Game Developer License Changed??? Have to scrap my game now??
beowulfkaine_f87c8245ee
Posts: 13
I'm gone for like 5 seconds and I just realized they changed the developer license agreements for game development? It used to be you can buy a artists developer lic for like $500 and use their models, now its piecemeal stuff?? This method will actually cost me almost 3x more to use the models I've been using for my game! I have to completely start from scratch now and use other peoples models. I was going to use StoneMasons lic pack and for $800 it was a great deal, I had so many options, now I'm going to have to scrap buying his license and Daz3d's lic for $500 because I can't afford to pay piecemeal for everything that I've been using! So I was ready and willing to drop $1300 for Daz&Stone's lic and now they completely lost out of that because now I'd have to pay $3500+! Well, two steps backward, they had a good business model and now it's gone.
I get WHY they did this, but to eliminate the other option was dumb. It would have been better business savvy to allow designers the choice of either a full or partial lic. I guess Daz3d no longer needs game developers to buy their stuff.
Such a shame, it was a good run. Back to the drawing board, I guess. Really disappointing.
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afaik the old license you bought is still valid...best to confirm with DAZ before getting too upset
If you bought a license previously it is still valid, the terms have not changed.
Actually, it seems like beowulfkaine_f87 was in development of a game before purchasing any Commercial or Indie Game Developer licenses... which I'm guessing may be the case for several users.
Discovering the new licensing model would cost far more to buy individual licenses for all 3d models currently being used in their indie game currently in active development must have been quite an unexpected shock... I'm fairly certain many indie game devs out there are kicking themselves for not buying game developer licenses for all Daz Originals and other Published Artists' "full catalog" of products while they were being offered, before discontinuation with no advanced notice to end users.
I'm grateful that all previously purchased game developer licenses are being honored under the new EULA changes — I was one of the lucky few that purchased my game dev licenses before starting development and sale of those SKUs were discontinued — but it's unfortunate that the full catalog game developer licenses are no longer being offered for purchase in the store for game developers that were planning on purchasing their game developer licenses after their game(s) got closer to completion and being prepared for release.
It may still be possible to SAVE money under the new EULA, depending on how many products you're using in your project... but the latest licensing changes will likely force many indie game developers to scale back just how many products they use in their projects retroactively.
The Game Developer Licenses for Stonemason's catalog was one of the most expensive of all Published Artists...
Stonemason Indie Game Developer License
Game Developer License for Indie Developers to make use of Stonemason products.
(Developers with Personal or Business income of MORE than $100,000.00 annually.)
SKU: 24147
Regular Price: $800
Stonemason Commercial Game Developer License
Game Developer License for Indie Developers to make use of Stonemason products.
(Developers with Personal or Business income of MORE than $100,000.00 annually.)
SKU: 24148
Regular Price: $3,000
Special Price: $2,100
Note:Daz 3D published or brokered content MAY NOT be distributed under this license and is subject to the regular Daz 3D EULA.
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Indie Game Developer License
Game Developer License for Indie Developers
(Developers with Personal or Business income of LESS than $100,000.00 annually. All discounts are not applicable to this item.)
SKU: 12479
Regular Price: $500
Commercial Game Developer License
Game Developer License for Commercial Developers
(Developers with Personal or Business income of MORE than $100,000.00 annually. All discounts are not applicable to this item.)
SKU: 12479
Regular Price: $2,500
Note: DAZ 3D published or brokered content MAY NOT be distributed under this license and is subject to the regular DAZ 3D EULA. All discounts are not applicable to this item.
In summary...
Commercial Game Developer licenses of Daz Orignals and Stonemason's catalog used to cost $4,600 at "special price"—$5,600 at regular price.
Indie Game Developer licenses of Daz Originals and Stonemason's catalog used to cost $1300 at regular price — never did see a "special price" listed for Stonemason's indie game developer license... though some people have been able to take advantage of store sales & glitches in stacking sales of full Publised Artist catalogs.
While many Stonemason sets have Optional License Add-Ons: Interactive License for $50 each — many of the older, less expensive sets have Interactive License Add-Ons available for $10 each.
The threshold for $10 Add-On Interactive Licenses appears to be around ~$15:
I noticed Rubble 1: Urban Ruins is a $14.95 product with Add-On Interactive License for $10.
while Crates and Containers 2 is a $16.95 product with Add-On license for $35
The threshold for $35 Add-On Interactive Licenses appears to be between $15 - $20 products:
Crates and Containers 2 is a $16.95 product with Add-On Interactive License for $35,
and A Quiet Street is a $19.95 product with Add-On Interactive License for $35,
while Iray Clouds is a $24.95 product with Add-On Interactive License for $50.
as I understand it the game license is perpetual
You have to remember only the Daz game license is good for ever. The licenses for PAs lie Stonemasion where for one project only. So you would need to spend that 800 for ever product you released
Are the new licenses perpetual even for PA products?
Strangely Stonemason's items feel like they got the least price increase compared to other items.
But environments from DAZ aren't that interesting anymore in my opinion as they have to be setup first to look nice and there is always the question if they are modular enough to use well in games. I have bought a handfull DAZ environments from the store to experiment in a game engine but with the new license they have lost their attractiveness. I would return them now if it would be still possible as they got useless with the new license for me. Because for about $50 its already in the premium environment item range of other stores. There I get a completely setup item for the engine with a complete demo scene, a scene with every single piece well separated, animations for it, proper polycount, nice lighting and every material setup properly and looking nice. They come also with more content than what I get from any DAZ item I have seen so far with the same setting and everything is ready to use. One has to keep in mind I'm comparing here the license cost alone for the DAZ item with the whole item packages from another store so the DAZ license+item won't be even in the same price range. Such items from other stores also offer discounts which is gone with the new DAZ license so a $50 DAZ license item never goes below that. I would post examples to show what I refer to but from what I get we aren't allowed to link here to other stores.
Games typically require a ton of assets, and using models from daz3d for interactive "real-time" purposes actually requires putting in lots of additional customizations and optimizations to those assets to get them to work well in a real time interactive project, and that requires even more time and money on top of the content license fees and interactive license purchases from Daz 3D.
The current rate of ~$50 per asset for an add-on interactive license is pretty steep — especially considering it doesn't give you any additional "interactive ready" assets, it's just a license to do all of that work yourself to try and use it in your game...
Morph 3D, a subsidiary of Daz 3D, pretty much solves the problem above. The assets from Morph 3D are priced at more affordable rates for indie game dev projects at ~$15 per asset and ~$30 for bundles. Not only are those much more affordable, they're better prepared for game engines (Individual Prefab Assets, LOD Support, PBR Materials, Collidable Objects, Full Morph 3D character support, Optimized for Unity).
I also have a bunch of products licensed from Morph3D in the Unity Marketplace (in addition to Daz 3D) — but my issue with Morph 3D is that they are primarily focused on characters and clothing (that I've probably already licensed from Daz 3D) — and they have very few environments and props available. Morph 3D assets are tailored for the Unity game engine, so if you're using Unreal Engine or some other game engine... well, it will be more work to get those to work.
There are definitely advantages to licensing content from Daz 3D though — getting access to the original high resolution 3D and texture assets that work natively in Daz Studio and can be brought into Zbrush and Maya for generating high resolution 2D renders and animations for marketing materials (which is covered under the standard EULA and doesn't require an add-on licenses)... and then having the option to get an interactive license on top of that is quite helpful.
As the platforms and tools mature, I hope there will be a better path get content prepared for interactive use — Morph 3D is good, but I'd rather continue purchasing content licenses from Daz 3D, and have a better pipeline in place to get that content into any other form required with add-on licenses available for extending uses beyond the standard EULA.
I made most of my recent purchases from Daz with the intention to buy the Indie Dev License as I got closer to release. With no notice the Indie License product was removed and replaced with the individual license option, which has caused me to have to look elsewhere for production assets. This is unfortunate, and the result will be no more purchases by me from Daz. It is a shame, as the previous arrangement was ideal for my project.
Although I agree with what everyone has said, for me, there are now two distinct results from this change.
The pitfalls of this new program for me personally are these:
All of my stone mason assets, which predominated my entire game have now been scrapped and will be replaced with other assets. His assets are the most increased in price based on what my needs are. So his assets within my game are virtually gone, say for a few particular models.
Daz Based models will need to be used regardless, however, a good majority will be changed out for less expensive models and the game restructured around it. I simply cannot afford to go in the direction I was going at this price point.
That being said,
The benefits of this new program personally:
After examining my options while I looked for new assets, it quickly became clear to me that certain models that I would have liked to have used are now, in fact, available as a piecemeal purchase. This is actually a pretty big win as some developers models didn't even have a game license available. Although I have to graphically build my game from scratch now, I can do so with the premise that I can integrate some fresh ideas based on new model choices.
It would have been nice to at least be notified of the option to chose either-or. In my opinion, I see this as a financial loss in removing the old structure and not simply adding the new one to the already existing price license. I mean, what do they think is going to happen? They run out of "stock" of the game developer license and are not able to make any more? I mean that's like throwing money out the window for them.
In any case, I see this as an opportunity to revamp my game graphically at a significantly reduced price providing I stay away from Stonemason's stuff, which is a shame, he's a great artist.
End of line.