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Is Carrara capable of modelling like zBrush?

SuperdogSuperdog Posts: 765
edited February 2013 in Carrara Discussion

I wonder if Carrara can be used to model unique figures like zBrush? I've been thinking of buying zBrush while I'm still a student but it's still £350/$550 which is a huge amount of outlay. Are there any cheaper alternatives that are nearly as good as zBrush?

Also, is Mudbox a credible alternative to zBrush and does it integrate well with Carrara like zBrush does?

Post edited by Superdog on

Comments

  • Kodiak3dKodiak3d Posts: 223
    edited December 1969

    Carrara uses vertex modeling, unlike Zbrush. In theory, you could get similar results, but it would take a tremendous amount of time and work to do so. If you're looking for Zbrush style modeling but don't want to front the cash for it, you might check out Sculptris, which is a free program by Pixlogic that has a similar "sculpting" type of modeler, but nowhere near the tools of Zbrush.

  • Design AcrobatDesign Acrobat Posts: 459
    edited December 1969

    You can download 3DCoat for a 30 Day trial.
    http://3d-coat.com/download/

    There is a student version available for 99.00 dollars.

  • SuperdogSuperdog Posts: 765
    edited December 1969

    Design Acrobat said:
    You can download 3DCoat for a 30 Day trial.
    http://3d-coat.com/download/

    There is a student version available for 99.00 dollars.

    Does 3D Coat integrate well with Carrara? I mean could I import Genesis figures and adjust them? Is the student version very limited compared to the full version?

  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Actually studio and hexagon were made to work with each other quite nicely to make morphs. Better then in carrara or trying to import from something else to carrara.

  • Kodiak3dKodiak3d Posts: 223
    edited December 1969

    It's my undertanding that Sculptris works nicely for making morphs as well, though I have not done it myself.

  • mmoirmmoir Posts: 821
    edited December 1969

    You can try Blender 3d , it has a very nice sculpting toolset and for free you can't beat the price.

  • SonofbelmontSonofbelmont Posts: 147
    edited December 1969

    although it's not free I've found Silo is pretty simple and fun to use for creating morphs
    It doesn't seem to open Obj files which have been exported directly from Daz studio properly though so I usually send the model to hexagon and export it from there.

  • Design AcrobatDesign Acrobat Posts: 459
    edited February 2013

    Superdog said:
    Design Acrobat said:
    You can download 3DCoat for a 30 Day trial.
    http://3d-coat.com/download/

    There is a student version available for 99.00 dollars.

    Does 3D Coat integrate well with Carrara? I mean could I import Genesis figures and adjust them? Is the student version very limited compared to the full version?

    Yes, one guy imported a Genesis figure into 3DCoat and made morphs in 3d-coat. He also made the clothing, war Hammer and background with 3d-coat voxels. It was posed and rendered in Carrara 8.5 beta.

    Just posting the thumbnail image as it's not my work and you cannot view the 3Dcoat forums without being a member (I think). Perhaps if he sees this post, he will respond.

    Edit: In case you can view the forums. here's the URL.
    http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9581

    The limitation of the student version is it cannot be used for commercial purposes and the exported maps (texture, normal, specular) are limited to 2K x 2K.

    dwarf_thumbnail.jpg
    130 x 168 - 5K
    Post edited by Design Acrobat on
  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,543
    edited December 1969

    ManStan said:
    Actually studio and hexagon were made to work with each other quite nicely to make morphs. Better then in carrara or trying to import from something else to carrara.
    The Man Stan is correct. I use Hexagon to add morph targets to clothes - but you can use it to create morphs on, say, Genesis as well. The Bridge is true magic - because when you send the figure back to Daz Studio from Hex, you have options as what you'd like to accomplish, like replace an auto-morph, add a new morph, etc.,
    Absolutely low comparison to the Z, though - but Mud box, like all autodesk is like twice the price!
    Stu Sutcliff from here in the Carrara forums does stuff like this with 3d Coat:
    VanHelsing.jpg
    600 x 450 - 54K
    SmallCreature.jpg
    375 x 500 - 43K
  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    It's not the modeling of the morph that is hard. You can do that in practically anything. It's importing and applying the morph in carrara were you will run in to issues. With studio and Hex; with the Hex bridge, making and applying morphs is a breeze.
    Send to Hex from studio, do your morphing, send it back to studio name it, save it., done. In carrara it is a PITA to do the same thing.

  • SuperdogSuperdog Posts: 765
    edited December 1969

    ManStan said:
    It's not the modeling of the morph that is hard. You can do that in practically anything. It's importing and applying the morph in carrara were you will run in to issues. With studio and Hex; with the Hex bridge, making and applying morphs is a breeze.
    Send to Hex from studio, do your morphing, send it back to studio name it, save it., done. In carrara it is a PITA to do the same thing.

    That does sound easier. Can I change textures and redesign interiors and exteriors in Hex? Are modellers like zBrush and 3D Coat more for creating models from scratch?

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,543
    edited December 1969

    Superdog said:
    ManStan said:
    It's not the modeling of the morph that is hard. You can do that in practically anything. It's importing and applying the morph in carrara were you will run in to issues. With studio and Hex; with the Hex bridge, making and applying morphs is a breeze.
    Send to Hex from studio, do your morphing, send it back to studio name it, save it., done. In carrara it is a PITA to do the same thing.

    That does sound easier. Can I change textures and redesign interiors and exteriors in Hex? Are modellers like zBrush and 3D Coat more for creating models from scratch? Well, yes... but it also depends upon how you mean.

    I can't speak for 3d coat - or zbrush, for that matter, but...
    Even though ZBrush it probably incredible at starting from scratch, many Daz Morph artists use it to create morphs, and another app to conduct the modeling, like Hexagon, Silo, Modo... depending upon your needs, capabilities - likes and dislikes. More in a jif.

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,543
    edited February 2013

    One of the designers was just asking the others the same sort of questions - but not related to going into and from Carrara - just as general use of making and modifying morphs. Hexagon excels at this for Daz Studio, because of its bridge. I've never tried Zbrush, so I've never tried GoZ for Carrara. Hexagon is no Zbrush... but it is a good modeler. Since it's free... you can try it out and see for yourself. Not exactly sure what you meant by interiors and exteriors, though.
    Hexagon Information Page is Here
    You'll not be doing what you can do easily in Zbrush easily in either Carrara or Hexagon, though. And Mudbox is like, twice the price.

    Post edited by Dartanbeck on
  • SuperdogSuperdog Posts: 765
    edited December 1969

    Dartanbeck said:
    One of the designers was just asking the others the same sort of questions - but not related to going into and from Carrara - just as general use of making and modifying morphs. Hexagon excels at this for Daz Studio, because of its bridge. I've never tried Zbrush, so I've never tried GoZ for Carrara. Hexagon is no Zbrush... but it is a good modeler. Since it's free... you can try it out and see for yourself. Not exactly sure what you meant by interiors and exteriors, though.
    Hexagon Information Page is Here
    You'll not be doing what you can do easily in Zbrush easily in either Carrara or Hexagon, though. And Mudbox is like, twice the price.

    Ok thanks! I suppose the question I'm asking is what does zBrush/3D Coat add to the DS/Hexagon combination? Does zBrush do more accurate modelling? Does it paint textures much better than Carrara/DS/Hexagon? Why do many of the creators of DAZ content use zBrush rather than the DS/Carrara/Hexagon combination?

    By interiors/exteriors I meant non-organic models such as furniture, buildings. cars, clothes, environments etc. Is Hexagon any use for those?

  • MalusMalus Posts: 370
    edited February 2013

    I don't know if this has been suggested I just skimmed through it sorry, but sculptris is a good free alternative and made by the same people.

    http://www.pixologic.com/sculptris/


    Also if you don't want to sale anything then mudbox student would be good to have.

    Post edited by Malus on
  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,543
    edited February 2013

    This is what Zbrush and GoZ bring to the table for Carrara
    just a quick example by DAZBFurner
    Yeah... this is what I want!!!
    However, I do an awful lot of this already without Zbrush. Using the same steps in the video, except without going into Zbrush, Carrara does a great job by itself. I actually prefer Carrara's vertex modeler over Hexagon - but I was told that I'm kind of rare in that department. I really like it though.

    Post edited by Dartanbeck on
  • MiloMilo Posts: 511
    edited February 2013

    I wish we had AppLink for Carrara to 3d-Coat (AppLink is like goZ). I was told by a developer that looked into doing it that there are things that the SDK doesn't have that would be needed, that only the internal Daz Developers have access to apparently. The Developer of 3d-Coat offered to pay to have this done. 3d-Coat is very affordable (esp with the student/home edition) and has so many functions that could Tie back into Carrara beyond just the sculpting. Daz has not decided to put any resources towards this so far.

    Post edited by Milo on
  • Design AcrobatDesign Acrobat Posts: 459
    edited December 1969

    -_Milo_- said:
    I wish we had AppLink for Carrara to 3d-Coat (AppLink is like goZ). I was told by a developer that looked into doing it that there are things that the SDK doesn't have that would be needed, that only the internal Daz Developers have access to apparently. The Developer of 3d-Coat offered to pay to have this done. 3d-Coat is very affordable (esp with the student/home edition) and has so many functions that could Tie back into Carrara beyond just the sculpting. Daz has not decided to put any resources towards this so far.

    Yup and I don't understand whey there isn't, other than having programmers that want to do it and get a free copy of 3DCoat.

    Perhaps there is something wrong with Carrara interface that it can't be done without direct access to the code. I've heard rumors that the SDK for Carrara is quite troubled and incomplete. Rumors, but...ya know...

  • DartanbeckDartanbeck Posts: 21,543
    edited December 1969

    Design Acrobat said:
    -_Milo_- said:
    I wish we had AppLink for Carrara to 3d-Coat (AppLink is like goZ). I was told by a developer that looked into doing it that there are things that the SDK doesn't have that would be needed, that only the internal Daz Developers have access to apparently. The Developer of 3d-Coat offered to pay to have this done. 3d-Coat is very affordable (esp with the student/home edition) and has so many functions that could Tie back into Carrara beyond just the sculpting. Daz has not decided to put any resources towards this so far.

    Yup and I don't understand whey there isn't, other than having programmers that want to do it and get a free copy of 3DCoat.

    Perhaps there is something wrong with Carrara interface that it can't be done without direct access to the code. I've heard rumors that the SDK for Carrara is quite troubled and incomplete. Rumors, but...ya know...From what I understand, well... just from seeing Stu Sutcliff's work, 3dCoat R O C K S ! ! !
    That would be cool. We better make sure the Daz Spooky knows about this.

  • MiloMilo Posts: 511
    edited December 1969

    I have a bug report. Here is a thread where we started discussing it. Fenric looked into and found that it needed things not in the released SDK things that the GoZ was doing.

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/7042/

    There is a link to the bug report, it requires a separate login that you have to setup.

  • Design AcrobatDesign Acrobat Posts: 459
    edited February 2013

    -_Milo_- said:
    I have a bug report. Here is a thread where we started discussing it. Fenric looked into and found that it needed things not in the released SDK things that the GoZ was doing.

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/7042/

    There is a link to the bug report, it requires a separate login that you have to setup.

    Thanks Milo

    I found the technical explanation by reading the bug report.

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/7042/#100464

    Evidently Carrara's design is inhibiting an independently done plug-in for 3DCoat.

    Oh well, I have Lightwave and Go-Z.

    Post edited by Design Acrobat on
  • ZyloxZylox Posts: 787
    edited December 1969

    Superdog said:
    Dartanbeck said:
    One of the designers was just asking the others the same sort of questions - but not related to going into and from Carrara - just as general use of making and modifying morphs. Hexagon excels at this for Daz Studio, because of its bridge. I've never tried Zbrush, so I've never tried GoZ for Carrara. Hexagon is no Zbrush... but it is a good modeler. Since it's free... you can try it out and see for yourself. Not exactly sure what you meant by interiors and exteriors, though.
    Hexagon Information Page is Here
    You'll not be doing what you can do easily in Zbrush easily in either Carrara or Hexagon, though. And Mudbox is like, twice the price.

    Ok thanks! I suppose the question I'm asking is what does zBrush/3D Coat add to the DS/Hexagon combination? Does zBrush do more accurate modelling? Does it paint textures much better than Carrara/DS/Hexagon? Why do many of the creators of DAZ content use zBrush rather than the DS/Carrara/Hexagon combination?

    By interiors/exteriors I meant non-organic models such as furniture, buildings. cars, clothes, environments etc. Is Hexagon any use for those?


    Yes, Hexagon can be used to create non-organic models quite effectively. Here are a couple of links that show some of it's capabilities:

    Norwegian Coastal Freighter

    Examples of what people have done with Hexagon, look at page 2 and later

    Tutorial in the store on creating clothes for Genesis with Hexagon and DS

    Hexagon is dirt cheap, so you could try it out while saving money for a more expensive option. If you decide that Hexagon and Carrara's modelers will do all you need, you will have saved the extra money you would have spent.

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