Hardware specs question
Hello. I have been lurking in the forums for a couple of days and I consider giving CG a try, purely as a hobby because I thilled at what can you make.
My first question is about hardware specs. Can someone please tell me what is the most important piece of a PC for giving this a try without losing my mind over extremely long render times? Is it the graphics card, the CPU or the memory (RAM), and what, approximately, would you suggest as a decent starting equipment to someone who is taking his first steps. For example, my PC is quite old for todays standards (bought 4 years ago) and the memory is at 8GB while the CPU is an i5 at 3.1GHz. I will definitely upgrade my graphics card, and getting 8 more GB of RAM isn't a bid deal, but I was hoping that I would replace the CPU at a later time because I might replace the entire rig at some point. Would that work? Thanks.
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For iray, the GPU and its memory probably matter the most for rendering. Other aspects of the system will affect usability while creating your scene however.
The upgrades that you have suggested would both be good ideas (without knowing what your current graphics card is). Sixteen GB of RAM is generally the minimum recommended nowadays, so you will be good there. Insofar as the graphics card is concerned, if you wish to use DAZ Studio and Iray rendering with the graphics processor, then you will need an Nvidia-based card. You should look for something with a minimum of 4 GB of onboard graphics memory along with as many CUDA cores as possible. Insofar as the CPU is concerned, the i5 will suffice, especially if you are using the GPU for rendering. Upgrading to an i7 (if you can find one), will only gain you hyperthreading - that would give you eight virtual CPU cores instead of the four actual cores that the i5 uses. The extra virtual cores will really only make a big difference if the CPU is being used to render. Of course you could use the 3Delight render engine to get started instead of Iray, with the former using your CPU.
Thank you both for the replies. Not having to change CPU at this point is a relief as I plan to replace the entire system next year.
Taking into consideration your replies, here's my second question. With the minimum recommended of 16GB and a GPU of 4GB (let's say GTX1050 Ti 4GB) what render times should I expect for a scene with 2 characters and a simple background (again, let's say it shows 2 people standing in a room)? Obviously, I assume that not all scenes are the same and that even different character attires may add to that time so I'm just asking for average times.
Also, how big an improvement would I expect to see if I went for 32GB RAM and a GTX1060 (6GB) or even a GTX1080 (8GB). Would the of 2-4GB of GPU RAM make a noticable difference or are we talking about 10-20%?
I'm doing my stuff on an Alienware 17 R4 4k screen laptop. It's got a GTX 1080 card in it two 2TB SSD Drives, 32gig Ram. By Thursday of next week it will have the graphics amplifier and an ASUS ROG GTX1080TI card in the graphics amplifier. These cards will piggy back so it's going to be shot of big time power. Like mentioned earlier, and I truly believe this, don't skimp on the graphics card. Performance is everything and waiting around for renders to complete is really not a lot of fun. I started with DAZ on a seven year old 17" Dell laptop. Everything was CPU rendered. It was painful, but I learned a lot. If you start the way I did and get serious, like I did, performance will become king. Take your time and play with it. Build your dream system if you get serious. There is a lot to learn.
Have fun!
Scott
More memory on your GPU will allow you to do larger scenes. As far as I understand it, as soon as you run out of memory, it then kicks into using the CPU instead and then you can expect to wait a long time, so the more you have the better.
I don't plan on doing large scenes. At least for now :). I have some plans for a mobile app, and using the renders in that is why I started investigating the option to use the renders in place of art. Now some of them will about the size of artwork you find on card games, while some may be background-size. Either way I doubt the resolution will be higher than 1024x****, or perhaps around 2048x****, if I plan for a pad version. The scenes will also be fairly simple with 1-3 characters and a relatively simple background so that drops the requirement bar even lower. All that as a part of my newly developed hobby (app creation) and not a professional approach. Knowing me I know I will get passionate if I am happy with the initial results and I will probably start getting mroe and more involved, but I will deal with that if/when it happens.
As there are some unexpected expenses to deal with in the next few months, and having now idea how this will play out, I think I will go for a GTX 1060 6GB for now, and if I want to upgrade I'll just give the 1060 to my little sister - both of our PCs are outdated in the GPU department so I won't even mention what they have now, out of shame. :)
Instead of opening a new topic, and seeing how the title of this one is generic, I will ask here 2 more questions about hardware.
1. I have a 120GB SSD which I have not installed yet (to house the OS) because I didn't want to deal with a clean install of W7, but unfortunately it is time for that to happen and it coincides with me getting interested in Daz3d. My first thought was to use the SSD only for the OS, Daz3d and a few more programs, and install everything else (which in the past I used to install in the Program Files folder) into one of my two 1TB HDD. I have read that the SSD will speed up the process, but on the other hand some have mentioned that photo, video and 3D rendering/editors put storage under a lot of pressure, and SSDs are not really ideal for constant writing/deleting of files. What is your suggestion?
2. Right now I have 2x4GB of RAM. Before I decided to expore 3D rendering as a potential hobby I was planning to go with 16 GB with a posibility to upgrade to 32 GB in the future, but after reading comments and suggestions in this forum, it seems that moving in the 32-64 GB area is more ideal for someone who wants to be serious about this. However seeing how my other heavy-duty needs involve only gaming, for which 16-32GB is enough, I decided to first test the performance with only 16GB and upgrade if I see it is necessary. So although my first thought was to go for 2x8GB, after deciding that 64GB was a possibility, 1x16GB seems more reasonable as most motherboards offer only 4 RAM slots. So I wonder if the performance boost that other applications see from using a dual channel RAM configuration will be something that affects a lot Daz3d rendering as well, or if it will be barely noticeable.
This post ended up being way longer than what I anticipated, so I'll stop here and let those who are interested share their experiences.
In answer to your two questions, here are my personal opinions:
1. I agree with your thoughts on limiting your SSD to the OS and applications, not only to limit the number of write/erase cycles, but also to prevent it from being quickly filled, as 120 GB may be more than adequate for OS and apps, it is too small for graphics content storage. I would also move all the caches and temporary storage locations associated with the operating system and programs off the SSD onto mechanical storage as well - i.e. browser cache, etc.
2. You need to keep in mind the type of RAM your current system is using. Is it DDR3 or DDR4? If it uses DDR3, whatever you buy for your current system may not be useable for a new one. In my opinion, you are looking for a cost-effective solution for your current needs to tide you over until you replace that system. You also need to realize that the amount of ram that your current system can support is limited by several factors:
a) your motherboard/chipset - check the manual for the maximum. The number of RAM slots increases your options, but is not necessarily the definitive factor.
b) your operating system - again, check the documentation
c) your processor/memory controller - yet again check the documentation.
Usually it will be the motherboard that will limit your options/maximum RAM supported.
Relative to the 2 x 8 versus 1 x 16 decision, remember that you need paired RAM modules for dual channel operation (and four for quad channel operation if that is supported) Single modules will work, but at the cost of some performance. Whether you will notice the difference or not is almost completely subjective.
Thanks for the feedback. I will take your advice into consideration before making my final decision.