Genesis 8.1 / Victoria 8.1

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  • ANGELREAPER1972ANGELREAPER1972 Posts: 4,413
    edited January 2021

    again as others said geo shell stuff wont work so Skin Builder 8 from Zevo and clothing like Sexy Skinz wont work, centaur 8 don't work but RawArt's  Octiana does as does Sickleyield's Merfolk and Spiderfolk haven't tried others yet. Facegen textures work there's a new section in surfaces to cover which is the head which is the back of the head and back of neck use the torso texture for that part, face/lips/ears are still the face texture, fingernails/arms still covered by the arm/hands texture and feet/toenails are still leg texture. and the Facegen head morphs still work too. Other face body shaping morphs from Zev0. and others appear to work fine too. She can also still wear clothing and hair from other generations still too via wear em all and other similar plugins can't remember what they are but I know I have another one or two as well as wear them all plug in. Expressions well mostly no except for some exceptions of sorts in pareameters section can use some dials for parts lilike some smiles like Blue jauntie's characters

    these two renders are using the Gnesis 8.1 base and textures created in Facegen as well as Face morph from Facegen and various morphs for G8F the amazon one has a hair for G3F and armor top/arms from a G2F product

     

    image

     

    image

    Genesis 8-1 Female version of AverageGal338pm160121JMA1972.jpg
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    AverageGal338pm160121JMA1972 amazon on genesis 8.1 female base.jpg
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    Post edited by ANGELREAPER1972 on
  • DVoidDVoid Posts: 40

    Luciel said:

    melissastjames said:

    I purchased Victoria 8.1 and got her loaded up, but I'm not finding any vellus hair? I don't see that listed on her product page as "included" either...but it's listed as a feature of 8.1...so...?

    From the looks of it it's another "anatomy" style product. So is only included in certain things, like the anatomy only being in "pro" bundles. 

    The basic Victoria 8.1 doesn't contain it, but the bundle does, even though the Victoria 8.1 page lists "Fine, short hairs are added to the female face and body" as a feature (which is perhaps a mistake).

    DAZ is notorious for their lazy copypasta if item descriptions for their models and bundles. I once read the description for a character that blatantly had another character's name in it. Not even pretending that it wasn't just copy/pasted. 

  • SotoSoto Posts: 1,438

    HighElf said:

    And I really dislike that the stuck the DAZ Iray PBRSkin Shader exclusive to G8.1. I wish we could use it on other models too, like the UberShader.

    It's not G8.1 exclusive, you can use it on whatever you want, even objects. 

  • skboa said:

    Urich3d said:

    Does anyone know how to get th G8.1 FASC interface to appear?

    It's located under Anatomy in smart content.

    Though it doesn't work for me, often times it just crashes Daz or it just does nothing when I try to move something.

    Trying to drag any of the FACS nodes just crashes DS for me every time as well.

  • Odd_Platypus said:

    skboa said:

    Urich3d said:

    Does anyone know how to get th G8.1 FASC interface to appear?

    It's located under Anatomy in smart content.

    Though it doesn't work for me, often times it just crashes Daz or it just does nothing when I try to move something.

    Trying to drag any of the FACS nodes just crashes DS for me every time as well.

    Which version of DS?

  • evilded777evilded777 Posts: 2,444

    evilded777 said:

    So... where is this new skin shader?

    I downloaded, I loaded 8.1 Female... I even went so far as to apply the materials from Gen 8.1 Female Iray... they aren't any different from the 8 materials.

     

    And please fix that metadata...Power Pose Templates for Genesis 8 Male indeed.

    Found the shader. That was tedious.  This is BETTER? If I don't want to use Dual Lobe Specular, I no longer have a choice? And what about the Reflectance Tint?

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,935

    video

    another dmc attempt, this one is very simple just jaw open on everything and works in 32 bit lipsync

  • LucielLuciel Posts: 475

    DVoid said:

    Luciel said:

    melissastjames said:

    I purchased Victoria 8.1 and got her loaded up, but I'm not finding any vellus hair? I don't see that listed on her product page as "included" either...but it's listed as a feature of 8.1...so...?

    From the looks of it it's another "anatomy" style product. So is only included in certain things, like the anatomy only being in "pro" bundles. 

    The basic Victoria 8.1 doesn't contain it, but the bundle does, even though the Victoria 8.1 page lists "Fine, short hairs are added to the female face and body" as a feature (which is perhaps a mistake).

    DAZ is notorious for their lazy copypasta if item descriptions for their models and bundles. I once read the description for a character that blatantly had another character's name in it. Not even pretending that it wasn't just copy/pasted. 

    I guess the problem in this case is that they're claiming it has things it blatently doesn't, which is dancing into the realms of you know what.  

    So maybe they just made a mistake and it's either not supposed to be a basic feature of victoria 8.1 and genesis 8.1 (as it's also listed as a basic figure feature "Body hair has been added for the male face and body."

    ) or the vellus hair is supposed to be included.

    But yes, they do often make mistakes. laugh

  • Richard Haseltine said:

    Odd_Platypus said:

    skboa said:

    Urich3d said:

    Does anyone know how to get th G8.1 FASC interface to appear?

    It's located under Anatomy in smart content.

    Though it doesn't work for me, often times it just crashes Daz or it just does nothing when I try to move something.

    Trying to drag any of the FACS nodes just crashes DS for me every time as well.

    Which version of DS?

    DS 4.15. Just updated it from 4.12 today, so the very latest general release version.

  • skboaskboa Posts: 59

    Richard Haseltine said:

    Odd_Platypus said:

    skboa said:

    Urich3d said:

    Does anyone know how to get th G8.1 FASC interface to appear?

    It's located under Anatomy in smart content.

    Though it doesn't work for me, often times it just crashes Daz or it just does nothing when I try to move something.

    Trying to drag any of the FACS nodes just crashes DS for me every time as well.

    Which version of DS?

    It's the beta for me.

  • vagans said:

    M-C said:

    I don´t get why people are complaining about backwards compatibility.

    As far as I understand you just have to dial in your existing characters to the new Genesis 8.1 base. This way you get a character that looks and behaves like your old ones and is compatible with your existing library as well as new stuff that will be released for 8.1.

    Am I missing something?

    Not everything is compatible. Anything that targets the skin surface might have issues as there is now a separate Head and Body. For example, LIE effects that modify the skin texture will have a cutoff at the neck. So a tattoo for example around the chest/neck area or on the head won't appear or will be cutoff when it reaches the neck seam.

    Anything that uses geoshells and has something that extends across torso and head won't work either.

    The geoshells thing is being looked into. But the LIE will still work. In the biggest test I could think of, I put my characer Magnus's skin on G8.1 then applied his upper arm tattoos (which are LIE and cross the arm/torso seams) and they applied without issue. Torso is renamed to Body so if this was an issue, this would be affected. Tested the back of the head tattoo as well (mat zone now named head) and it also worked like a charm.

    magnusong81.png
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  • SotoSoto Posts: 1,438

    Xen2k said:

    Does anyone know why new material zones were introduced in  G8.1?

    To create a better scale transition between the face and the body.

  • takezo_3001takezo_3001 Posts: 1,949
    edited January 2021

    3DRT said:

    melissastjames said:

    Haruchai said:

    rayglendenning said:

    Haruchai said:

    melissastjames said:

    I purchased Victoria 8.1 and got her loaded up, but I'm not finding any vellus hair? I don't see that listed on her product page as "included" either...but it's listed as a feature of 8.1...so...?

    Seperate product called Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair

    Is this only available with Victoria 8.1?

    It's part of the Victoria 8.1 University Bundle. Bundle only it appears.

    OMG WHAT THE FLIPPING FLIPPITY FLAP. I bought the character and the HD add-on because I have no interest in any of the additional crap in the bundle. Now I have to return the character and the add-on I purchased to buy the flipping goober bundle? OMG! So I have to buy a library environment to get vellus hair. GRRRRR.

    If it said "Pro Bundle" I'd get it...because I know that the anatomical elements only came with a pro bundle...but it says "University Bundle". So apparently vellus hair has to do with a university now...

    I find it ridiculous how they are tauting it as one of the major improvements and yet hide it behind a $100 paywall. At the very least they should include it with Victoria 8.1 herself. !

    This is infuriating, an advertized feature behind a $100 paywall... I bought the character for the vellus hair feature <=(My mistake, I posted this while still angry, you don't need V8.1 for the vellus hair) I'll wait until the Vellus Horizon Shader System comes out rather than reward Daz for a featured item behind a $100 paywall; ironically if they released a separate Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair add-on that's not part of an expensive bundle, then more people would enthusiastically buy it!

    There Edited my comment...

    Post edited by takezo_3001 on
  • WendyLuvsCatz said:

    unless they made it Carrara compatible I really don't care.

    Translation, likely nothing to see here for me. indecision

     

    I concur. It appears to be yet another attempt to wrangle money for 'New and improved content'. I'm not impressed, and I will not participate in this any longer. I will study up, and create my own content from now on. 

  • RobotHeadArtRobotHeadArt Posts: 911
    edited January 2021

    Haruchai said:

    RobotHeadArt said:

    What about LIE (tattoos and makeup) and geoshells? The UVs are different so do textures laid out for G8 (and G3 which has the same UVs as G8) work on a G8.1?

    My experience so far is only with Geoshells.  If I load a Geoshell directly onto Genesis 8.1 Female and try to use an existing 8 preset it will not work. This doesn't change even if I change the UV from Base 8.1 Female to Base Female on the Geoshell.

    If I load a preset Geoshell made for 8 in one of the existing packages on to 8.1 it will load with the body white. If you are looking to add makeup to the face you can turn off the rest and it will work. If you want to add nails or arms/legs it will work if you turn off the body also. Anything that appears on the body or crosses a boundary with the body will not work.

    I suspect you would get similar error with LIE but it might work IF you change the UV to Base Female first but then you couldn't use the new skins.

    If anyone else could confirm/refute the above I would be interested :)

     

    Interesting, thanks for checking.  Users might have to use the map transfer tool or an external program to reproject textures to the new UVs.:(

    Since strand based hair is also based on UVs, I think a few products were released that have the strands directly growing on G8 and not a skullcap fitted to G8, will those work with the G8.1 UVs or error?

    Post edited by RobotHeadArt on
  • shadowhawk1shadowhawk1 Posts: 2,189

    Ben Oaks said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    unless they made it Carrara compatible I really don't care.

    Translation, likely nothing to see here for me. indecision

     

    I concur. It appears to be yet another attempt to wrangle money for 'New and improved content'. I'm not impressed, and I will not participate in this any longer. I will study up, and create my own content from now on. 

    +1 

  • LucielLuciel Posts: 475

    Odd_Platypus said:

    Richard Haseltine said:

    Odd_Platypus said:

    skboa said:

    Urich3d said:

    Does anyone know how to get th G8.1 FASC interface to appear?

    It's located under Anatomy in smart content.

    Though it doesn't work for me, often times it just crashes Daz or it just does nothing when I try to move something.

    Trying to drag any of the FACS nodes just crashes DS for me every time as well.

    Which version of DS?

    DS 4.15. Just updated it from 4.12 today, so the very latest general release version.

    Same for me and it also crashes randomly.

    Also for Genesis 8.1 Powerpose is completely non functional for the head. 

  • Ben Oaks said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    unless they made it Carrara compatible I really don't care.

    Translation, likely nothing to see here for me. indecision

     

    I concur. It appears to be yet another attempt to wrangle money for 'New and improved content'. I'm not impressed, and I will not participate in this any longer. I will study up, and create my own content from now on. 

    It showcases new features, most of which (bar the velus hair, on which we have sent in a queery) are free. Victoria X is the flagship figure for the X generation, so with an update to 8.1 of coruse we get a victoria 8.1 (which is a new character, not just a rejig of Victoria 8, as far as I can see).

  • vagansvagans Posts: 422
    edited January 2021

    ChangelingChick said:

    vagans said:

    Not everything is compatible. Anything that targets the skin surface might have issues as there is now a separate Head and Body. For example, LIE effects that modify the skin texture will have a cutoff at the neck. So a tattoo for example around the chest/neck area or on the head won't appear or will be cutoff when it reaches the neck seam.

    Anything that uses geoshells and has something that extends across torso and head won't work either.

    The geoshells thing is being looked into. But the LIE will still work. In the biggest test I could think of, I put my characer Magnus's skin on G8.1 then applied his upper arm tattoos (which are LIE and cross the arm/torso seams) and they applied without issue. Torso is renamed to Body so if this was an issue, this would be affected. Tested the back of the head tattoo as well (mat zone now named head) and it also worked like a charm.

    Arm/torso won't be affected as that hasn't changed. Torso to head is. Example using ShanasSoulmate Inked product:

    g81_tattoo.png
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    Post edited by vagans on
  • Luciel said:

    thoreandan said:

    Luciel said:

    thoreandan said:

    Is there a clear list of which improvements come with Genesis 8.1, and which can only be obtained by purchasing Victoria 8.1?  The Introducing Genesis 8.1/Victoria 8.1 seems to blur these distinctions. Particularly, are the FACS controls we see in the example video Victoria-only?  Because after updating but not purchasing Victoria 8.1, I don't see any way to do what is shown in the FACS example video, but I don't know if that's because I'm just not finding it or because it only comes with Victoria 8.1?

    I do like how the eyelids react to rotation of the eyeballs, G8F and G3F did not always do this very well. I was able to use Look at Me (unchecking Adjust Eyelids) with G8.1F to make the eyeballs turn towards the camera, and then the eyelids adjusted appropriately on their own. Some other GF8 products refuse to recognize G8.1F as G8F, though, like Fit Control. It refuses to run and tells me to select a Genesis 8 Female when GF8.1 is selected.

    The controls are with Genesis 8.1 in the anatomy section (but often crash when I use them, so perhaps be careful). 

    If you own a pro bundle (i'd assume you'd need to own a pro bundle with the male anatomy) a version of the male anatomy appears in the female anatomy section.

    I don't seem to be able to find any vellus/body hairs, so those might be Victoria 8.1/figure addons. 

    Hmm, I don't have anything new in the Anatomy section except the 8.1 Female Eyelashes and 8.1 Female Tear attachments. Nothing related to face control in the anatomy section of Smart Content either with G8.1F selected.

    For me it's called  "Genesis 8.1 Female Face Controls" and is part of the Genesis 8 Starter Essentials (it just has a shiny grey head as the icon). You could try reinstalling the starter essentials or updating metadata or searching in the content library/lost and found. Why is it never simple. laugh 

    Found it! For those in the same boat, it's under the "Genesis 8 Female/Developer Kit" folder in Content Library. Which is a strange choice.

    As for functionality, a few things moved but occasionally it causes Daz Studio to crash.

  • SotoSoto Posts: 1,438
    edited January 2021

    Mazak said:

    This figure is so far the ugliest Victoria I have seen, face like a frog, figure like a ton, and breasts of a chicken. (loosely based on Al Bundy)

    Classy.

    Well, to each their own. I am loving her so far. 

    Victoria 8_1.jpg
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    Post edited by Soto on
  • LucielLuciel Posts: 475

    takezo_3001 said:

    3DRT said:

    melissastjames said:

    Haruchai said:

    rayglendenning said:

    Haruchai said:

    melissastjames said:

    I purchased Victoria 8.1 and got her loaded up, but I'm not finding any vellus hair? I don't see that listed on her product page as "included" either...but it's listed as a feature of 8.1...so...?

    Seperate product called Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair

    Is this only available with Victoria 8.1?

    It's part of the Victoria 8.1 University Bundle. Bundle only it appears.

    OMG WHAT THE FLIPPING FLIPPITY FLAP. I bought the character and the HD add-on because I have no interest in any of the additional crap in the bundle. Now I have to return the character and the add-on I purchased to buy the flipping goober bundle? OMG! So I have to buy a library environment to get vellus hair. GRRRRR.

    If it said "Pro Bundle" I'd get it...because I know that the anatomical elements only came with a pro bundle...but it says "University Bundle". So apparently vellus hair has to do with a university now...

    I find it ridiculous how they are tauting it as one of the major improvements and yet hide it behind a $100 paywall. At the very least they should include it with Victoria 8.1 herself. !

    This is infuriating, an advertized feature behind a $100 paywall, I bought the character for the vellus hair feature... I'll wait until the Vellus Horizon Shader System comes out rather than reward daz for a featured item behind a $100 paywall; ironically if they released a separate Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair add-on that's not part of an expensive bundle, then more people would enthusiastically buy it!

    There Edited my comment...

    You shouldn't even have to buy Victoria 8.1 or any other figure for the Vellus hair, as it's a listed feature of default Genesis 8.1 https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-1#other ;laugh

  • MelissaGTMelissaGT Posts: 2,610
    edited January 2021

    Just as a random thought of the day, I found the new UV layout kind of amusing, as I've done texture modding for female skins on Fallout 4 characters...which follow a very similar UV setup. And I gotta say, I prefer hiding the seam behind the ear and under the jaw. Why? Because now we have a seam across the collarbone...and that is the bane of anybody's existence when trying to make textures for Fallout 4 bodies. And, the issue still exists with the fact that body and head are both 4k in size and the head is obviously much smaller than the body in terms of proportion. 

    Post edited by MelissaGT on
  • jaxprogjaxprog Posts: 312

    Here's the way this new upgrade should've been implemented. All the new features should be a module like, that Genesis 8, can take advantage of, without rebuying Victoria all over again. It might as well be Genesis 9. Soon we'll see Stephanie 8.1 and all the other premier character "X" 8.1 and Genesis 8 will fade away. Calling it 8.1 is just marketing making it seem "compatible." There's alot of people here, like myself, who have spent tens of thousands of dollars since genesis 2, watching each previous version's investment get flushed down the tiolet because the previous version was found wanting or lacked compatibility.

    An analogy goes like this. Microsft used present different versions of Windows to its customers. Each new version replaced the previous version giving the customer new features and improved functionality and you paid for it. Those days are over with. Microsoft now makes one operating system, windows 10, and improves the same operating system with all the new features via updates, without having to buy windows all over again. This is the way Genesis 8 should be. One Genesis 8 and it improves, whilst all previous investment retains its value as opposed to a new Victoria with features that the all the previous investments cannot benefit from.

    Despite my opinion, I might buy 8.1 and I might not.  What I can tell you in this current moment in time, is I'm not too pleased with the latest development in its current implementation. Yes, it looks amazing and is amazing, but I shouldn't have to shell out thousands of more dollars over the course of the future rebuying the same models just so she smile with greater realism. All my library I've invested in since June 2013 should be able to use this new technology.

  • scorpioscorpio Posts: 8,328

    Richard Haseltine said:

    Ben Oaks said:

    WendyLuvsCatz said:

    unless they made it Carrara compatible I really don't care.

    Translation, likely nothing to see here for me. indecision

     

    I concur. It appears to be yet another attempt to wrangle money for 'New and improved content'. I'm not impressed, and I will not participate in this any longer. I will study up, and create my own content from now on. 

    It showcases new features, most of which (bar the velus hair, on which we have sent in a queery) are free. Victoria X is the flagship figure for the X generation, so with an update to 8.1 of coruse we get a victoria 8.1 (which is a new character, not just a rejig of Victoria 8, as far as I can see).

    And where do we find this free stuff because I'm not seeing it in the store or DIM 

  • MelissaGTMelissaGT Posts: 2,610
    edited January 2021

    jaxprog said:

    Here's the way this new upgrade should've been implemented. All the new features should be a module like, that Genesis 8, can take advantage of, without rebuying Victoria all over again. It might as well be Genesis 9. Soon we'll see Stephanie 8.1 and all the other premier character "X" 8.1 and Genesis 8 will fade away. Calling it 8.1 is just marketing making it seem "compatible." There's alot of people here, like myself, who have spent tens of thousands of dollars since genesis 2, watching each previous version's investment get flushed down the tiolet because the previous version was found wanting or lacked compatibility.

    But Victoria 8.1 looks nothing like Victoria 8...it's literally a whole new character. They might as well have named her Sarah. 

    And it's my understanding that all of your G8 characters will still be able to use hair and clothing and poses made for 8.1. Or...you could load up an 8.1 base and then *pop* turn your current G8 characters into G8.1 characters. They'll still use their G8 skins, but they'll have all the other benefits of 8.1...from what I'm gathering based on reading this thread. 

    Post edited by MelissaGT on
  • skboaskboa Posts: 59

    melissastjames said:

    Just as a random thought of the day, I found the new UV layout kind of amusing, as I've done texture modding for female skins on Fallout 4 characters...which follow a very similar UV setup. And I gotta say, I prefer hiding the seam behind the ear and under the jaw. Why? Because now we have a seam across the collarbone...and that is the bane of anybody's existence when trying to make textures for Fallout 4 bodies. And, the issue still exists with the fact that body and head are both 4k in size and the head is obviously much smaller than the body in terms of proportion. 

    So much this!

    I mean I can see what they were trying to achieve here, but it's like with so many other daz "improvements", it's a nice idea on paper but not thought out and now there are more problems than before while the same problems still exist.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 37,935

    OK for those interested which I get the impression is nobody wink

    this is how I made the crappy configuration file

    I won't share it as 

    1. crappy
    2. not mimic default covered under EULA but Genesis 8 DMC

    but I can show how you can use notepad

    replace each of the original phonemedef's with values of your choosing for these two morphs

    or other more accurate ones you wish

    phonemedef 0

    Hue 0.000000

    ChannelDef

    head:1

    facs_cbs_JawOpen_div2

    0.421053

    ChannelDef

    head:1

    facs_jnt_JawOpen

    0.500000

  • ChangelingChickChangelingChick Posts: 3,047
    edited January 2021

    vagans said:

    ChangelingChick said:

    vagans said:

    Not everything is compatible. Anything that targets the skin surface might have issues as there is now a separate Head and Body. For example, LIE effects that modify the skin texture will have a cutoff at the neck. So a tattoo for example around the chest/neck area or on the head won't appear or will be cutoff when it reaches the neck seam.

    Anything that uses geoshells and has something that extends across torso and head won't work either.

    The geoshells thing is being looked into. But the LIE will still work. In the biggest test I could think of, I put my characer Magnus's skin on G8.1 then applied his upper arm tattoos (which are LIE and cross the arm/torso seams) and they applied without issue. Torso is renamed to Body so if this was an issue, this would be affected. Tested the back of the head tattoo as well (mat zone now named head) and it also worked like a charm.

    Arm/torso won't be affected as that hasn't changed. Torso to head is. Example using ShanasSoulmate Inked product:

    I don't know how that particular product is set up or how you applied it, but the Torso region from G8 is no longer named Torso on G8.1-- it's Body. If there was a problem with LIE applying to the new Head mat zone, there would be a similar issue with the Body mat zone. As a test, I created a quick LIE on G8F across the neck/torso area. I then applied it to G8.1, and it works fine. 

    Post edited by ChangelingChick on
  • takezo_3001takezo_3001 Posts: 1,949

    Luciel said:

    takezo_3001 said:

    3DRT said:

    melissastjames said:

    Haruchai said:

    rayglendenning said:

    Haruchai said:

    melissastjames said:

    I purchased Victoria 8.1 and got her loaded up, but I'm not finding any vellus hair? I don't see that listed on her product page as "included" either...but it's listed as a feature of 8.1...so...?

    Seperate product called Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair

    Is this only available with Victoria 8.1?

    It's part of the Victoria 8.1 University Bundle. Bundle only it appears.

    OMG WHAT THE FLIPPING FLIPPITY FLAP. I bought the character and the HD add-on because I have no interest in any of the additional crap in the bundle. Now I have to return the character and the add-on I purchased to buy the flipping goober bundle? OMG! So I have to buy a library environment to get vellus hair. GRRRRR.

    If it said "Pro Bundle" I'd get it...because I know that the anatomical elements only came with a pro bundle...but it says "University Bundle". So apparently vellus hair has to do with a university now...

    I find it ridiculous how they are tauting it as one of the major improvements and yet hide it behind a $100 paywall. At the very least they should include it with Victoria 8.1 herself. !

    This is infuriating, an advertized feature behind a $100 paywall, I bought the character for the vellus hair feature... I'll wait until the Vellus Horizon Shader System comes out rather than reward daz for a featured item behind a $100 paywall; ironically if they released a separate Genesis 8.1 Female Vellus Hair add-on that's not part of an expensive bundle, then more people would enthusiastically buy it!

    There Edited my comment...

    You shouldn't even have to buy Victoria 8.1 or any other figure for the Vellus hair, as it's a listed feature of default Genesis 8.1 https://www.daz3d.com/genesis-8-1#other ;laugh

    Yes, you're right, my mistake, I posted while angry, but that still doesn't change the fact that it's still not included for Genesis 8.1 as it is an advertised feature with no mention as a separate purchase... As I've said before, if they were to release the vellus hair as a separate item for purchase, then that would be much more ideal than bundling it in a $100+ product...

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