Backup drives

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  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,940

     

    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

    I've used WD disks only for the last 15 years, bought over 50 during that time I think. I think about 12-15% have failed during that time though some first after several years. A couple have had bad sectors but after they were reallocated they have been running fine since.

    The worst problem I've seen with their newer drives is weak sectors - sectors that are readable but are very slow to read (many retries). One was simply unusable because of a lot of weak sectors in the area where the MFT was located, which made it extremely slow. I couldn't figure out what was wrong as WD's own diagnostic tools reported it was OK. I changed cables, SATA ports etc. but nothing helped. Then I came across HDSentinel and ran a full surface test, which revealed all those weak sectors. I've attached the test results - all the dark blocks have weak sectors, the darker the weaker they are. The performance test shows a similar poor performance in those areas. A disk like that should not be able pass QA IMO.

     

     

    Hmmm, thats VERY interesting to me.  I DO have a HD that does check out fine but when I access it it takes a while to show my files but I don't hear any grinding or any extra noise like that from it so I thought "I have no idea why this drive is acting this way" sort of thinking.  Is there a link to the tool you mentioned? Also does it repair these areas or is this just an informational tool?

    https://www.hdsentinel.com/index.php

    I does repair (reallocate bad sectors) as well as it can reinitialize the disk. There is a difference between the Standard and the Pro version regarding how many different surface test options there are, I'm not sure if the standard version has those I have used here. The screenshots shows all the surface tests from the Pro version.  

    It's a really great tool and their support is outstanding, and the license is lifetime (all upgrades free).

     

     

    HDSentinelPro_surface_tests.jpg
    635 x 2484 - 778K
  • IceDragonArtIceDragonArt Posts: 12,548

    I've had to move my library for both my PC and my Laptop to an external simply because I don't have room on my C drive on either one of them. I've currently got 2 Seagate drives, I went with WD at first but both of them failed very quickly, one within 2 weeks.  I have a another Seagate in a box that I need to make time to add my libray to just in case.  Keep in mind I run those external drives every single day for at least 4-6 hours.  I've had them about a year now.  So far so good.  But of course, one just never knows which is why I have a third. I paid around $100 to $125 for each of them. On Amazon.  Who replaced the drive that failed in the first two weeks with no questions asked.

     

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212
    Taoz said:

     

    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

    I've used WD disks only for the last 15 years, bought over 50 during that time I think. I think about 12-15% have failed during that time though some first after several years. A couple have had bad sectors but after they were reallocated they have been running fine since.

    The worst problem I've seen with their newer drives is weak sectors - sectors that are readable but are very slow to read (many retries). One was simply unusable because of a lot of weak sectors in the area where the MFT was located, which made it extremely slow. I couldn't figure out what was wrong as WD's own diagnostic tools reported it was OK. I changed cables, SATA ports etc. but nothing helped. Then I came across HDSentinel and ran a full surface test, which revealed all those weak sectors. I've attached the test results - all the dark blocks have weak sectors, the darker the weaker they are. The performance test shows a similar poor performance in those areas. A disk like that should not be able pass QA IMO.

     

     

    Hmmm, thats VERY interesting to me.  I DO have a HD that does check out fine but when I access it it takes a while to show my files but I don't hear any grinding or any extra noise like that from it so I thought "I have no idea why this drive is acting this way" sort of thinking.  Is there a link to the tool you mentioned? Also does it repair these areas or is this just an informational tool?

    https://www.hdsentinel.com/index.php

    I does repair (reallocate bad sectors) as well as it can reinitialize the disk. There is a difference between the Standard and the Pro version regarding how many different surface test options there are, I'm not sure if the standard version has those I have used here. The screenshots shows all the surface tests from the Pro version.  

    It's a really great tool and their support is outstanding, and the license is lifetime (all upgrades free).

     

     

    Hmmm, no freebie just paid for versions. I don't mind if it can repair my G drive without destroying the data.  Do you have Pro or regular?

  • MattymanxMattymanx Posts: 6,902

    If you want a back up drive that will last, put all your money into a top end drive.

     

    Western Digital Gold - https://www.wdc.com/products/internal-storage/wd-gold-enterprise-class-hard-drive.html - It is their highest end drives and are intended to run 24/7.  They cost the same as the Black performance drives.  You would need an external casing for it but StarTech makes lots of those.

     

    And I dont know why you are worried about some magical 3 year mark, I have drives that are much older that are just fine.  Though I have also had ones that died within a year so...

  • TheKDTheKD Posts: 2,691
    edited December 2017

    I think I must be very lucky, I have owned 12 HD's, only one started failing on me, I was able to replace it before anything was lost. The oldest HD I am still using is ~10 years old, use it as a scratch disk these days. All the other ones I stopped using only because I replaced them with larger capacity ones. Have had both seagate and WD ones, I think one was a toshiba, not totally sure though.

    Post edited by TheKD on
  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255
    edited December 2017
    Mattymanx said:

    And I dont know why you are worried about some magical 3 year mark, I have drives that are much older that are just fine.  Though I have also had ones that died within a year so...

    No magic, just statistics smiley

    Statistically, there's a high likelihood that an HDD will last 3-5 years. In other words, after 3-5 years, in general, it's reasonable to assume that maybe 10% of drives (or something like that) will fail under normal use. Doesn't mean your particular drive will only last 3 years, or maybe your drive might fail in 6 months, or maybe it will be around for 15 years. But as a general trend people assume that after 3-5 years the average drive will become more likely to fail. 

    But for many of us, that's the same time span after which we replace or upgrade our computers anyway, so it's somewhat irrelevant. And if you also keep a backup, it becomes super irrelevant.

    Of course, you never know when a particular drive will fail, all you can do is look at the statistics and the likelihood if you really care.  

     

    Post edited by ebergerly on
  • TaozTaoz Posts: 9,940
    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

     

    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

    I've used WD disks only for the last 15 years, bought over 50 during that time I think. I think about 12-15% have failed during that time though some first after several years. A couple have had bad sectors but after they were reallocated they have been running fine since.

    The worst problem I've seen with their newer drives is weak sectors - sectors that are readable but are very slow to read (many retries). One was simply unusable because of a lot of weak sectors in the area where the MFT was located, which made it extremely slow. I couldn't figure out what was wrong as WD's own diagnostic tools reported it was OK. I changed cables, SATA ports etc. but nothing helped. Then I came across HDSentinel and ran a full surface test, which revealed all those weak sectors. I've attached the test results - all the dark blocks have weak sectors, the darker the weaker they are. The performance test shows a similar poor performance in those areas. A disk like that should not be able pass QA IMO.

     

     

    Hmmm, thats VERY interesting to me.  I DO have a HD that does check out fine but when I access it it takes a while to show my files but I don't hear any grinding or any extra noise like that from it so I thought "I have no idea why this drive is acting this way" sort of thinking.  Is there a link to the tool you mentioned? Also does it repair these areas or is this just an informational tool?

    https://www.hdsentinel.com/index.php

    I does repair (reallocate bad sectors) as well as it can reinitialize the disk. There is a difference between the Standard and the Pro version regarding how many different surface test options there are, I'm not sure if the standard version has those I have used here. The screenshots shows all the surface tests from the Pro version.  

    It's a really great tool and their support is outstanding, and the license is lifetime (all upgrades free).

     

     

    Hmmm, no freebie just paid for versions. I don't mind if it can repair my G drive without destroying the data.  Do you have Pro or regular?

    Pro. You can't repair weak sectors though as they're caused by weaknesses in the magnetic layer, but if the problem is bad (bad performance) you can probably have the drive replaced under warranty.

  • CybersoxCybersox Posts: 9,053
    edited December 2017
    TheKD said:

    I think I must be very lucky, I have owned 12 HD's, only one started failing on me, I was able to replace it before anything was lost. The oldest HD I am still using is ~10 years old, use it as a scratch disk these days. All the other ones I stopped using only because I replaced them with larger capacity ones. Have had both seagate and WD ones, I think one was a toshiba, not totally sure though.

    So far, I've had two total failures out of around conventional 30 drives I've used during the PC era... unless you also count the two that were in a computer that got struck by lightning :0 and several externals where the problem wasn't the drive but the external interface, so the data was recoverable.  So, 2 out of 30 is roughly a 6% failure rate, and I primarily use Seagate and Western Digital drives... though, of the two total failures, one was a Lacie external drive, which, when I opened it up, turned out to actually be a Hitachi drive.  The other was the manufacturer installed drive in my main laptop, but, to be fair, that laptop had literally gone around the world dozens of times and taken a lot of abuse. I've got another drive that is "suspect" right now... a Western Digital... so I transferred everything off of it and rarely use it.  I will note that of the drives wth interface issues, two were Seagate externals and the other, IIRC, was an Archos, and I've also had one flash drive go wonky on me.  That one was strange, as it worked great normally, except that, every so often, when writing over an existing file with a newer copy, it would show that it was saving the new version, but it actually wasn't and the old version would remain instead. :/  I got in the habit of always doing "save as" and adding a draft number as a result, since the drive seemed to work flawlessly as long as I did that, and replaced it as quickly as I could.   

     

     

     
    Post edited by Cybersox on
  • RSand55RSand55 Posts: 158

    I've been using Seagate mechanical drives for years without problem. I try to regularly do a full backup clone and then safely store the cloned drive. If anything were to happen, all I'd have to do is install the clone and then update apps instead of reinstalling everything. Seems to work.

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212
    Taoz said:
    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

     

    RAMWolff said:
    Taoz said:

    I've used WD disks only for the last 15 years, bought over 50 during that time I think. I think about 12-15% have failed during that time though some first after several years. A couple have had bad sectors but after they were reallocated they have been running fine since.

    The worst problem I've seen with their newer drives is weak sectors - sectors that are readable but are very slow to read (many retries). One was simply unusable because of a lot of weak sectors in the area where the MFT was located, which made it extremely slow. I couldn't figure out what was wrong as WD's own diagnostic tools reported it was OK. I changed cables, SATA ports etc. but nothing helped. Then I came across HDSentinel and ran a full surface test, which revealed all those weak sectors. I've attached the test results - all the dark blocks have weak sectors, the darker the weaker they are. The performance test shows a similar poor performance in those areas. A disk like that should not be able pass QA IMO.

     

     

    Hmmm, thats VERY interesting to me.  I DO have a HD that does check out fine but when I access it it takes a while to show my files but I don't hear any grinding or any extra noise like that from it so I thought "I have no idea why this drive is acting this way" sort of thinking.  Is there a link to the tool you mentioned? Also does it repair these areas or is this just an informational tool?

    https://www.hdsentinel.com/index.php

    I does repair (reallocate bad sectors) as well as it can reinitialize the disk. There is a difference between the Standard and the Pro version regarding how many different surface test options there are, I'm not sure if the standard version has those I have used here. The screenshots shows all the surface tests from the Pro version.  

    It's a really great tool and their support is outstanding, and the license is lifetime (all upgrades free).

     

     

    Hmmm, no freebie just paid for versions. I don't mind if it can repair my G drive without destroying the data.  Do you have Pro or regular?

    Pro. You can't repair weak sectors though as they're caused by weaknesses in the magnetic layer, but if the problem is bad (bad performance) you can probably have the drive replaced under warranty.

    Hmmm, OK.  Yea, every boot into the system it brings up the drive info for all my drives and the G drive has a red X next too it so not sure what that means.  I tried reading what info about my G drive that lead to it being marked like that but I can't find any report on it anywhere in the boxes that have info on it.  You have any idea what the X means? 

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212

    Thanks good people for your suggestions. 

    After a bit more research I think I'm going to go with this one:

     

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00E262AHO/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A10XTVRAJRWPGO&psc=1

  • RAMWolffRAMWolff Posts: 10,212

    Hey Matty... Well as it turns out that little program that Taoz turned me on too did have some free information.. in my task bar thingy on the right side there is that little pop up, in that little pop up I had new icons, with numbers.  One of them had that red X on it as mentioned above in a previous post so I double clicked on it and it gave me a run down my G drive... it warned me that I would experience things like slow downs and even BSoD and yup I've been having those.  SO I turned off the drive and rebooted and all is well.  THAT'S why I've been have this little tap on my shoulder this past month or so to investigate and invest in a new drive.  So I'm glad I'm going that route.  It's too bad that drive has been a well used drive.  I've decided to go with the one just above this post as it's good for what I need it for and is an enterprise drive so SHOULD last me a while. The drive that's going south was a gift from a client years ago (come to think of it) and was used and reformatted and she even warned me that she had no idea how much more life it had in it....

    Here is the read out from the program:

     

    There are 12920 bad sectors on the disk surface. The contents of these sectors were moved to the spare area.

    The drive found 1752 bad sectors during its self test.

    There are 1752 weak sectors found on the disk surface. They may be remapped any time in the later use of the disk.
    238 errors occurred during data transfer.

    In case of sudden system crash, reboot, blue-screen-of-death, inaccessible file(s)/folder(s), it is recommended to verify data and power cables, connections - and if possible try different cables to prevent further problems.

    More information: http://www.hdsentinel.com/hard_disk_case_communication_error.php

    It is recommended to examine the log of the disk regularly. All new problems found will be logged there.

    It is recommended to backup immediately to prevent data loss.

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