My Final DIM Solution: I Cheated
Ron Knights
Posts: 1,763
I have 17 years worth of DAZ stuff. I started to manually install everything, but was quickly exhausted. I decided to divide my stuff into various categories, each with its own "Runtime collection." I created DAZ People, Genesis People, Animals, Scenes. I manipulated DIM in order to get many resources ihto the proper collections.
This job wasn't easy. DIM's search function is lacking. I can't get all the Genesis files by searching for the word "Genesis." That's because not all the Genesis products have the word "Genesis" in their names! I kept going until I had everything the way I wanted. Then I made copies of each collection. DAZ Animals was copied and renamed Ron Animals, etc. I used the copies to move things around the way I wanted. Everything went well until I found some more items, and tried to install them. DIM doesn't want you to have the same items in more than one place.
I tried fixing the problem by fiddling about, uninstalling and reinstalling. That didn't work. I finally gave up and just installed all the DAZ stuff into one folder. But I kept the collections where I had everything rearranged, In essence, the DAZ Install folder is a lame duck, designed to ignore DIM and keep it out of my way!
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Comments
http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/install_manager/referenceguide/interface/filter_field/advanced_filtering
Chohole, thanks for the link. However that is way too complicated for me. That's been one of my chief concerns with this whole DIM thing. DAZ turned art into a technical pursuit, which stifles my creativity.
The DAZ Install Manager is great — I was much more exhausted by having to manually install content using InstallerVISE or BitRock installers and accept ToS agreements individually on every product back in the day... I just wish there was more quality control with how installations are handled for all products installed by DIM.
Ideally, using DIM exclusively I shouldn't have such a mess of Lost & Found items — but I do. I think there is a quality control problem on product installations and metadata associated with many products.
We all desperately need a more intelligent content library manager on the client side — one that weeds out duplicate files, generates proper metadata as needed, makes corrections, and assists with making any and all installed content into "Smart Content". I wish there was some clean up utility, that could do some kind of look up on a master database, and even correct improper installations.
I mentioned it before, in another thread... if you're moving files around, except for multiple libraries you're doing it wrong.
Categories.
Categories give you the same directory tree structure as the libraries, but are more flexible and don't break any functionality by moving files around. Additionally, for some items it makes sense to items in multiple categories which is easily done.
That's how I do it too. Not perfect, but I use Categores to gather stuff like Police.
Runtimes: Genesis and Above, 4th Gen and Below, Animals & Stand Alones, Places and Things, Utilities, (Plus Renderosity and Freebies from Other sites)
People who already get the folder structures and what you can and can't move around probably aren't going to pay $45 for two hours of "hey I knew that."
I mean, that tutorial purports to clear up the hugely confusing question of when to use DIM over the CMS (there is no situtation where you could ever use both and get confused)...
...how to make your content show up in the category you want it to (right click, Categorize)...
...how to move a ReadMe file into a different folder (ell oh freaking ell)...
...what to do with downloaded zips (exactly the same thing as before the DIM existed, delete after installation or back up).
This kind of stuff is stuff that a lot of people just don't find complicated.
You should never have to copy files and make your own thumbnail to use the CMS, only to set up your own content, so I don't know where they went with that.
Yeah, this is a huge problem for categorizing old content into different runtimes. I think it wasn't until Genesis 2 that DAZ started to consistently put "for X" in the name. And even then some products will say "for Michael 7" instead of "for Genesis 3" so you have to look out for that; luckily it only happens with the DAZ flagship figures.
One thing that can help is after the search sorting by package date. It's not perfect but it can get your stuff mostly ordered by generation.
Sorry you wound up having to throw your stuff all into one folder. I find the default DAZ folder structures okay especially for figures but it's nice to have certain things split apart for the oddballs like buildings when you don't know intuitively if they're going to wind up in props, environments, wherever.
I've spent hours working on Categories, only to be unable to find stuff. I buy the stuff, I shouldn't need to put in all that work just so I can find it. Oh wait, do you have to pay money for a 2 hour video on Content Manager? When I buy a TV, I don't need to pay money for the manual. I haven't seen a really good software tutorial since I stopped making my own and uploading them to YouTube!
I've reached the point where I accept that DAZ won't make things any easier. I only went through all this trouble because I'd told myself I was done with DAZ, and deleted my Content installations. Then I changed my mind and wanted to reinstall everything. I like to share my experience.
PS: Categories is NOT the ultimate solution. In fact, it's pretty unreliable.
If you guys honestly believe it's reasonable to install content, then go in to each part of your content (characters, poses, materials, etc.), and figure out content folders for every type of content, then manually categorize each component of each piece of content, and then for OBJ files and non-store stuff make thumbnails so you can see what the OBJ is (unlike some apps which show you a preview of the OBJ), and then manually categorize each one of those, and for other non-store stuff go thru and manually unzip and then move the contents of ZIP files into the correct spot and gather documents and so on manually, and on and on, then I guess we'll have to disagree. Because to me it's insane.
All I can figure is people have gotten used to the madness over the years and now it's second nature, but that doesn't make it reasonable. And if you guys can actually explain the intricacies of DAZ Connect (or what it even is), or all of the PostgreSQL and Valentina stuff you're supposed to know about, and all of the menu items you need to refresh the database, and when to do what, then I'm in awe. But I'm gonna guess that most people have no clue.
I never make thumbnails. I never bother with stuff like Geometry files, etc. If I manully install stuff, I leave Geometries and textures where they are. I've been manually installing stuff since at least 2003.
Here's the way I see it. I'd worked in the clerical field since the 1980s. I worked with a small staff of other workers to organize the Voting records of 250,000 voters in the City of Minneapolis, MN. We worked hard to sort and file the original registration cards, and duplicate cards. We filed each card where it belonged so we could find it later. DAZ's approach is equivalent to throwing all the cards on the floor, and telling you to sort things out all alone. No, wait it's even worse. At least the City of Minneapolis clerks labeled each card properly. DAZ doesn't use any sort of consistency or rhyme or reason to label their products.
For OBJ's I need to make thumbnails or else I'll forget real quick exactly what the OBJ is. So I have to import into a special scene with the right background and lighting that I use for just this purpose, then save it as a scene/prop asset or whatever that is (I always forget), then do a iray 3d view render and use W10 snip tool to save an image for the thumbnail, and then have to associate the PNG with the new duf in the correct location. Or something like that. And that goes for every single OBJ I have, and so far I'm only about 1/3 of the way thru. Huge pain.
I don't care about the databases, smart content, DAZ Connect, etc. I don't use them. Smart Content, the few times I tried it, was no better than the regular Content Library for me. Connect simply is not something I want to mess with, as it's just another way to install content and I'm more than comfortable with DIM. I even tried using categories, but found they weren't really enough different than what the default Content Library layout was once I was done to bother with updating every time I installed a new product.
I use an external file system of thumnails. Not really thumbnails, more of using the promo photo of each item, tucking it into a fils system where I feeel it fits, and naming it exactly like content library. So, if I look for a T-rex, I look under animal - sauropods, find the picture, read the name, look for that name in content library.
I need a western saloon? Look under environment - wild west.
There are things I would never find again without these visual clues, Sometimes I know I have something, but can't find it, because i don't remember the right name, and DAZ puts it into a categorieI never think of. My visual library is my lifeline.
Hey, whatever works for you!
I have been manually mapping out my whole 3D collection into a Google Sheet, organized into the following fields: Thumbnail, Order #, Date, Product Name, Published Artist, Compatibility/Required, SKU, List Price, Purchase Price and Category.
Google Sheet thumbnails can be added with this cool little snippet function...
=image("url-of-thumbnail-image-here.jpg",1)
With 13 years of content purchases from Daz3D so far, it's taken me many months of obsessive cataloguing during my commutes to/from work and many many late nights, and it's still incomplete by several months but very close to completion... 11,417 catalogued so far, from June 2004 through May 2017.
I've nearly given up on Daz Studio many times... I totally agree the organization system needs work. I really wish there was a rock solid way to automate the content library / runtime cleanup process... DIM doesn't always install things correctly, but manual installs from zip files are very tedious when you're dealing with thousands of files.
In the age of machine learning/artificial intelligence, I feel like it's not far from being possible to have some artificial intelligence manage the mundane processes of cataloguing and organizing content appropriately and automatically without much intervention required by end users.
Kaleb242, I'm glad you found something that works for you. I don't bother to catalog anything. I just make sure I can find everything. If necessary, I rename some items for a better description. I remove the long names on poses, etc. I have a folder for Props, one for Scenes. The Genesis people are in one collection, and the rest of the people are in another collection. Everthing is arranged nice and neat. It's like looking into a filing cabinet. I can see what is there.. and there is no need to make thumbnails, etc.
Not even the PAs are consistent. I was looking in my content library for a product that I barely remembered was called "Two Creeks", and I couldn't remember the artist's name. A search turned up nothing for "two creeks" and "twocreeks", so I had to hunt for and reload an old scene that used it. In the scene tab, it was listed as fb_TwoCreeks-ground. I finally realized that the "fb" part was First Bastion, so I looked under First Bastion, FirstBastion, and finally found it as "1stBastion's Wilderness: Two Creeks"!
I wish DAZ would come up with a naming convention that would be somewhat logical, to make it easier to find stuff. Too often not even the product name matches the name in the content library.
When I install from other sites, I always create a product that will be easy to find. All of my shaders are in "S", such as "Shaders - Tom's Military Paint" or "Shaders - Parrotdolphin Leather", and my characters are under "G", such as "G1 Teresa" or "G3F Amillu". Clothing goes in "C", "Clothing G3F Jeans".
But DAZ's naming conventions make no sense at all, and make things unnecessarily difficult for us, the customer.
Our time is valuable, too - now if we could just get DAZ and the PAs to understand that.
I keep a catalog of promo images also, but sometimes the promo name doesn't match the content library name.
Yeah, if you have to pay for it, no thanks. I doubt I'd watch it if it were free, it's like sitting around watching a youtube video on how to change your tire...I already know how to change a tire.
Yeah, it is what it is. The Poser world is no better. It's a mishmash of many different PA's, and they are all not consistent. As you mentioned default Daz figures are pretty good here. People aren't always consistent. Heck, I notice like a few of my own customized things got categorized into two close but not identical categories/locations.
I think it's interesting how some DIM supporters respond. It's like we're lookiing at totally different things. Another thing I find unsettling is Scenes. You might find scenes under Props, Architecture, etc. Or you might not. Expressions might be listed under Poses, or under Expressions. Some products are listed with the PA's name or initial first. Let's say a character's name is Jeff. You might find it listed as ZZJeff. That totally throws off alphabetical sorting. Sometimes I stumble into some things that I hadn't used for years because I couldn't find them!
I feel your pain. I get aggravated when a product title doesn't indicate whether it's a texture pack or an original product. I go looking in my content because I know I have a texture pack somewhere, just don't know where and end up looking in my product library to find it and it's required product then go back and find it in my content. I recently started creating a database with all my purchases here and elsewhere with the original promo photos attached and categories I understand. It's a long tedious project, but when done, a simple query will bring up what I'm looking for (hopefully works, I'm still a newbie at database creation).
It's unfortunately the nature of the beast. It's a collection of many PA's who don't all organize the same way. It's not relevant to DIM.
Only way around it would be a few folks at Daz re-packaging everything to organize the file structure, but I suspect that would take a lot of time.
Of course it is relevant to DIM. DIM delivers the content. The lack of organization greatly reduces the utility and value of DIM.
I know where 80% of the content I have installed is located, and I use the default files structure (but not the default installation path). The stuff I have trouble finding is environments.
As far as where the content goes, DIM just downloads the packages and unzips them to the library location (either the default, or where you specify - also tracks what is installed and not installed and maybe other stuff but it isn't relevant to what you're discussing). No different than downloading the zip files and extracting them to your library.
What you mean is what I posted above, Daz going through each PA's submission, and moving around files to organize it. That I suspect is a lot of work, like products having to be rebuilt, or a script with extensive QA testing to verify all the functionality.
I get it, it's a pain in the butt. I feel that pain myself, after everything I install I categorize them and when I used Poser, I organized the move able files myself.
Actually I meant just what I said. You can call it semantics if you want. But it seems we agree that it can be a pain to sort things out. Now if you'll pardon me, I still have another few hours trying to find some of DAZ's scattered content before I might be able to actually Make Art!
I think it would help of Daz made the artists drop the vanity product names and had a feature in Daz to search by artist using the meta data because maybe we are looking for First Bastion or Z or Ironman or Sickle... I also think Daz organization would iomprove if the artists named the textures "whatever name the product was, than the model series than the cool name artist created, eg: Sleepwear for Hot Nights G3F - Cooling Down, so if I was looking for sleepwear , Cooling Down would populate. So I bought an outfit, Blazing Saddles G3F then Blazing Saddles G3F - Buckaroo would be some texture for it. I always manually download the files into folders in a naming convention that make sense to me.I feel Daz should have a tighter control, a chokehold on namimg conventions and than maybe DIM would be a shade brighter. I can't tell you how many times I have searched for an item and never found it, but later while searching for a snake, found someting totaly unrelated to the search because the name (unsuited to the product) triggered the find. Naming conventions should be hey this is the product for this model or sderies, - plus some other unrelated briliant name. I have found some bizzare results and did multiple head shakes and thought who the F**k would ever expect to find that in this search. If Daz incorporated naming conventions and standards than there would be predictabilty and the probabiltiy that DIM would work better. Without predictability how can you program any hypothesis? How can you sort the disorderly and why should it be our job?