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Problems with Wonderous Ware on DAZ Studio 4.6.0.18

ruekakaruekaka Posts: 346
edited May 2013 in Daz Studio Discussion

Hello,

The last time I played with the flask from Wonderous Ware was at the time it cames out, so I guess I used DS 4.0.x or DS 4.5.x at this time.
I'm not 100% sure, but I believe what I've done was the same I try now. Placing the flask to the scene (nothing else is there), select the flask, assign the glass material (Glass_03 in this case) and after that assign the liquid mat.

Without anything around it looks not realy briliant, but If I remember correct I got a transparant flask with the fluid visible.

If I do that with the latest version of DS I'm not longer able to get a similar result (please see attached screenshots).

Does anybody else has the same problem (or have an idea what I'm doing wrong)?

Any hint is welcome!

Edit:
The 32Bit version works a bit different than the 64Bit. The non transparent fluids are visible in the render of the 32Bit version of DS.

wonderousware_problem_01.jpg
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Post edited by ruekaka on

Comments

  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 7,232
    edited May 2013

    ruekaka said:
    Placing the flask to the scene (nothing else is there)

    This might be related to your problems. These surfaces rely almost entirely on reflections and refractions, so if there isn't anything else in the scene to reflect or to see through the glass/liquid, it won't look at its best, or might not work at all.

    This also means you might not get away with building half a scene, only adding what's visible in front of the camera. A large shiny reflective surface will show things around and behind the camera, so you'll need a complete 360° scene all around (and above and below).

    Nearly forgot, there's a Ray Trace Depth setting in Render>Render Settings that needs to be at least 2 (for a single reflection) or 4 (for reflections and refractions through a liquid-filled transparent object). If you need reflections of reflections (or more), nudge it up even higher and keep in mind your render time will go through the roof.

    Post edited by SpottedKitty on
  • ruekakaruekaka Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    Thanks for your tips.

    The Max Ray Trace depth setting was the reason it doesn't work. For the normal fluid it's enough to set it to 4, but for the transparent liquids it must be at least 8.

    But now there's another problem. As you can see in the 1:1 screenshot of the rendered image (in the top right) the border of the flask looks a bit eroded.

    Is there a way to make this a bit smoother?

    wonderousware_problem_02.jpg
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  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 7,232
    edited December 1969

    Hmm. Which render method are you using, 3Delight or OpenGL (which is limited to whatever your graphics card is capable of)? The two systems handle many aspects of rendering in very different ways.

    Another possible gotcha is lighting — if you don't add extra lights, all you get is the "ghost" preview light that's slaved to whatever camera you're looking though, and this does limit your options a bit.

    There are other bits and bobs in Render Settings that might cause what you're seeing, some of them have an effect on other settings so it can (and does) get a bit complicated. Can you open your Render Settings tab, stretch it out a bit and scroll down so you can see at least the Advanced tab between "Render Engine" and "Motion Blur", and post a screenshot here?

  • ruekakaruekaka Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    Thanks for your reply.

    I use 3Delight.

    I made a test with 2 additional lights, but it seems to make no difference (need to mention that I'm not a master in lightning).

    The image in the bottom right I made with "Progressive Rendering" active. The result looks much better. But I have read several times that this setting should not be used, so I'm not sure if that could be the final solution.

    wonderousware_problem_03.jpg
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  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited May 2013

    Pixel Samples 16 for X and Y and shading rate of .5 or lower .2 best and a Raytace of 4 6 or 8 should do. Shading rate should never be Higher than 1 for any render except Proof/Preview renders.

    Warning this is a rather HIGH setting but the one that matters the most for time Is Shading Rate. The Lower the longer the render.

    Post edited by Jaderail on
  • ruekakaruekaka Posts: 346
    edited December 1969

    Thanks for your instructions.

    Now the render results are as expected.

    I played a bit with these parameters and as you said the most important one seems to be the Shading rate.

    Thanks again to you both, your information was really helpful.

    wonderousware_problem_04.jpg
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  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 7,232
    edited May 2013

    My usual settings are similar to what you've shown, apart from raytrace and shading rate, which I usually keep at 0.1 or 0.2 unless I'm running a quick test render. Circumstances change, though, and every now and then you'll find one size doesn't quite fit all and you'll need to tweak a few of these settings.

    Edit: one suggestion, I'm gradually getting into the habit of using the Gamma setting to improve the appearance of colour depth (and it really helps a lot in certain lighting situations). Just click it on and, on a Windows system, set the value to 2.2 (I think it's 1.8 for a Mac, but I'm not 100% sure). As always be prepared to fiddle with the settings a little bit — not too much — if it doesn't look quite right.

    Post edited by SpottedKitty on
  • ShaggeShagge Posts: 74
    edited December 1969

    I am trying to figure out something similar i think with the wondrous Wears the glass looks great in 4.6 but no matter what liquid i add to any of the glasses i get a picture that looks like this. Any suggestions?

    glass_test.png
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  • SpottedKittySpottedKitty Posts: 7,232
    edited December 1969

    A lot depends on your scene and lighting setup, and render settings — tiny differences here and there can cause huge changes in the appearance of glass-like materials. What lights are you using, what else is in the scene (the glass must have something to be reflected in it), and can you post a screenshot of your Render Settings Advanced tab?

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited September 2013

    For the BEST glass effects you RENDER the object in the scene. Not post work it in as you have done here. Then the item will reflect the items in the scene and look much better.

    EDIT: And if it was Rendered in it is your Render settings and Surface settings.

    Post edited by Jaderail on
  • ShaggeShagge Posts: 74
    edited December 1969

    For this one I used the glass_22 object and mat, liquid 01 the daz_environment background. (sorry i don't remember the exact file name.) The lighting model i used at the time was Complex global lighting (blueSnowcone).

    Capture.PNG
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  • ShaggeShagge Posts: 74
    edited December 1969

    Jaderail said:
    For the BEST glass effects you RENDER the object in the scene. Not post work it in as you have done here. Then the item will reflect the items in the scene and look much better.

    You'll have to explain that one to me. Because no matter what I do to render the glass object looks good in most renders its the liquid inside that does this blue haze look.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited September 2013

    Ray Trace Depth. Your item has Outside (1) inside (2) a volume, the liquid (3) inside it (4) out sides of it (5,6). So Ray Trace needs a minimum of 6 here. And Possibly (7,8) for best results.

    Post edited by Jaderail on
  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Also Drop your Shading rate from 1.00 to .5 or lower for much better results.

  • ShaggeShagge Posts: 74
    edited December 1969

    I will give it a try. Thank you for the info.

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