MEC4D HDRI Beach Mega Pack or the lack of HDRIs

AndyS

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

Serene Night

I tend to depth of field HDR's so when I buy an HDRI set, it is with the intention that it look kind of blurry. For some reason, I don't care for the photo with the 3d character rendeed in front- unless the photo is indistinct.

I think its a good idea to have grounds in your HDRI's anyway, because a lot of time the ground can look flat.

Richard Haseltine

AndyS said:

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

HDRIs are not mesh, so of course the shadow won't match the terrain relief - if you want that you need to add geoemtry and make it a Matte so that it catches shadows without blocking the image.

The Diigitals

Richard Haseltine said:

AndyS said:

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

HDRIs are not mesh, so of course the shadow won't match the terrain relief - if you want that you need to add geoemtry and make it a Matte so that it catches shadows without blocking the image.

Would love some more details on his process!

Richard Haseltine

Mec4D very recently gave a mini-tutorial in a forum thread, which will probably serve far better than my attempt to explain sicne it's not a feature I use often.

AndyS

Richard Haseltine said:

AndyS said:

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

HDRIs are not mesh, so of course the shadow won't match the terrain relief - if you want that you need to add geoemtry and make it a Matte so that it catches shadows without blocking the image.

... as I stated above.

AndyS

Next problem with HDRI is what I demonstrated a long time ago in this thread.

As long you have the camera at its default location and the character in the center - everything is fine. (Dome coupled to the camera)
But as soon as you want to arrange around and using a wider area you run into the described distortion / size-mismatch problems.

Richard Haseltine

If you are making a general point about HDRIs - which you are, these are just the way they work - then you shouldn't be singling out one product as if it is at fault or falling short of the ideal HDRI.

kyoto kid

Richard Haseltine said:

AndyS said:

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

HDRIs are not mesh, so of course the shadow won't match the terrain relief - if you want that you need to add geoemtry and make it a Matte so that it catches shadows without blocking the image.

..this is part of why I don't like to use them and turn to settings built with mesh content instead and occasionally a photo backdrop on a plane primitive

peteVault

I really like this new set.

Bobvan

peteVault said:

I really like this new set.

Me too just scooped it I have found alot of quality free HRDI's on the net as well

nonesuch00

I like it too but I will wait to buy until after I have a chance to do the mini-tutorial MEC4D gave in the thread in the link below. From her renders you can see that really excellent and believable results are possible. Most of my attempts to use HRDI (and I have plenty of really good free ones from HRDIHaven & from MECD) have been not good technically.

Here is the link to that mini-tutorial thread;

https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/182196/mec4d

AndyS

Sorry Richard,

Richard Haseltine said:

If you are making a general point about HDRIs - which you are, these are just the way they work - then you shouldn't be singling out one product as if it is at fault or falling short of the ideal HDRI.

I didn't think, that you see it that way.

For general use - and I already stated it - the work of MEC4D is pretty nice.
But on the other hand this HDRI is a good example of some disadvantages and perhaps some details to avoid in the used pictures. In the thread especially about the latest creation you find some other users having and announcing similar problems.

3Diva

AndyS said:

Sorry Richard,

Richard Haseltine said:

If you are making a general point about HDRIs - which you are, these are just the way they work - then you shouldn't be singling out one product as if it is at fault or falling short of the ideal HDRI.

I didn't think, that you see it that way.

For general use - and I already stated it - the work of MEC4D is pretty nice.
But on the other hand this HDRI is a good example of some disadvantages and perhaps some details to avoid in the used pictures. In the thread especially about the latest creation you find some other users having and announcing similar problems.

In that case, you should probably rename the thread. Maybe something like "The problem with HDRIs" or something to that effect. The way you've titled it makes it sound like there is a problem with the MEC4D product, and as far as I know, there isn't. It looks like an outstanding product that is exactly what it's called, HDRI environments. If your issue is with HDRI environments themselves, then singling out a single product isn't the way to go about doing it, imo. I read your title and thought that there was a problem with the Mec4D product. I'm probably not the only one who thought that. 

MEC4D

Not really agree with everything you said, you can get it all you want , but there is a little work from your side , you can add planes with matte function, add reflections, altering the flat shadows and any other super options, I did not did all of that in the promos as I don't build a 3D scene for sale, it is just a tool and the rest is your creativity , as I mentioned already in my MEC4D thread before and I believe you read it already you can add more reality to your renders like the example below to match it as much as possible  .  I am in my tread for any suggestion or help : https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/2726001/#Comment_2726001

and btw the topic name is kinda confusing and sounds like complain or lack of HDRIs in the product, if you would like to change it since you talking about HDRIs, in general, I would really appreciate that

thank you in advance

Cath

P.S 2 shots with idea how better match hdri grounds using plane with matte functions, since the standard environment ground in iray has not enough settings to do that

AndyS said:

Hi,

at first please let me say, that the HDRIs in the "MEC4D HDRI Beach ... " Mega Pack look pretty nice.
And for just generating a good lighting and a nice background it may suit.

But for example please have a look at the 12th promo picture. Here you see that neither the shadow color, nor the shadowlines on the ground reflect the necessary reality.
The sandy ground shows a lot of elevations and depressions on short scale, but the shadows all run over it as straight lines.
So you have to keep in mind that here iRay using HDRI reached a reality limit.

My personal resumé:
Above ground the HDRIs are usefull for lighting and background image. But at the ground (and near environment) you better create your own environment structures.

 

MEC4D

P.S I am finishing my latest products this week and will have some time for doing videos with workflows for better usages of matching HDRI maps with iray beyond just lighting. As there is so much more that deserve your attention for better productivity and you don't need to be a specialist to do that.

3Diva

MEC4D said:

P.S I am finishing my latest products this week and will have some time for doing videos with workflows for better usages of matching HDRI maps with iray beyond just lighting. As there is so much more that deserve your attention for better productivity and you don't need to be a specialist to do that.

That sounds good! I Hope you post the link to them when you're done - I'm really looking forward to some tips on workflow and improving renders with HDRIs and Iray! :)

MEC4D

Definitelly I am going to add it to my MEC4D thread or you can find it on my youtube channel as well  

divamakeup said:

MEC4D said:

P.S I am finishing my latest products this week and will have some time for doing videos with workflows for better usages of matching HDRI maps with iray beyond just lighting. As there is so much more that deserve your attention for better productivity and you don't need to be a specialist to do that.

That sounds good! I Hope you post the link to them when you're done - I'm really looking forward to some tips on workflow and improving renders with HDRIs and Iray! :)