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A tool is a tool. Not everyone needs all the tools possible.
There are some products for G9 that look really nice, a couple of hairs come to mind that are not already available. I actually dont see much difference in a render with G8 or G9. My only deal was that I'm not going to buy all the rehash that pops up every generation. Once you have a hundred characters, of any generation, do you really need 100 more, especially when you can spin your own just buying a couple morph packages?
Now you can even use G2,3,8 skins on G9 ... so why not use Skin Builder and knock yourself out?
Just gonna tap in as well and say Iggy is right with her assessment.
As another long term PA, the sales number over the years really show how well each generation was adopted.
I don't understand how you can say there is no big change between G8 and G9, from a character creation point of view there are huge changes. But if it seems like there are not big changes going on from a customer side of things, then that says how well G9 was made. If you cannont even see all the changes and things still work like you "expect" them to in spite of all the change, then that is a real good thing for customers.
Also want to point out, "compatability" with previous generations also severely limits how many changes/improvements can be put into a figure. If you have to dumb stuff down to a previous generation, then there is not much use in making a new one. The fact that there are alot of converters to help bring previous generation products over to the new figure have come a long way to bridge even that gap. G9 then not only improves on previous generations but doesnt make previous library assets totally obsolete.
Gentles all, please chill a little.
I don't really admire much of what I see for G9, and am not likely to go for it any time soon, mostly due to reasons of cost combined with the type of content being offered being largely irrelevant to me. But I'm happy to accept that other people disagree with me - it wouldn't be the first time that I'm wrong. Or, conversely, that those who disagree with me have been wrong. Time will tell. It will be interesting to observe.
Regards,
Richard.
Genesis 9 is outperforming previous generations when they were at the same point in their release timeline. To me that indicates that it will be the most successful generation released up to now.
Renderosity sold V4 characters for a LONG time after Genesis came out so using them as an indicator of success for Genesis 9 is maybe not the most accurate. Its a different market segment - and you can be in top sellers with a much lower number of sales than here at Daz.
Use what you like to render with - there's so many products for previous generations, it will take a while for anyone to buy them all up :)
I guess end users might never understand PAs' point of view. Out of curiosity I do want to see sales figures although I don't think I can do so.
I couldn't agree more. There's no need to ridicule people.
Agreed. And aren't PAs going to ba a bit biased, as customers no we don't have access to data therfore we can not verify statements that are made.
There is no reason a PA would be biased...we simply follow the money.
We are also customers as well, with all the same issues.
The reason we comment here is to help share the data we do have to help sort through any misconceptions with what facts that we can share.
I haven't had a problem with G9. The faces are a magnitude better than previous versions. The body bends don't look that bad to me (but then pretty much all my figures are clothed...lol. Might be different if that weren't the case). If G9 isn't for you, that's perfectly OK, but you'll have to deal with the inevitability that sooner or later new content for earlier versions will dry up. Having said that, I think I have enough content for EVERY Genesis generation (except maybe the first - I didn't come to DS from Poser until Genesis 2) to keep me busy for the rest of my life. And I still use earlier Genesis characters from time to time and don't really think anything of it. If I want a monster, I use G1. If I want a stylized figure, G2 fits the bill. There are some G3 characters that I really love (some by Raiya and Elijah is a fave). Of course, I have TONS of G8/8.1 content to choose from. But I use G9 a lot too. I can do things with the faces that I could never seem to do with G9 and come out with a realistic looking human. But Christian 8, Dasan 8, Wolfgang 8, Floyd 8 and Ollie 8 still get a lot of use ;).
FWIW, I agree with the PA's about backwards compatibility with a new figure. Sure it's nice and I'll take it...lol, but it holds back advances in the tech that I would probably appreciate a lot better. I have always felt this way and in the end, this is what drove me from Poser to DS. I begged them to leave backwards compatibility behind in order to advance the program and characters but got the same old same old. It's not a cheap hobby for sure, but few are ;).
I like every generation of Daz figures. Everything from the V4/M4 era and newer is a great figure, in my opinion, and I have had great results no matter which I choose. I just use what I like for the particular scene. If it's Victoria 4 in one scene, and Michael 7 in another, or both in the same scene, who cares? I like them all.
New content maybe, but this store alone has 13777 products for G8/G8.1, even at $1 a piece it will take some time and money to dry up this well
Very true. Even of the things I've bought for Genesis 8, I think I probably couldn't use them all before I die. LOL
I just want to point out that I am not against breaking some compatibility if the improvements are big enough. I just don't think the improvements are big enough to warrant breaking all compatibility. At least with Genesis 3 to 8 it was easier to make the move, even though G8 was not a big jump at all. (And I still question why we needed G8 in the first place, but whatever.)
What I am saying is that if we must break things, then the new thing must be better in every possible way. Not just for PAs. From my perspective, I do not see it enough in Genesis 9 to make me want to leave the almost 6 years of content I created for Genesis 8. That is what a new model has to do, it has to really wow me to get me on board. I do make some models as well, sculpting and texturing some things. I still don't see the big deal. G9 has more polys, yet I cannot sculpt a belly button. Perhaps that sounds ridiculous to some of you, but it is still a fact. To get the best details you still need a normal or displacement map, unless you are a PA with access to the HD import. So the extra polygons are like a very small bone for a hungry dog.
That's another thing. Genesis 8 ran 5 full years. The first 3 Genesis generations combine for just 6. Genesis 8 nearly matches the first 3 put together. Things are different than they were in 2017. There are more people using Daz Studio, and more people actually know what Daz and Genesis are today. Technology has rapidly advanced, and even though the GPU market went crazy for a while, a 3060 nearly doubles a 1080ti performance in Iray, the fastest GPU in 2017, for half the price and 100+ fewer Watts of power. 3D rendering has never been more accessible to the public.
What improvements do I want? I want skin that deforms like skin. I want posing to have an AI element that knows how muscles move as a bone moves and how expressions distort the face, so you don't need a thousand JCMs clogging up the runtime. These things are hard, but that would be real innovation. Epic's Metahuman is freaking wild, and while it is very limited in what you can do with them, it gives us a taste of what can be done. Until Daz can give us that kind of innovation, they need to just tweak Genesis instead of breaking all forms of compatibility.
Oh, I am so with you on every single point.
Please remember to address the topic (which is "Is NEW content still being made for Pre-Genesis 9 characters (G8, G3, etc)? Or now that G9 is out the earlier releases are done with?" - the thread has strayed into discussions of G9 and we already have a thread for this; splitting it makes it easy to repeat arguments and difficult to follow which thread covered what) and please don't address the posters themselves.
...true, there is that,. Not much into skimp, horror, or medieval stuff. Mostly contemporary and some "period" clothing (as fashions often tend to recycle over the decades) and sci-fi based content (as long a the latter isn't "armour" that leaves the easiest target to hit, the belly, bare.
...not that I've noticed.
Remember that G2 used different weight mapping than G3 and onward. G2 was not subdivided the same as G3 in the parameters tab and the rigging is slightly different. For example there is only only one bone for the neck (instead of upper and lower) two bones for the feet (just foot and toes instead of foot, metatarsals and toes), and two metatarsal regions on the hands instead of four. Finally G2 was also has a "heavier" polygon weight than G3. the latter which as I mentioned uses the same base body mesh as G8. The major differences between 3 and 8 are the face rigging and the default pose.
I use autofit for clothing and "wearables"., I only manually fit hair as simply autofitting it messes up the movement and styling morphs and with long hair, it often introduces an unsightly "kink" at the neck level, not sure why. While there are conversion scripts I've been manually fitting hair between generations ever since i started in this 15 years ago and don't find it a bother.
...interesting assessment.
I started in this when Gen3 and 4 were the "latest and greatest
I'm now one of those who is perfectly content with 3 and 8 as I have a large resource to draw from for developing my own custom characters. Originally I was not interested in adopting G8 as I saw little in the way of a major advancement like 3 was to 2 so I hesitated for a while as it also became tiring and expensive having to "retool" every two years (I hadno Idea G8 was going to last as long as V4) However, what caught my eye was the greater diversity in new figures and characters beyond the core Daz "stable" (Vicky, Mike, Aiko, Josie, et al). I had wished there had been such interesting and diverse characters for G3 and even earlier generations.
I also discovered that G8 given its incredibly wide variety of different characters, shapes, and resource content, solved a number of vexing issues I had with previous generations for developing certain types of characters. The fact there is a reasonable amount of similarity between 3 and 8 (which originally turned me away) I realised it was a perfect platform for expanding my custom character development work (particularly with Zev0's Xtransfer which will also transfer morphs imported into G3 through GenerationX giving me what I refer to as oone heck of a "gene pool" to work with)
Another part Part of my reluctance this time around is also due to the fact I no longer am working and am on a meagre fixed pension, so even more, I have to watch what I purchase to make sure it will be something that will be used for my illustration and story work. With prices not just here going up, it is bewcoming more and more difficult to keep up anymore.
3D graphics is unlike other more "tangible" hobbies due to the EULA that doesn't allow one to resell or "trade in" digital assets. When you are coupon clipping before your next grocery trip, and looking for other ways to economise, the thought of "dumping" what has become a hefty investment made over the years for the next new "shiny" seems a frightful waste, so one somtimes has to step back and make the best of what he or she has.
BTW I also avoided 8.1 because of the incompatibilities it had even with G8. If anything feels like a "beta", it is 8.1.(for G9).
[...apologies for all the edits but it's very late (04:00)]
There's enough potential with G8, that it'll sustain me until Daz3D rolls out Genesis 10.
This thread has been trimmed to remove posts that were addressing other psoters rather than the topic. Please keep the discussion civil.
You've been kinda silent, release-wise. I wish you'd make more stuff. You are one of my favorite vendors and definitely underrated, I think, because you're so versatile. Anyway, thanks.
+1
Well, if the store will keep rolling more of the same as it was with G3 and G8 then really there won't be any reason for me to move away from G8+ "good enough" zone because how many battle skirts, combat heels and glamour outfits one might need? Very much all permutations of this were already made, so... \_(^_^)_/
Also, when it comes to cheesake and beefcake shots, G8 also is going to cover this better because this generation is more stylized and modellish than G9.
But that's far less about G9 and far more about the store tendencies.
Can I make that a +100?
FWIW, I am not tied to any one generation. Will use what I need, when I need it. And I bought into MD, now if I could just find the time to really dig in and learn it.
Well, well.
Yeah, talk about sneaky. That package flew so fast into my cart it squeaked.
Mary
The more hair shaders the merrier and I never was disappointed with SloshWerks hair shaders.
It's always hard to match hairstyles from different PAs with different texturing styles in same image.
There is another G3/8/9F pose set out. I don't know if G8 poses usable with G8.1, since I skipped the latter.
Looks like most of the new products for G3 will be pose sets.
https://www.daz3d.com/nature-muse-for-genesis-9-genesis-8-females-and-genesis-3-females
Genesis 8 poses, except for expressions (by default), will work on Genesis 8.1
I`ve always dove into the newest generations, but I tried messing around with G9 on my buddy`s computer and Im still not impressed with it and can see no use for it in it`s present incarnation.
As a working adult artist, I find that G9 looks terrible nude. Even with 3rd party enhancements and HD morphs, it`s really hard , if not imposible (to my audience/clients standards of my work) to get it`s shape to look natural, and stuff like joints just don`t look right.
If the figure is clothed, then no problem, it looks great.
But unfortunately, majority of my art is nude.
I do hope that G8 and 8.1 continues to be supported by PAs at least in some capacity.
But if not, im pretty sure I have all I need for G8/8.1 to continue my work.
When G9 came out I had the feeling of a stop-gap. We had a teaser about DAZ 5 (what is it - 2 years ago at least?) and my thoughts were that G9 might keep the market alive until DAZ 5 and a whole new concept will be ready for the daylight. I invested heavily in V4 way back when, and the next figure that came close (in spending terms for me) has been G8. If I look at my Content Library I have so very little for G1,2 or 3. I have none for G9 at present and am still of the opinion that G8 will suffice until DAZ 5 and the possibility of a radical new concept in 3D figures comes with it (one can always dream). I really don't care what the market data says. Indeed, I'm constantly amazed that people are so willing to throw money at new figures and the associated add-ons which are all repeats of those they already have for the previous figure.