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Posted a news piece about this thread at CarraraCafe, here: http://carraracafe.com/?p=2549
I certainly did not mean to offend. I only give my background in that story lines and story telling are a regular part of what I do and what I love. I'm not sure why it bothers you as it does but please accept my apologies. At this time I feel we are still open to story ideas so I don't see any need to jump ship. I'd be nice if you would reconsider.
Edit: Everyone has a background, but it is not up to me to ask them to share it. In sharing my own background I considered myself being transparent with the community and making somewhat of an introduction of who I am and what my thinking is about the project so far. I'm sure there are people with a wide range of backgrounds in this community, many of them book writers and other things, who also deal with story lines regularly have opinions as valid as my own. Those individuals may agree or disagree with any part of what I wrote in the post. All roads lead to the same place. If the only offensive thing in my post was the mention of my education then I will remove it. Not because I feel bad about it, but because I don't want others having similar reactions to yours. Is that the only issue with the post? Thanks Bigh for your help in any way you can provide it.
I understand where you are going and that's good for the story ( what ever it is ) .
My thinking is - your style just reminds me of being back in school and looking out the window while the teacher
went on about some thing - a page is not needed some time - just a paragraph will do .
That's me some people like your style .
So it's better for me to just leave thing as they are .
I just lurk and watch the Carrara guy pissing contests.
Gee Ivy sure is doing some really great Poser/Daz studio animations!
go girl!
hey did anyone remember a group called Suncatcher?
lol! I AM A TROLL, will own this!!
always feel at home here though ;-P
I edited my quote of your post as well. I think you did the right thing.
Wonderful!!!!!! Fantastic news! Thank you so much!
suncatcher
I understand where you are going and that's good for the story ( what ever it is ) .
My thinking is - your style just reminds me of being back in school and looking out the window while the teacher
went on about some thing - a page is not needed some time - just a paragraph will do .
That's me some people like your style .
So it's better for me to just leave thing as they are .
I understand, Bigh. Thanks for clarifying and your point is well taken. I admit I sometimes find your short 1 to 4 line posts hard to understand, I simply don't get what you are trying to say much of the time. Assuming you aren't in the mood to expound I rarely ask for clarification. I have noticed before a stark contrast in our writing styles, but it doesn't bother me. It just goes to show different strokes for different folks. I respect your choice to use as few words as possible as you my tendency to try to be as clear as possible. In our own way we're each trying to do it the way we think is best. In my defense I did warn that it was a long post. Please forgive me.
I will keep them shorter as much as I can. Who's got the time to read a bunch of stuff anyway?
Fortunately I'm confident that for the sake of this project we can find a way to overcome our stylistic differences with one another as individuals and as community members as a whole. Fun fun.
A good story is a good story no matter who wrote it , or what system , or what their background --in fact none of that matters to the story at all. So everyone is very welcome to give it a go. Some might be good from the start . some might be good to incubate another.........the important thing is trying. Who knows where it might go.
3drendero.......thanks much for the posting. Awesome and would be nice going forward to use that site for more things .......smiles.
The more I look at movies like Sintel the more I realize that kind of effort would take a lot of effort by a lot very expert users and certainly not average users. Well the trick then is how to harness the efforts of more average users who may want to participate but might not feel they could help. Or are just not up to that level of output that may be required.
My thinking is that there will need to be a certain training/supervision of lesser experts by the more experts directed on very focused tasks. ie. expert user is going to be creating a scene with two characters sitting at a kitchen table talking . Expert user is good at animation but needs lots of props in the kitchen to add that detail so needed to create a believable scene. (Assuming for the moment that using daz content is not happening or not in this scene) .
Well said expert may obtain the assistance of thee lesser experts who are to work on the models needed in the kitchen scene. Some for closeups , some long shots. Here is where I think we need a model mentor of sorts to assist the three in the creation of the models. By connecting the three less experts with the model mentor the entire scene can still be created as long as the model mentor can get the three following his instructions in the creation of the models. Same could be done with shaders or textures, and animations etc
. In fact a mentor or two or three might have swarms of lesser experts assigned to them for learning / supervision /production.
It sounds somewhat awkward but I am just trying to come to terms with the mix of talent and how best to harness every last drop. The other side of this is---- this movie project could/would be more a community project with lots of folks increasing their knowledge and expertise while the potential for a future projects would have that much an better possibility of completion and quality.
Pixar's 22 Rules of Storytelling, if you haven't seen them.
http://pbjpublishing.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/poster-22-rules-storytelling.jpeg
Making a rule: No Store-bought content allowed could be okay, I guess... but I personally look at the Daz3d and Renderosity stores as my paid support staff making my models. They are so good, so inexpensive, well... they're so good and they're inexpensive! This is the biggest blessing which is allowing my movie to take shape. If I had to spend that much time modeling and texturing, I would'nt be making a movie. I'd be too busy modeling and texturing. But I'm a spaz... just my input on the subject. There are probably some here who can perform such tasks in their sleep. For me, however, I buy, assemble, animate, light and render.
Furthermore, if there are experts (Faba, for instance) at setting up the ERC by Fenric, who can assemble a small team setting up ERC to enhance the animators job - this would be a huge benefit. I am nearly in a position to study that further soon, but I certainly don't have any skills there, yet - but Faba has some great tutorials at ShareCG to get started - from there it's just following the procedures and being patient. This can have the effect of saving a lot of time in the animation department for one, but even more, some things would be now included in the movie that might be absent without it. It depends on how imaginative the ERC team is - and/or what is requested of them.
Speaking as a non-artist modeler, I think it would be wrong to showcase Carrara using models made in other applications. The VM is a major, but underutilized part of C and to use models made in other applications would be an admission that the VM, spline and metaball modelers are not up to scratch.
I personally prefer to model in Hex because i know it better, but am capable of using the VM to model about anything needed and there are some very competent modelers who do use it. I for one would be happy to bite the bullet and get to know the modelling capabilities of C a lot better to help in this endeavor and I am sure that other Hex modelers would do so as well.
I suggest that at this stage some stocktaking of who is willing and able to do what be set up - perhaps a site where we can register, state what we are willing to do, etc., so that the managers can take stock and start allocating tasks.
I agree!
This is a good way for some people to learn things like modeling and rigging a character from scratch. It's not as scary as it sounds, just takes time!
I am willing to put forth some modeling of either characters or props. I don't have loads of spare time, but should be able to help with boning and morph targets as well....if needed.
Roygee,dbuchter, Mcguiver----- I have to agree with most everything you guys write and especially your support and McGuiver --any help when you have time would be so appreciated as everone has time constraints. In particular about Carrara created content , I also think that if one was going to "showcase" Carrara it would be a little odd if a lot of the modeling was done in something else or lots of content was used as one has no real way of knowing what software might have been used for those ---although it does showcase how easy content from Daz could be used in Carrara.
This is one of those very critical early decisons matters. If the community was able to do an all Carrara movie with all models, characters, scenes , effects etc only coming from Carrara that would be amazing. No---That would be AMAZING!!
And I think this community project could /would become a pretty good learning experience at the same time if that was attempted . As long as we can get enough experts to help the lesser experts along. I would be concerned especially if there were many characters that need modeling and rigging that a community could pull that off ----but gosh........we might be surprised.
dbuchter- I also think this might be a good time to set up some roster of sorts -a place where folks can indicate their willingness to particpate, how much time they can put in each week, what they feel they can contribute etc. etc.
It would be nice to have some storyline to work from --as once we have that we actually can have some folks start modeling things, or shading/texturing things almost like filling up the back lot with props ready to be used in some movie.
We could just post in forum -----we have a scene in a sultans tent we need vases, weapons, tables, beds etc and let folks start working on making some of these. It would give us a good judge of peoples expertise , it could also be a good time to build expertise and have folks learning. We could run in some short tutorials for folks on some modeling tips etc . And just having folks practicing would go well to building general skill levels while props, scenery, etc were created as well.
For me, once a basic story is decided, a very simple storyboard should be sketched. It may help to have sketches of the individual characters....this will make it easier to fit their personalities with their role in the story.
Below is a frame from a story ("Going South") I started awhile back, about the woes of a duck flying south for the winter. I pasted my sucky storyboard in in the corner of the render to show how much the final render changed from the storyboard.
I also have several scenes animated & 3 characters made....but not enough time to complete.
If.....the community wishes...."Going South" could be made into our community film short.
Wow. Excellent development here.
Polls will be coming tomorrow, as well as a basic plan for going forward. We seem to all be on similar wavelengths about what needs to be done as far as organization so I am really hopeful. I will compile a sort of listing of all the story lines we have come up with so far, then allow members to vote on their favorite. The one with the most votes will win. That will be our story.
After that, we will decide on who will lead teams and allow each leader to decide on the types of resources he/she may need going forward. I can see about 6 core people already including myself, which is a good number hopefully enough to get this thing done right.
Apologies for not posting some polls already, been busy with a few things but all is not lost. See ya soon team!
Carrara can surely do it all, the question is whether or not we have community members who are willing to do it, because building it from scratch is not always easy. You seem well suited to take on the role of model/morph director, and your team will be essential to the project. Yep, you're in bud. Thanks for the offering of your services for modeling/rigging, they shall be properly exploited.
Sweeeet!
Great potential here with this story and the look of these characters. Love it!
Very good news Rashad on next steps --seems like a good plan to start with.
Mcguiver-- your "Going South" looks pretty amazing. ---With some guidance from you (As Obviously , you got Skills on a high level) an all carrara made movie project might actually be possible as you have some pretty awesome characters there already which one one of the concerns about a community project all Carrara movie. But this could be a great start indeed .
Had you fleshed out a full story ? Do you want any community help on that if we go in this direction ? I think this has many story plot possibilities. ie One of the ducks wishes to take a short cut gets in trouble others help him in the end , or one is not so strong to keep up but figures a way to get to the southern home anyhow, or One gets lost somehow and the others go look for him or her rather than heading south despite the oncoming colder temperatures....etc etc ---
3dView,
Thanks for the vote of confidence!
To answer your questions.....the full story has not been fleshed out, but can be taken in any number of directions.
What I had envisioned is:
I have a storyteller...the brown-headed duck. He tells how he has taken his nephew "under his wing" after the untimely demise of the parents. (a scene with shotgun shooting past decoys)
The storyteller is in duck paradise (like the Bahamas) walking along the beach, telling of how the main character tends to always find trouble & delays along his way. While the story is being told, background characters on the beach resort are drawing attention by their antics....such as beach bully, guys staring at a sexy female duck....etc...
What I have, so far...
Main character modeled and boned with morph targets
Storyteller modeled & boned with morph targets.
Dragonfly character modeled and boned with morph targets.
Scenes (kinda) worked out:
Main character flying south, looking for a place to land for the night (carrying suitcase).....he spots a suitable place, drops his suitcase (splashes into the water). a dragonfly spots the suitcase & goes to check it out just as the main character comes in for a landing. They both collide....the dragonfly into the ducks mouth. A crash landing insues, the dragonfly's wing is injured, so gets bandaged and the duck takes care of the dragonfly. the next morning, the pond has frozen, the ducks foot is stuck in the ice. The dragonfly is sitting on the duck, almost frozen (frosty). Another duck(s) waddles up (with thermometer) & ribs main character for not paying attention to the freezing weather.
Anyway, it still needs alot of TLC, but it is a possible start.
McGuiver------stuff looks awesome indeed. And indeed I think the possibilities of storyline are nearly unlimited. Your characters have great character in so much just looking at them ---and they have emotion. Very nice indeed.
I cannot think of a better starting project. I would vote for making this the community project movie in a heartbeat. And I think -------we could also strive for the all Carrara created badge as you have done so much of the more difficult items and done them very well......There are things that others might have made so far as well....but so far your stuff MeGuiver --looks best and in so many ways perfect .
One stroryline can be crafted from all your ideas and with added scenery , shots etc and hopefully more characters could be a pretty cool movie project.
I am a Grandpa. So I get to tell stories all the time. I would like to take a shot at writing an outline for the duck story. If you give me the basic idea of the story I will put together a step outline.
Craig
The basic idea is that the storyteller is the uncle of the main character. The main character is late (as usual) showing up at their winter resort. The story is split between the main character's comedic / unorthadox journey and the storyteller worrying about his nephews late arrival. (see the above post)
Because the duck story is just in it's infancy, how the story gets from the beginning, to what all happens along the way, to the arrival is totally up-in-the-air at this point.........anything could happen.
A writer who can bring this all together in an entertaining way will be a vital key to the success of whatever is chosen as the community project.
I put all of my animations for "Going South" together on vimeo here:
https://vimeo.com/57281289
Mcguiver----
The vimeo clips look pretty nice . nice job. Yes I think your stuff could be an awesome springboard for a movie. It has so much room for diversity of storyline and loads of opportunities for folks to dig into many of Carrara's toolset if not the whole thing when all is said and done.
Craig --sure give it a go.........In fact anyone can give it a go....would be nice to see some storylines going and maybe build some consensus.
Duck--here comes some stories.
Imagine this story being told by a proud Uncle.
"Once upon a time I had an incredible nephew. No, nothing happened to him, he's fine and he is still my nephew but this a story about when he was a just a duckling. Oh, did I forget to mention he is a duck. Yeah yeah, I heard all the duck jokes before but this kid pulled it all together. He saved the flock. See, that is why I am proud to be a duck. My nephew calls me Uncle Ish. My real name is Chris, Uncle Chris. His name is Grant."
The main character (the hero) is Grant the Duck.
Grant the duck is trying to get his mom and dad out of the University Research facility so his dad can lead the flock south for the winter.
His main antagonist is a mean old Tomcat that lives at the University.
If Grant fails his flock doesn't go south for the winter and they all freeze to death.
To summarize:
When Grant the duck's parents are captured and he gets adopted by Eagles and becomes step brothers with an Eaglet they leave the country and journey through the city where they have to face all kinds of predators and finally the big bad cat that prowls the university but when he finally finds his mom and dad he is willing to sacrifice himself so his dad can lead the flock south for the winter.
Craig
try again - not working for me
What they would do in the old Loony Toons cartoons is take a simple idea and build off of that -- for example:
The duck is flying south and he sees another duck and falls in love. The love of his life ignores him, but seeing that she is in danger, he goes to great lengths to save her. Sadly, she is a decoy.
I think Erik is onto something that had been very successful and just needs some tweaking --maybe combining a few of their cartoon plotlines into one . I think Craig ----just go for another story as we cannot have enough ideas and maybe it ends up to be a little of this a little of that amalgamation of ideas kind of thing.
And at this point these are just short summaries so its not like folks will have been writting a screenplay and it goes for naught. So I encourage all to come up with somemore ideas , storylines , plots and if you want to go with a little more detail that's fine too.
We have to all remember this is the beginning of a kind of peer review / community / expert approval of things trying to get the best we can. So we all have to get used to rejections , redo's , revisions , do overs , do overs and more do overs etc. Especially once we get into production. No one should take anything too personally as I think everyone is going to be trying to do the best we can. To make the best movie we can. It sometimes will seem frustrating and I just hope everyone understands this.
Working in a community project scheme has its positives and negatives for sure ---we just have to leverage the positives more so.