3D University - A few questions and issues ...
markhendy_399c68b726
Posts: 0
I just received the latest DAZ email "Start 2013 With a Whole New Look for 65% OFF", and noticed at the bottom of it a banner for the new 3D University ... "Learn & Tune Your 3D Skills FOR FREE".
"GREAT!!!" I thought, so clicked and sat fidgetting while the page loaded and excellent! Some free training videos for Studio 4.5 and other products, all by Dreamlight ... another plus point as I do think their stuff hits the spot quite well.
But wait!!! They are not all free ... two of the videos are un-FREE ... and right now I am skint. Oh, well, I'll wishlist them and wait, I guess.
So on to the other items, the associated products to support the training, a fair spread from Stonemason and Favarel and others, soem discounted, some full price, so I wishlist each of those in turn, checking what each is and then spot a few that seem out of place ...
The Render Presets are for Poser only, not Studio 4.5, so why recommend them here?
And then the "Render Throttle" product says this:
"•This Plug-in DOES NOT work with DAZ Studio 4+. The options it exposed are available in the Advanced Render settings of DAZ Studio 4+."
... Which kinda means it won't work with Studio 4.5, and if I did buy it I would be double making a mistake as the functions are now integrated in 4.5 ... so again, why recommend it here?
Now I feel a bit uncertain of the compatibility of the "Ink Render Plugin" that is also recommended, but the page gives no hint of which versions of Studio it works with.
Oh, well, slam 'em all on the wishlist and cross my fingers for enlightenment soon ...
So, DAZ, why are two of the FREE training modules not free?
And what about the recommended products to support the course?
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Comments
I dont know a lot of details since I dont use the Dreamlight stuff but if memeory serves, some of the tutorials were written long before DS4 ever came out. They are still relevant to some degree since a lot of settings in DS have not changed over the years.
These are all branded as new products "DAZ Studio 4.5 Master", and "Great Art Now" ...
http://www.daz3d.com/help/help-daz-3d-video-tutorials?utm_source=bronto&utm_medium=email&utm_term=Image+-+Learn+how+to+become+a+3D+Master
Page isn't loading well now compared to earlier, but the individual products and their banners are visible if you scroll down.
The 3D University has been a blind banner (i.e. not linked to a url / page) for the past few days on the Shop front page, but now is linkiong to this page too. These are new products, or old ones rebranded as new ... but that would concern me even more.
It seems to me that the "organisation" :D (tried to insert a laughing smiley here, but they dont work) doesnt appear to have any cohesion.
Its the old story of the left and right hands not knowing what each-other are doing.
Personally I have bought a few things that didn't work - movie maker for one.
For the few $ that they cost I couldn't be bothered to go through the rigmarole of a refund process - time is more important to me than the small sums of money involved.
Having said that, Daz models are the most realistic that I have seen, and having just bought keymate and graphmate (which I thoroughly recommend), . I am finally starting to see some decent results from my efforts, (I cant show them here - they are a bit naughty). It has taken months of installing different programs, on different computers, then seeing which ones I could work with etc.
The learning curve has been huge for me, but luckily I have the time and the finances to push on - still lots to learn - movie-making, post production etc. etc.
Going back to the subject; Daz 3D (whoever they are) have a winning product, but no clue when it comes to keeping customers happy.
Better communication in every department would be a good start!
The new videos are all done using DAZ Studio 4.5 Advanced -- why not the Pro version, he doesn't say (or if he does, I haven't gotten to that part yet -- I've only watched about half of them so far). I actually bought the two videos that weren't free -- I can afford to gamble $8, but since I haven't had a chance to watch them yet, I can't tell whether that gamble paid off or not. It's always interesting to see how other people create their art, even if they do things in a manner that don't necessarily work for me, and I've almost always been able to pick out a point or two from Dreamlight3D's videos to use later in my own work.
I got the DreamLight Lighting class, which I thoroughly enjoyed and find to have been well worth it. I think it was written for DS3, but works for DS4x
A lot of his videos show him working in Lightwave, which I don't use, and it's really put me off buying more of his stuff. That's why I was pleased to see that this round of videos were DAZ Studio-specific, and why I was willing to gamble a few bucks.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I will probably (definitely) buy these; it is peanuts after all. Plus, I already have subscribed to some of the other Dreamlight courses and they are very useful. But I couldn't help wondering why these two were not free when the whole collection is advertised as, or at least implied to be, free in the email and main page,
Also the anomalous product recommendations to support the course seemed odd.
Wait, DAZ Studio 4.5 ADVANCED? I didn't know there was such a thing.
When was DS4.5 ever not free? I remember I bought DS4.0advanced and it went to Freeware about a week later... then DS4.5 came out... unless I'm living in an alternate universe (possible? Hmmmm?) DS4.5 has never been released in any but the Pro version so far as I am aware.
Yes, it has, but it wasn't always intended to be indefinitely free. Honestly, I'm still not certain if that's a forever thing or not. :)
I hear you there. I'm betting DAZ hasn't decided yet. DS1 was originally free, and frankly, I suspect DS as Freeware probably better serve's DAZ's business model... It actually got some respectful press on CGTalk when it was made free... Another thing is that DS as freeware is good for the CG industry in general, not just DAZ. Enlightened Self Interest and all that... :)
Not freeware. It is Commercial Software being offered at 100% discount
I stand corrected :)
Yeah, you and me both. Still kinda torqued about that...
Oh, don't get me wrong, I will probably (definitely) buy these; it is peanuts after all. Plus, I already have subscribed to some of the other Dreamlight courses and they are very useful. But I couldn't help wondering why these two were not free when the whole collection is advertised as, or at least implied to be, free in the email and main page,
Also the anomalous product recommendations to support the course seemed odd.
I've seriously considered buying some of the other Dreamlight3D packages, but I've always held off (partly because he spends so much time in Lightwave, and I didn't feel like paying for instruction on software I don't use -- and partly because, frankly, he's a little too talky and a little less teachy than I would prefer, if you know what I mean). Still, it seems like everyone who's paid for the instruction speaks favorably of it -- I don't think I've seen a bad review yet. I just never seem to have any spare cash when his stuff goes on sale...
I had a membership at dreamlight for a while and found it vey useful with lots of useful info. Membership wasn't worth it for me at the time as I didn't have the time available to look at the tutorials but I can recommend it to anyone who has the time available.
Yeah, you and me both. Still kinda torqued about that...
I raised a support ticket and was given a credit; you could still try that.
I raised a support ticket and was given a credit; you could still try that.
If I remember correctly, I bought DS4A very early after it debuted, and I believe I was outside the 30-day return window before DAZ started giving Pro away for free. I believe a lot of people were in that situation, but I don't recall any of them ever getting any satisfaction from DAZ about it (or if they did, you're the first I've heard mention it). Naw, man, it's cool -- I've learned my lesson, and you can bet I won't be so quick to pay for DS5 if and when it arrives.
He does some brilliant material, but I get the impression he is overloading himself right now, e.g. he has missed several promised deadlines for his more recent training products that I bought, with modules missing, or made up using modules from other courses, or freeware he has copied from the www. Maybe not fair to demonise when he provides such good material when he does deliver, but he seems to have delivered the 3D University modules at the expense of other products that people have paid for.
I recommend his (aka Dreamlight) ...
1. Light Master course (the first course, not Light Master 2 yet as he is running late on that one).
2. Model Master course (again only the first course, not MM2 as that is running late too and right now the available modules use only Lightwave and Zbrush)
He does some brilliant material, but I get the impression he is overloading himself right now, e.g. he has missed several promised deadlines for his more recent training products that I bought, with modules missing, or made up using modules from other courses, or freeware he has copied from the www. Maybe not fair to demonise when he provides such good material when he does deliver, but he seems to have delivered the 3D University modules at the expense of other products that people have paid for.
I recommend his (aka Dreamlight) ...
1. Light Master course (the first course, not Light Master 2 yet as he is running late on that one).
2. Model Master course (again only the first course, not MM2 as that is running late too and right now the available modules use only Lightwave and Zbrush)
thanks for the info it is a while since I used his tutorials and I wasn't aware of the difficulties.
I'm mainly interested in model master...I do own zbrush but tend to use hex more as I'm familiar with it.
Many tutorials are not always on the software of your choice the LLF modelling one was done in Modo, but it was similiar enough to adapt.
Not sure if this is the right place to comment, or a new thread is needed.
Current state of play with me and Dreamlight is that I am now trying to get refunds for their products where they have failed to deliver or provide adequate customer service in a reasonable time. I have a thread running on the Dreamlight forum which has had no direct response from Dreamlight or the owner, despite repeated emails via the forum admin who has been very helpful. This avoidance of dealing with issues and non delivery has permanently damaged my perceptions of the Dreamlight brand,
This is the current state of play (originally posted to the Dreamlight forum on 1st January 2013 on a thread I started on 14th October 2012):
In Waldemar's email, "Modules Delayed Due To Internet Bug", of 22nd October 2012, Wallie says:
"Just a quick note on the recent delayes with new modules affecting:
Animation Master (bonus module)
Space Battle Master (bonus module)
Model Master 2 (Module 1)
Light Master 2 (Module 2)
Your Money Hobby Machine (Module 3)
There are some severe internet issues here at the moment, making it impossible to upload the large video files.
I deeply appologise the delays, the internet should be up and working any day, and the modules will then be delivered one after one, starting with Model Master, Light Master and Your Hobby Money Machine."
This sort of implies that the modules were ready, but that he was unable to upload them. But then in Miss B's reply here of 30th November over 5 weeks later, Wallie says:
"These two are delayed and the bonus videos will be released shortly.
Space battle master is being recorded and edited as we speak.
Thanks,
W"
... so the modules were not even then ready to be uploaded.
It's now over a further month later and still no uploads, and now other content is late for the new Light Master 2 and Model Master 2 course, and so too are the November and December Live Training sessions.
Here's the break down of what is now late:
3D Space Battle Master
BONUS MODULE (Sept 27 2012) - delivered today, 9th january 2013 with no apology or explanation.
3D Animation Master
3D ANIMATION MASTER BONUS VIDEOS (Oct 5 2012)
3D Light Master 2
MODULE 5: DAZ STUDIO REALITY + LUX (Coming Dec 2012)
3D Model Master 2
MODULE 4 (Dec 2012)
UPCOMING LIVE GROUP WEBINARS. LOOK FOR INVITATION BY EMAIL:
Nov 25 2012 7 PM SWE 1h Lighting Val Cameron
Nov 28 2012 7 PM SWE 1h Lighting Val Cameron
... and no live group webinars even scheduled for December 2012.
And the November Gallery review video uploaded on 9th December 2012 appears broken, the download of 164Mb consistantly ending at 38.6Mb.
Yeah, that ain't good, and it's pretty consistent with what I've been hearing from other folks about his subscription services. The individual packages for sale in the DAZ store seem to rate pretty highly, but the subscription instruction -- not so much. Doesn't really inspire me as a potential customer...
This reply is purely to do with my original post, the DAZ 3D University.
I have feedback from DAZ support on the 3D University products
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The two training modules that are not free are intended to be that way. These will be supplemented by other training modules over time that also will not be free. Apparently this is part of a new marketing arrangement between DAZ and Dreamlight.
The following is my initial review of the products from fast forwarding through each to check content and playability
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'll do a more in depth review later for the modules I’ve not commented on below.
The free modules are generally between 5 and 10 minutes in duration (less than 50Mb to 226Mb downloads for the MP4 versions), the paid ones are over 30 minutes long (over 500Mb downloads for the MP4 versions).
There is some confusion over the naming / numbering of each product, e.g. the product labelled as "4.2 Great Art Now - Advanced Camera - Magical 3D Camera Secrets" once unzipped produces a video file named "GreatArtNow_4_1_AdvancedCamera". This confusion is repeated for a few others in the set.
The complete set so far is as follows (the file names, not product names … I give the two together later):
GreatArtNow_0_0_7StepsToGreatArtNow.mp4
GreatArtNow_0_1_QuickStart.mp4
GreatArtNow_1_0_Software.mp4
GreatArtNow_2_0_SceneBuilding.mp4
GreatArtNow_2_1_AdvSceneMaking.mp4
GreatArtNow_3_0_PosingAndMorphs.mp4
GreatArtNow_4_0_Camera.mp4
GreatArtNow_4_1_AdvancedCamera.mp4
GreatArtNow_5_0_Lighting.mp4
GreatArtNow_6_0_Rendering.mp4
GreatArtNow_7_0_Postwork.mp4
GreatArtNow_8_0_Animation.mp4
GreatArtNow_10_1_Modeling101.mp4
You’ll note the numbering does not correspond to the DAZ Product naming. I’ll use both below.
Summary
Each has about 30 seconds of glitzy intro, pacy music and some graphic animation, with a voiceover near the end that really is just an advert. Contrast this to Geekatplay videos that get right in to the matter at hand with only a brief "Hello".
Apart from the Quickstart (found at the bottom of the 3D University page), which is paced like a rocket taking off, the remaining videos are fairly slow paced with a lot of talk, and some fluff.
The videos follow the workflow outlined in the Intro.
1. GreatArtNow_0_0_7StepsToGreatArtNow.mp4 (5:15 duration, 49.3Mb unzipped), DAZ Product name: “The 7 Steps To Great Art Now – Intro”
After the intro. this is essentially a video of a virtual whiteboard presentation with hand drawn workflows and a voiceover. The first half is mostly irrelevant about fun and life, the video only getting on to a summary of the rest of the modules and the workflow in the second half. It would have been useful, maybe, to have had this as a small diagram in a separate pdf to print out and stick on the wall for a week or so till you develop your own workflow.
2. GreatArtNow_0_1_QuickStart.mp4 (8:28 duration, 90MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “Great Art Now - Quick Start”
Bizarrely, this one is right at the bottom of the 3D University page after all the other videos. It would make sense to have it at the top, even before the Intro perhaps. Same intro and slow voiceover, but once that is over the speed steps up considerably rushing through the DAZ Studio interface and creating a posed, lit, rendered still and then an animation ... there is no explanation of why, only what, i.e. the voiceover tells us what we see being done on screen of the "click here, then do this, then click there, ... " method. That's fine for a quick start and shows off well what DAZ Studio can do immediately out of the box, but this is more to build enthusiasm and desire for more than to educate.
3. GreatArtNow_1_0_Software.mp4 (7:51 duration, 68.5MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “1.1 Great Art Now – Software”
Again the intro, and in this one the first minute is fluff. The video walks through a few aspects of DAZ Studio, preferences, set up, etc. this is not done at the same fast exciting pace as the Quickstart and is the more usual Waldemar slow talk. Still the same "click here, then do this ..." method of show and tell teaching style, but now we get a little explanation of what each feature of DAZ does, very high level still. In the last couple of minutes he stops showing actions and behaviour of DAZ Studio but uses a pen to draw on a static image of DAZ to emphasis what he is saying, but I think this actually slows down from the teaching and does not add to it, though I do know others that like this handwriting on the screen approach, I'd prefer maybe if he had screen cap'd to Powerpoint and then used large font overlays, but swings and roundabouts and individual preference.
4. GreatArtNow_2_0_SceneBuilding.mp4 (9:42 duration, 182MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “2.1 Great Art Now - Scene Making”
I’ll come back and add review comments in here and below later this weekend …
5. GreatArtNow_2_1_AdvSceneMaking.mp4 (30:07 duration, 503MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “2.2 Great Art Now - Advanced Scene Making”
6. GreatArtNow_3_0_PosingAndMorphs.mp4 (7:21 duration, 92.8MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “3.1 Great Art Now - Posing And Morphing”
7. GreatArtNow_4_0_Camera.mp4 (9:53 duration, 180MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “4.1 Great Art Now – Camera”
8. GreatArtNow_4_1_AdvancedCamera.mp4 (37.32 duration, 500MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “4.2 Great Art Now - Advanced Camera - Magical 3D Camera Secrets”
9. GreatArtNow_5_0_Lighting.mp4 (15:15 duration, 226MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “5.1 Great Art Now – Lighting”
10. GreatArtNow_6_0_Rendering.mp4 (8:06 duration, 81.4MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “6.1 Great Art Now – Rendering”
11. GreatArtNow_7_0_Postwork.mp4 (5:39 duration, 84.6MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “7.1 Great Art Now – Postwork”
12. GreatArtNow_8_0_Animation. mp4 (13:54 duration, 142MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “8.1 Great Art Now – Animation”
13. GreatArtNow_10_1_Modeling101.mp4 (8:28 duration, 90MB unzipped), DAZ Product name: “9.1 Great Art Now – Modeling”