Confused with all the figures names: Genesis, Victoria...
funwrestling
Posts: 34
I just discovered the Daz world a few days ago.
I understand that Genesis 3 is the latest female figure. Before was Genesis 2, and before again Genesis. I have read in some posts people advising to stick to Genesis 2 instead of Genesis 3, esp to find much more materials available.
I would like to understand the Pros and Cons of using Genesis 3: will I get better rendering quality than when using Genesis 2, or is the quality related to the skin materials anyway? Well, what are the pros of Genesis 3?
I also read names like Victoria and others. What are they? Just illustrations of what you can do with Genesis 2 and 3? Or completely different models coming from the Poser world? If so, again, what are the pros and cons of using them?
How would you compare Genesis 3 Vs Victoria 7 Vs Genesis 2?
Related question: whatever the model I use, can I use them to create black or Asian characters, or do I need to download special characters being already from that "ethny/race"?
Sorry for my naive questions but I guess your answers will help many people at the same time.
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Comments
Well if you are going to be creating some sort of WWF game or exporting to any other app but Cararra then Genesis 3. If Cararra animations then Genesis 2.
Try to buy everything you can for Genesis 3 though because Cararra is supposed to eventually support Genesis 3. You'll find clothing and hair made for older versions of DAZ characters will work with Genesis 3 if you buy the needed 'conversion scripts' in the DAZ Store. Some, like Genesis 2 clothing, needs no conversion scripts to buy to work with Genesis 3 because they are included with DAZ Studio.
Which you personally prefer looks wise comes done to your personal taste.
No, you won't get better render quality with the G3 characters.
Genesis 1-3 are the base characters, each with different "skills". Victoria and all the other characters are morphs and additional skins.
You can create your 'own' characters by usining the morphs that the Genesis characters come with, though for better result, buying a morph is recommended. Also, you can make your own skins, but it might not give you the result you are looking for.
This zhread might be interesting to you: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/24257/daz-3d-human-figures-a-history/p1
Genesis 3 will probably give better bending, though there are more helper tools available for Genesis 2 to make up the difference.
For wrestling holds you need the better bending which will give you better animation and better renders.
Thank you everyone for your helpful replies.
Why better bending with Genesis 3? Where does it come from?
I guess Genesis has a more "detailed rig" (I hope I'm using the right terminology), I mean, more articulations in her skeleton to speak like people in the street. Am I right? Or is this extended bending capability of Gen 3 related to something else?
Morphs.
I'm not sure yet what morphs are and how they work when I read "for better result, buying a morph is recommended"
If buying a morph gives better results, how then do you select your morph? What are the criteria?
Once bought, can I easily updated the figures in my existing wrestling scenes with the new morph?
A precision on my wrestling scenes
My goal is to generate standstill pictures, photo-like rendering of wrestling scenes. I want them to be very aesthetic, like fashion shots if you will.
I'm not familiar with Cararra and have no intention to create animation at this stage.
Yes, there are several extra bones that help with posing (though there are also some extra bones that are there because of the way the new rigging works - limbs are split into bend and twist bones where previously there would have been only one bone). Also the way in which the deformations are calculated does a better job at avoiding some issues, and there are correction morphs which kick in automatically to deal with others.
Morphs are shapes, they alter the way the mesh looks - they can be used in all sorts of ways (I mentioned above that there are morphs in the base figure that subtly alter the shape in response to a bend), but I think what was being referred to was things like the Head and Body Morph packs which allow you to change the appearance of the figure to make different characters.
I'm sorry, I explained badly. Regarding morphs, what I meant was that the base characters only come with a handful of morphs.
For example, the basic addition package of morphs that will give you extra shaping "power", for G3M, would be these two:
From the images that come with the product, you can see that they give you a wider variation than what you can do if you simply load G3M and go to the "shaping" tab. Of course, there are other, specialized morph packs, like these ones:
If you dial a character just by using the shaong dials that come with Genesis 3 Male, you might not be able to achieve the particular look/shape you are aiming at. The morph packages are offering additional options to give the character the look you are aiming for.
DAZ has a few "main" characters that have remained through various generations. Victoria, Michael, Stephanie, etc. Each new generation has a number: Victoria 1, Victoria 2, Victoria 3, Victoria 4, etc. Sometimes DAZ introduces a new character that will "jumpstart" the Generation number. David 3, David 5 are examples. David didn't have a version 1, 2 or 4. David might not go beyond David 5.
Genesis arrived, and we saw a "dual designation" for characters. Victoria 5 is a Genesis "generation 1" character. Victoria 6 is a Genesis 2 Female. David 5 is Genesis "generation 1." Again we see a "generation leap" with some characters. Lee 6, Scott 6. There were no previous versions. Move on to Genesis 3. We have Victoria 7, Michael 7, Ivan 7, etc.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/24257/daz-3d-human-figures-a-history/p1
You may want to look at Renderosity. They have wrestling morphs and props.
https://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/?search=wrestling
"DAZ has a few "main" characters that have remained through various generations...."
Aha !! eg Genesis 2 is 'x4+2' so V6/M6 etc
Many, Many Thanks, Ron !!
Returning to Poser after a decade away, armed with some CD-ROMs and a couple of zip-filled, slide-mount drives left from my P4 days, the zoo of modern folk came as a shock. Didn't help that a lot of modellers muddled DAZ 'Generation' and 'Genesis' by abbreviating both to 'Gen'...
D'uh...
Took me much, much longer than planned to fund, build and commission my new CAD Tower, but it now has an 8-core AMD, 32 GB, twin graphics cards and three 1600x900 19" screens. PoserPro, TurboCAD, D!S etc all want to live on C: alongside Win'10, which ruled out an SSD. E: is work-space and library, F: local back-ups, G: empty slide-mount and our Synology NAS slumbers behind screen#3.
Remembering my totally tangled, haplessly sprawling P4 library, I've taken the time to plan logical 'External Runtimes' before installing stuff. Your explanation has combed out my confusion.
I'm revising the map as I go, beset by low-flying cats, but can now top-group folk & clothing as, P_4, P11, DAZ_1~2, DAZ_3, DAZ_4, DAZ_G. I'm still collating 'Other' human characters such as AD/MD and the Sixus crew, have yet to tackle the alien zoo, never mind a zillion props & sets...
Again, thank you.
Genesis and Genesis 2 work in Poser with the use of the Dson importer, Genesis 3 and 8 don't work as easily there are methods on how to get them into Poser, you will find the info over at renderosity's forums. There is quite a bit of stuff these days in the Daz store that won't work in Poser, Poser doesn't recognise the duf format DS now uses, some vendors do supply objs which can be imported. Mats will need altering for the render engine you are using Fitrefly or Superfly.
Just a few details:
- DSON importer plugin (which enables you to use .duf files in Poser) is for P9+ only, as weightmapping was introduced in Poser 9.
- IIRC the methods to use G3F / G8F in poser require P11+ as they use a new feature added in P11.
What's even more confusing is when....I am guessing here...you have morphs of morphs. So you'll have "Sally for Suzy" or "John for Bob" or somethign that...agagin guessing....is a morph on a morph. If Sally is a morph on Genesis X, then Suzy is a morph on Sally? Right?
If Suzy is listed as a required product then yes, that means that they started from the Sally shape (maybe dialed at less than 100%) to create Suzy rather than directly from the base Genesis X.
If I were Daz, I'd try to remedy the confusion of this sort of morph on a morph nomenclature. I suppose they have weighed the benefits of a wide open marketplace and the breadth of products that results in, with the confusion of naming and sided on the former.
I think many artists must remember too that Daz probably "phases" out some of the different character version in time. This being that many artists have spent thousands, maybe even millions of hours fashioning their own characters, morphs, clothing, ect.... for sale on the marketplace. Once a version is created, a good company can't just axe that version and tell the customers to move onto the next version because so many artists are still using those versions. For example, many artists still sell to this day, new items for Victoria 4 because they still like that version. Just my take on the matter. Cheers all!