe!MicrosoftEdge

    press next 

    now name it Microsoft Edge for the name, and click on the Finish button.

    move the shortcut to a destination where you like it ( if you dont want to have it on your desktop )

    I just made this icon too.... PNG, nice effects so if you wanna make a shortcut for your desktop or add it to a bar (drag and drop it to the bar, it works from the Desktop but not from the Taskbar for what ever reason).... PS, you will need a program like IcoFX to convert the PNG to an ICO fole:

    http://icofx.ro/ (I LOVE this app) This is the pay for version

    http://icofx.software.informer.com/1.6/ This is the free version (older but works fine on Windows 10)

     

    MSEdgeIcon.png
    400 x 400 - 628K
    Post edited by RAMWolff on
  • Robert FreiseRobert Freise Posts: 4,395
    bigh said:
    kyoto kid said:
    bigh said:
    kyoto kid said:

    ..letsee 2 bad Nvidia updates that overwrote the existing ones and caused serious issues for a lot of users, and in the span of just a couple weeks?  I consider that a pretty bad track record especially since the bloody thing has barely got ourt of the gate.

    Doesn't make me confident in the "nanny" who thinks they know what's better for my system than myself (who also built it by the way).

    heck if you want by that you wouldn't use any of Daz software .

    but you are !

    ...a single programme and an OS are two different things.

    Daz isn't forcing me to accept updates, I can stop at any time.  If I do update and something doesn't work right, I can file a support ticket, and if it really causes major issues I can always roll back to the previous version just by uninstalling the suspect version and loading the older installer from my archive into the DIM.  True, any scenes I started in the newer edition won't open but once a proper fix is issued I can then go back to them as well as open and work on any scenes I created during the rollback.  Furthermore, a bug in Daz studio is unique to that software and doesn't affect any other programmes I use.

    Also, Daz studio does not load device drivers and security updates on my system. The only process it affects is the CMS which is unique to it and Carrara.

    With MS and Win10 it is a totally different story. Let's say, just for argument's sake, they force yet another faulty Nvidia driver update that creates a conflict resulting in a BSOD after boot up (three's a charm).  Not only is Daz Studio affected, but everything else my system as well.  Oh I can reset my system to an earlier time (losing whatever work I had done during that period) only to have Auto Update start the whole mess all over again when time "catches up" and I have to go through the whole routine again, and again until MS gets ir right as I cannot defer the update, nor can I choose not to accept it (I have 7 home edition which would mean I'd get 10 home edition). I'm in this by the skin of my teeth, I cannot simply drop 199$ on a commercial copy of 10 Pro (which while it does let me defer, still does not permit rejection of unwanted/unneeded updates).

    To roll back an OS is no where near as simple as doing so with a single programme. I don't have to do a full system backup and pull out my Win7 install disk and set everything up from scratch again, just to roll back to Daz 4.7 if I so chose.

    It basically comes down to a bug in Daz may be annoying or frustrating, while a bug in Windows can be crippling if not critical to the system.

    thats not all ways true about Daz software

    just ask those who update ( say Carrara ) then try to use the

    old version - its doesn't work like it used to .

    believe me we were not happy .

    same with DS - if you want the to use the new models they don't work

    if you don't have the news version of DS .

    and they don't work at all in Carrara .

    and I think you can turn off updates in windows 10 if you want to .

    like I said before 10 works fine for me .

    You can defer feature updates for a month but not security updates all you can do is have it tell you to schedule a reboot provided you have set that option

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    nDelphi said:
    ... I wanted to find proof where Microsoft restated their position to go with the subscription model. You haven't provided it.

    The point isn't that there is proof they will convert to a subscription model, the point is that Microsoft has still not declared that it "won't" switch to a subscription model, leaving everyone up in the air as to what they will do. Microsoft has been asked continuously what their plans are regarding this and they have dodged the question every time. That leaves many people uncomfortable, and many who take it as an indication that they in fact do intend to go to a subscription model but don't want to say so until the deed is done. Truth is, no one knows but the decision makers at Microsoft, and perhaps not even them at the moment.

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    edited August 2015
    nDelphi said:
    icecrmn said:
    nDelphi said:

    Yes, that's correct. But it shouldn't be taking a huge chunk of memory. The Cortana service on my machine is taking about 20 MBs.

    Mine is ~66MB and jumping much higher

    We will have to sit tight and wait for an app, like the No Defense, to pop-up and help us turn her off completely and for good.

    Or transform her into clippy ;)

    Post edited by Joe Cotter on
  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    MEC4D said:

    You will get free upgrades to the last day your device is running  at not extra charge  ...

    As far as I know, Microsoft never actually confirmed this. Do you have a reference to somewhere where they officially stated this?

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    edited August 2015

    Ubuntu has been monitoring everything through their search features, sending the information back to Canonical and sharing with 3d parties for years now. It amazes me that people would choose this over MS or any other OS. If one is going to go to Linux, one might want to consider a distro that hasn't been actively disavowed by people at the top of the Linux community.

    Ivy said:

     Ubuntu is a complete desktop Linux operating system http://www.linux.com/directory/Distributions/popular-distributions/ubuntu

    you can get it here free as well  http://www.ubuntu.com/ ; the free desk top download link is here http://www.ubuntu.com/download

     this is going to be the way people are going to avoid using MS windows and what I loaded on my new 1tb SSD

     and yes they do have a cloud service as well for mobil devices

     

    Post edited by Joe Cotter on
  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259

    ? ... Not a for/against subscriptions services point here but rather trying to keep facts straight... The monthly subscription rate is $50 for the full package which = $600 year... The last price I saw to purchase the Master Collection when it was still new was well into the thousands, close to $4k U.S. in fact. Since one can only get it through 3d party software companies now, much of which is grey market, and it is years old, one can't compare the 'cheep' prices one finds on the net as a vaild comparison for pricing. Grey market goods do have their own hidden costs which I won't go into.

    Ivy said:

    I'm interested in knowing. Do you use Adobe products? are you using creative cloud or creative suite?  Do you know after one years time paying for all the creative cloud serves  you would have paid them enough for the stand alone master collection creative suite cs6,

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259

    It still has issues, can't take advantage of the latest drivers for video cards and has a not insignificant hit on performance on the software it does run. To have a good comparison one would need to install Linux/Wine, software, and create test scenaries which would give real world examples of common tasks one would want to perform both in the Windows platform and the Linux/Wine platform and see what the tradeoffs are. These tradeoffs will be different for each person and I've seen no resources which do or could provide the answers without going through this test as there are so many variables with different configurations, use/case scenarios, distros, etc...

    I've been told that WINE has been improved and will run most Windows programs know

     

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    RAMWolff said:

    ... The techs are not the evil of MS, they are good folks that are doing what they are paid to do and do it well. 

    There are some great people working at Microsoft. I've been a strong Microsoft supporter and have been critical at times with their corporate decisions, but I've never had anything but great experiences with the people working there.

  • Joe CotterJoe Cotter Posts: 3,259
    nDelphi said:

    All that wasted time and money and frustration. Microsoft should be compensating people like you. A billion dollar company that can't get an upgrade right.

    There always has been and probably will be for the foreseable future issues with a new version of something as complicated as an OS or a complex program. There are just some issues that can't be discovered until the program is released into the wild as one can only test so many scenarios. This is at the heart of Mac vs Win debate as Apple has a restricted hardware base it runs it's software on and therefore reduces the number of variables to a fraction of what Windows has to deal with. Linux with all of it's distros is in the worst position this way, and a big part of why many software companies won't come out with a Linux version.

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249
    Microsoft :
    "Windows 7, Windows 8.1, and Windows Phone 8.1 will be able to upgrade to the new operating system for free as long as they do so within one year of Windows 10's launch. Once you’ve claimed the upgrade, it's permanent, and Microsoft will keep you updated for the supported lifetime of the device."
    source : Microsoft website 

     

    It is printed also on each installation of OEM Windows version Disk too unless you run a Win Retail version and an Upgrade as win10 is OEM version  “for the supported lifetime of your device" once your change your motherboard or if it die it is gone .OEM is locked to one computer and so Upgrade of Win10 as you can't transfer the license to another computer system .

    Gedd said:
    MEC4D said:

    You will get free upgrades to the last day your device is running  at not extra charge  ...

    As far as I know, Microsoft never actually confirmed this. Do you have a reference to somewhere where they officially stated this?

     

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249

    $699 PSCC6 +Lightroom $149  year cost with Adobe cloud I am subscribed too is $119.88 so I will have to pay 7 years to equal the full package so it is cheap if you use it to work with and not just for hobby 

    The price for Adobe CS6 Master Collection for Windows Full Retail Edition is $2.899 now go and pay separate for each Master Collection future version it will cost you a lot more in the end as there are not lifetime upgrades included .

    Gedd said:

    ? ... Not a for/against subscriptions services point here but rather trying to keep facts straight... The monthly subscription rate is $50 for the full package which = $600 year... The last price I saw to purchase the Master Collection when it was still new was well into the thousands, close to $4k U.S. in fact. Since one can only get it through 3d party software companies now, much of which is grey market, and it is years old, one can't compare the 'cheep' prices one finds on the net as a vaild comparison for pricing. Grey market goods do have their own hidden costs which I won't go into.

    Ivy said:

    I'm interested in knowing. Do you use Adobe products? are you using creative cloud or creative suite?  Do you know after one years time paying for all the creative cloud serves  you would have paid them enough for the stand alone master collection creative suite cs6,

     

  • MEC4DMEC4D Posts: 5,249

    I tried to love win10 but it does not worked for me , I run the same Nvidia driver right now on my win8.1 pro as I used on win10 and everything working as it should with my cards , so until they synchronize the system and drivers together I am not going to upgrade , I spend over $3 K on my system so not going to settle for half performance  just to have some bubble windows and menu , I have it already without upgrading, and since I am not a gammer and DS don't support Direct12 or my other programs I work with  there is not even reason for me to upgrade, I have my WIN phone and tablet that will take more advance of it but not my workstation as it is used just for work and not for fun .

    If they fix it all I will of course upgrade , I still have time until next year .

    and btw Win7 support will end in January 2020 as security patches will not longer be provided .

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