Time To Say Goodbye

2

Comments

  • jerriecanjerriecan Posts: 470
    edited December 1969

    Is this the one you were looking for?

    http://www.tuitzone.com/DazTut.html

    As for the OP... I think the community is stronger with you than without you. I also understand burnout, for whatever reason. You have to do what's best for yourself. I hope you'll come back someday, but if not, then know that you made an impact and will be missed. Either way,. take care.

  • Dream CutterDream Cutter Posts: 1,222
    edited July 2013

    Ledhead - I totally recognize the feelings and concerns you raise. I'm in your boat, and in the same deep water. Hoping this can be a long and prosperous activity. The way I see it your concerned if your content investment is 1: Convenient & Accessible, 2: Leverage-able (work 4 you), 3: Remains best value. 4: Gets utilized.

    I am a recreational gold prospector too. I found acquiring more claims, more tools and more resources does not necessarily lead to more reward. In prospecting the experience fun and gold are your rewards, tangible or not. With DAZ 3D art, the realization imagination is one reward, art sales or audience feedback may be the "tangible" reward.

    Like prospecting I develop in 3D for the tangible and intangible rewards. I enjoy the community immensely, I like the challenge and never-ending learning experience, and I relish the ability to publish my works on the internet - and leave a legacy for ever. Digital data ability to get replicated forever in the internet without degradation makes it the modern age equivalent representing your life's work in the bas-relief of a granite tomb.
    Like prospecting, my 3d work yields some tangible results. I have sold some figures, and I use the 3d art capability to make topic/theme based websites. The 3d content is used to make 2d graphics, video animations and even video games. (have the DAZ game licenses). I will even be using DAZ figures to animate a virtual machine shop (in works). Using easy 3d publishing tools like CopperCube - I can output in 3d on a web page. Users can actually explore my virtual worlds in 3d on their web browser or tablet (Android APP). These virtual experiences like the machine shop will be used to introduce (Nintendo Head Kids) to the world of Industrial Arts and that it can be fun. Most $ I earn from websites covers cost with most revenue obtained from Ads and affiliate sales programs.

    So what are you in it for, the renders? The collect-ability and organization? (Collecting Stamps may be easier) , Game development, Multi-Media, Scrap Booking, Paper Dolls, Video Animations, Web-Site, or some form of monitization/business from the content.

    Being retired from employment, I now operate a small tool company and 3d design and media business. I jocky hats and activities from 6am to 11pm. I operate from a small home office and and Maker Place (Its awesome, makerplace.com). Maker Place allows me to engage other like minded folks and get my hands on cool tools from CNC to 3d printers.

    When DIM came out, I deleted my obsessively organized (failure) runtimes and went with the DIM default "My Library". I name glad I did, dont look back. I let NEED drive my requirements to find something in my RT. I DONT worry about it until then. Dont have that much hair left so cant worry the small stuff. TIME is the one thing we can not replace... I tried 3d explore tools like P3DO, while it works, at the moment of need - search content library or browsing for the item is what works. Also I dont wrestle with smart content - If its genesis and it works - great. If not - I MOVE ON.
    Finally re: leveraging investment. TEACH - Teach your grand kids or take your experience to the local H/S and offer training 3d rendering & animation after school. You never think twice weather you wasted your $ when you see some kid take a shine on what you demonstrate.
    Hope this encourages you. Feel free to contact me should you require more inspiration. :) And if in San Diego - visit Maker Place.

    Post edited by Dream Cutter on
  • Muon QuarkMuon Quark Posts: 562
    edited July 2013

    jerriecan said:
    Is this the one you were looking for?

    http://www.tuitzone.com/DazTut.html

    As for the OP... I think the community is stronger with you than without you. I also understand burnout, for whatever reason. You have to do what's best for yourself. I hope you'll come back someday, but if not, then know that you made an impact and will be missed. Either way,. take care.


    YES!!! I think everyone should go go through this tutorial in order to understand the DS folder structure, where files go, what the file extensions are, and how to organize. It is outdated but I highly recommend it to learn about the file structure of DS.

    Thanks Jerriecan!

    Post edited by Muon Quark on
  • Jason GalterioJason Galterio Posts: 2,562
    edited December 1969

    Ledhead said:
    I wanted to share with the community on how I feel about my experience with the digital art world and in particular Digital Art Zone....

    I completely sympathize with your situation as well. Sadly I don't have any answer or suggestion to offer. I have tried many different methods to organize content and have never been very happy with any of them.

    I currently have 3,500+ items installed to a single runtime. Just because I gave up trying to organize things. And I don't use the Smart Content tab because so much content of mine did not have meta information.

    So trying to find things feels like Mad Max wandering the desert trying to find gasoline.

    The lose of the Readme files stings too, since that use to be my "go to" database for a content library.

    I called it quits once before, after DAZ's coupon incentive program took a turn for the worst in 2005. But I came back a few years later. Sadly it seems like I am heading towards the same result.

  • LordHardDrivenLordHardDriven Posts: 937
    edited December 1969

    Ledhead said:
    I wanted to share with the community on how I feel about my experience with the digital art world and in particular Digital Art Zone. First and foremost I think the community itself is full of fantastic people who seem to have no problem in sharing their experience and knowledge in helping others in any way they can. You guys are what have kept me coming back to DAZ for the past year and a half. Your wit and charm makes a person feel as though they are part of something unique that so many others are missing out on. I honestly appreciate each and every one of you, well almost all of you.

    Now to the point of writing this which is I have wasted so much money at this site it makes me want to cry. I have spent over 10 grand in the short time period I have been interested in digital art. Now maybe to some people that is nothing more than a drop in the bucket, but for me being a newbie and not really having that much money because of the economy, which by the way seems to finally be picking back up this year, it has been a significant amount that feels like I completely just threw it away. The reason I say this is because of all the time I have wasted in trying to organize a complete disaster into something workable has gotten me so fed up. I have no time to learn the program because of all the time put into keeping content in order so I can find it and to make sure I don’t purchase it again. I read in a forum somewhere where DAZ itself is not going to pursue another way of organizing content other than the way the community has given input on (I hope you understand what I just said because I sure as hell didn’t). I guess what I am saying is the way the content is organized out of the box is the best it’s ever going to get, and according to DAZ it seems the way it is organized is the way the community thought was best. Well even if the entire list of PA’s followed it to the letter, it is unworkable for me and it seems unworkable for many of you, except for those that have been in the community for a lengthy period of time who are used to it and accept it for what it is. I have compared the way I organize my content with many of you who have shared the way they do it and there are so many similarities it’s uncanny. But it seems nowhere near the same as DAZ does it or prefers it done. I hear many people say they are not going to change something because they have their runtime a certain way and are not going to change it at this point in their lifetime. These are the people who understand what I am talking about. They have put so much of their time and effort categorizing content, they in no way want to start that process all over again. So what I am saying is I have gotten to the point of aggravation because DAZ continues to not listen to the community about the way things are organized. They keep pushing out new product which is still in a disorganized mess that we as artists have to reorganize because their sense of organization is complete crap. Is this all because of the way Poser started it? I honestly have no idea. What I do know is as soon as I finally was getting the content into a manageable working order, DAZ came out with new software and I had to start all over again, for the third time. So up to this point I have spent all of my time trying to keep things in order rather than using all of it for the reason I purchased it, to create art, or at least some semblance of art.

    I have at this point categorized less than one fourth of all my content. It is such a long process. I organize it using the category window and creating my own folders as I go. There has got to be a better way than this. I guess by accepting the way it is already done for you would certainly be the best way if you accept the fact you may never find it. I have grown tired of installing content and then organizing it so I know where it is. In other words, I am through with this. I just don’t have the time nor do I want to waste any more time on it. I guess it is another lesson learned and a loss of some money, but no more. I’m sure I will continue to tinker with it, but as far as making it a part of my life, not any longer. If only DAZ had made a separate piece of software that was set up for organizing content that Studio accessed, wow that would have been so much better than the way it is. So guys, I will try to stop in and say hello every so often, but this guy is through with this charade of wasting my money on something that takes way too long trying to make sense of it. Thank you for all your time and all your laughs that we have shared. Also thank you for putting up with my bitching and moaning I have done over this period of time. I can be a difficult person at times, but very lovable also. So long DAZ community, I’ve really enjoyed you.

    Roy aka “Ledhead”

    I've never met you Roy, never talked to you in the forums that I recall and yet I feel as if I know you, perhaps because our stories are very similar the biggest difference being that I've been here longer (over 10 years now). I really do feel your pain, I didn't do it in a short span of time like you but I too have dropped obscene amounts of money on a hobby that I get very little in return from because I spend so much time just trying to make it workable for me. All total the money I've spent on a purely self indulgent hobby in my case (meaning I don't use it for work or to make money) is enough to buy a nice, brand new, truck, SUV or Mini Van outright in cash or to make a substantial down payment (in excess of 20%) on a single family home in a decent neighborhood. In return all I have to show for it is a lot of stuff that is so difficult to work with I spend way more time trying to make it more user friendly for me, then I do actually enjoying using it. So yeah, it's extremely frustrating especially when it wouldn't be all that difficult for the creators of this content to make it less disorganized, less difficult to work with rather then convey the impression that you better like it or leave it because they're content to leave things the way they are now even though they too can see how difficult it can be to manage.

    I hope you take Lars advice and just step back and take a break for now. Things will seem better once you let the frustration you feel now pass. Who knows, maybe while taking a break you'll have some epiphany on how to better manage your content that is less time consuming for you? Besides, and let's be honest with ourselves, if you keep coming by to visit friends you know you're going to want to buy more things in the future. People like us that drop large sums of money on a purely indulgent hobby are typically impulse buyers. We see something like a nice, new, cool looking Stonemason set and we go, "Oooooooo, me like, me want, me gotta have".

    Also, while you shouldn't have to, there are ways you can organize things when you install them, at least in Poser, and probably in Studio too although I don't know because I haven't tried yet. That will eliminate the difficulty in finding things. The key though and what many people neglect to do is once it's all set up, make a backup so that when a drive fails or the runtime somehow get corrupted you don't have to repeat what will likely be a long, slow, tedious, process. Now I could tell you how I do it but that's probably a waste of time because what works for me may not work for you because each of us have unique brains that see things in differing ways. Just to give you an idea though. Currently my runtime is about half a terabyte and I've yet to finish installing more then half of my total collection of content. Still at half a terabyte that's a lot of individual items and folders (100's of thousands of folders) to scan thru trying to find something that may or may not be labeled in a way that's easily recognizable at a glance. So I came up with a system where now I can find anything I'm looking for in a matter of seconds. I first group everything by figure, in other words in the main library folder the first level of sub folders are things like V3, V4, M3, M4, Aiko 3, Aiko 4 etc. Then in those folders things are further separated by whether it's clothing, hair, prop, material pose, position pose, etc and then in the folder level below that you start to see the names of the items reflected in the folder names. So say I want to put the Morphing Fantasy Dress on V4 I don't have to try to remember the name the vendor assigned to the folder containing it and hunt for that in a mish mash of folders that are also containing things for every other figure I have installed. I go to C:\runtime\Program Files\Smith Micro\Poser\Runtime\Libraries\Character\V4\Clothing\Dresses\Morphing Fantasy Dress. That's just to give you an idea of how I changed the process of finding things though and not meant to suggest that's how anyone else should organize things. Like I said our minds all work in ways unique to us and so we need to come up with our own systems that make sense to us.

    Anyway, take a break, go enjoy some time fishing, taking walks or whatever it is you like to do to relax and unwind and escape for a bit. I think in time you'll feel less like giving up and more like bending this hobby to your will rather then feel like you are victim to the wills of others.

  • TomTombaTomTomba Posts: 29
    edited December 1969

    Sounds like I may have had a somewhat similar experience to you. Bought a lot of content over the past couple of years. Hitting the purchase button became an expensive addiction. Struggled with finding the time to install and organize everything. Tried to categorize within separate runtimes. (But what to do when a product can serve multiple categories?) A lot of stuff remained uninstalled as I procrastinated on getting organized.

    Then DIM came along and I said enough, everything goes into one folder. It took a couple of days to re-install with DIM and create and add content to custom categories. But now I can generally find things. I've tried to keep my categories fairly simple. Looked at AdamR's category setup, but decided I'd do with something simpler to get going quicker. I can always develop further levels of refinement down the road if I need to.

    Now when I buy stuff, I DIM it, find it in content library under Products, and add it to my categories.

    I don't spend much time with Smart Content, because it resembles an unsupervised playground; I'm annoyed that Daz does not hold content providers to strict data standards, (as does, say, Apple, when it forces developers to put their iOS apps in strict categories).

    Anyhow, while not perfect, I've found using custom categories workable, and way less time consuming than before. If you decide to come back, I encourage you to explore whether a simplified workflow might save you time.

    I thought I would quit DAZ because of the organizational time suck, but DIM changed that.

    Its other things that make me think my spending at DAZ will drop off:

    a) my perception of rising content prices (I used to find values in fast grabs, now fast grabs are often over five bucks at 70% off and I just won't afford those prices; flash sales sometimes show good value, but I'm tired of having to hunt for values in sales, apart from true sales like the PA fall sale)

    b) the release of repetitive content (like skimpwear, which I don't use)

    c) the potential wane of Genesis 1 content; I don't need ultrarealistic gender-specific content; I'm not willing to buy inflexible content

    Anyhow, enough about me... I hope that if an image or story draws you back to 3Dart, that you find a way to mitigate the distraction of content organization.

    Best with your endeavors...

  • Dream CutterDream Cutter Posts: 1,222
    edited December 1969

    Moral of this thread - we are not alone! We need to have an annual convention in Vegas!


    - to keep the secret, secret from the wallet-watcher - she shall remain unnamed ;)

  • mrposermrposer Posts: 1,130
    edited December 1969

    Hey Ledhead.... I can relate to your post as I have the same concern about the amount of money spent. The way I try to justify it is by comparing it to food. If you look back at the amount you have spent on food it would be alot... but with 3D content you can consume it over and over again. Its good to go on 3D diets... try to avoid snacking at every daily DAZ sale... but like all my diets I end up binging on the latest Pro bundle.

    As far as content management and lost content..... I use PzDB which I like. And I will say the new improvements at DAZ... like knowing you have already bought something even in a bundle are real timesavers. Even the DIM can be very useful... you can customize the install tab to point subsets of your products to install wherever you want..

    I too find the community here very supportive so I hope you decide to keep us in your online social world and like Wendy mentioned keep your hobbies fun whether they be 3D or something else.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,204
    edited December 1969

    I spent an unintended 10K on a car last year because I had a prang and wrote my old one off.
    regret that more than spending at Daz!
    and God only knows how much I spent on alcohol previously, not as much as others on smokes though
    do not go by totals of money spent on stuff
    a cruise or overseas holiday is shorter and costs more

  • robkelkrobkelk Posts: 3,259
    edited December 1969

    Moral of this thread - we are not alone! We need to have an annual convention in Vegas!

    With the amount we spend on Daz products, who can afford to go to Vegas?
  • Lissa_xyzLissa_xyz Posts: 6,116
    edited July 2013

    It's always sad to see a member go, but I understand your reasoning. I don't think we've had too many run ins as I've only recently come back myself within the last two months or so after a 6 month hiatus, but you seem like one of the ones who want to better the community and not just sit back and watch things unfold. I hope you find what you need and can eventually come back. Until then, I wish you luck with wherever things take you. =)


    (I'd LOVE to see a breakdown of how much I've spent, how many of those items are DO's, and how much I've saved (or not?) by being a PC member--- but I think there's a reason we don't have that info lol)

    Post edited by Lissa_xyz on
  • Muon QuarkMuon Quark Posts: 562
    edited December 1969

    Vaskania said:
    It's always sad to see a member go, but I understand your reasoning. I don't think we've had too many run ins as I've only recently come back myself within the last two months or so after a 6 month hiatus, but you seem like one of the ones who want to better the community and not just sit back and watch things unfold. I hope you find what you need and can eventually come back. Until then, I wish you luck with wherever things take you. =)


    (I'd LOVE to see a breakdown of how much I've spent, how many of those items are DO's, and how much I've saved (or not?) by being a PC member--- but I think there's a reason we don't have that info lol)

    I just tallied my 3D expenses today since I started in Oct 2006. This includes all sites I buy from:

    $7911.93

    I'm not home and I can't remember my SM login to get what I've spent on buying Poser. I imagine it will put me over 8 grand.

  • JessaiiJessaii Posts: 845
    edited December 1969

    Im too afraid to look at how much Ive spent in the 6 years Ive been doing this but I think content management is always going to be something that can never be agreed on how it should be done by everyone. Everyone handles file/folder structures differently. I am picky with how I want my files to be organized to the way that works best for me, so yes its alot of time sorting things and its a constant battle but at least i know where all my things are at the end of the day. Also I am an impulse shopper so have to spend additional time going through and removing things i really dont want but bought because it was on sale LOL. I wouldnt quit because sorting has got you down. Maybe you need to jsut start over fresh and only install the things you cant live with out, one by one and figure out a system that works best for you. My way is crazy and tedious but works for me and I wouldnt have it any other way :D

  • MattymanxMattymanx Posts: 6,902
    edited December 1969

    yeah, content management can be fun...

    On that note, this is my method of madness - http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/2460/#32068

  • Dino GrampsDino Gramps Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    After trying numerous ways of organizing I finally settled on making a folder for each item I purchase with the promo pic. Each folder is then filed under category folders as I see fit in a separate folder labeled DAZ which sits on my desktop. If it is a non-DAZ purchased product I also include the readme. I use DIM and let it have its fun which should put most of the DAZ products in Products under Content. This system only adds at most a minute per product over the actual installation time. I can add or change categories easily and quickly. I need to play catch up, as I have just recently figured this all out, but this actually works for me, as opposed to any other system I tried.

    I understand your frustration Ledhead. Step away for awhile, but come back.

  • FSMCDesignsFSMCDesigns Posts: 12,754
    edited December 1969

    Silver said:
    Im too afraid to look at how much Ive spent in the 6 years Ive been doing this but I think content management is always going to be something that can never be agreed on how it should be done by everyone. Everyone handles file/folder structures differently. I am picky with how I want my files to be organized to the way that works best for me, so yes its alot of time sorting things and its a constant battle but at least i know where all my things are at the end of the day. Also I am an impulse shopper so have to spend additional time going through and removing things i really dont want but bought because it was on sale LOL. I wouldnt quit because sorting has got you down. Maybe you need to jsut start over fresh and only install the things you cant live with out, one by one and figure out a system that works best for you. My way is crazy and tedious but works for me and I wouldnt have it any other way :D

    Agreed, I have my own system with 12 different runtimes and it's no big deal for me. I have had 2 times where content got out of whack, so i just started from scratch again since I save all my installers and zips. I also do not use DIM or smart content metadata, but I kinda get it, if it isn't enjoyable anymore, then time to move on.

    It's funny, i went back to poser 2012 to work with Reality for poser and couldn't believe how frustrating and slow the library palette in poser was, mad the DS one seems like a Godsend.

    See ya, take care!

  • LordHardDrivenLordHardDriven Posts: 937
    edited December 1969

    Vaskania said:
    It's always sad to see a member go, but I understand your reasoning. I don't think we've had too many run ins as I've only recently come back myself within the last two months or so after a 6 month hiatus, but you seem like one of the ones who want to better the community and not just sit back and watch things unfold. I hope you find what you need and can eventually come back. Until then, I wish you luck with wherever things take you. =)


    (I'd LOVE to see a breakdown of how much I've spent, how many of those items are DO's, and how much I've saved (or not?) by being a PC member--- but I think there's a reason we don't have that info lol)

    Hmmmm maybe that's why they allowed Content Database to fail? It used to give that kind of break down, with even more options I believe. Actually it hasn't totally failed, it's just the ability to scan your history became broken in the site upgrades and nobody is supporting the database with updates. One could manually go thru their history though and manually enter it into the database and then you could get that info but it would be a lot of work for anyone with a sizeable collection of content.

  • LordHardDrivenLordHardDriven Posts: 937
    edited December 1969

    Vaskania said:
    It's always sad to see a member go, but I understand your reasoning. I don't think we've had too many run ins as I've only recently come back myself within the last two months or so after a 6 month hiatus, but you seem like one of the ones who want to better the community and not just sit back and watch things unfold. I hope you find what you need and can eventually come back. Until then, I wish you luck with wherever things take you. =)


    (I'd LOVE to see a breakdown of how much I've spent, how many of those items are DO's, and how much I've saved (or not?) by being a PC member--- but I think there's a reason we don't have that info lol)

    I just tallied my 3D expenses today since I started in Oct 2006. This includes all sites I buy from:

    $7911.93

    I'm not home and I can't remember my SM login to get what I've spent on buying Poser. I imagine it will put me over 8 grand.

    Unless you got a sweet upgrade deal for owning a previous version : D

  • McGyverMcGyver Posts: 7,050
    edited December 1969

    Ah, geez... This has been a pretty crummy day, and now I find Ledhead is leaving.
    Bummer dude.
    I'm half tempted to bust out my soapbox and go on about how less and less everyday this feels like the place it used to... but I think over time I've said enough and nothing is going to change anything here... still its sad though.
    I recently went and looked up and a couple of threads from a few days before the site change... started to notice so many people who I hadn't seen here in quite a while... I actually checked around in the forums they used to hang out in and its seems they are all mostly gone.
    So now we lose another.
    I'm gonna miss ya... if I hadn't just had root canal, I'd have a shot of rum in yer honor (too much pirate for whiskey)...
    I wish you well, in your future endeavors... I also wish you good health... I'm sorry I stopped following the thread where it was discussed... well actually the thread abandoned me, as I now only randomly get "someone posted" notifications anymore... I hope you got better and it tuned out well.
    I won't try and dissuade you... I think if it was only about the content management, you probably could come to some manner of accord and people here could probably help you figure out something you could live with... but I suspect this runs deeper and that it's probably more of a cumulative effect... as Popeye would say "I've had all I can take, an' I can't takes no more".
    I will say that I completely agree with your frustration over how content is managed... I personally never understood it, or got the hang what the hell the problem is... back when I first started, there seemed to be no solid (or easy to find) information on how content worked... where stuff went, what was the difference between Poser content and DAZ content, etc... maybe the newer system works for some, I looked into it and quickly was lost, there seems to be too much of a need to constantly follow the forums to figure out stuff how stuff works or doesn't work...
    Ah, I'm getting tempted to complain...
    I'll miss ya... Roy... its good to know your name... and have a face to go with the name too.
    Be well and I hope I catch you the next time you stop by.
    Vic... AKA that obnoxious wiseass lordvicore... AKA McGyver.

  • CypherFOXCypherFOX Posts: 3,401
    edited July 2013

    Greetings,
    Huh... I remember Ledhead and I commiserating on the amount we've spent. I've also been a profligate spender this last year and a half that I've been here. When I started, I was actually unemployed until halfway through March Madness. Thankfully I got a job, or my family would have borne the brunt of my newfound addiction. But I've spent in the same ballpark, because I have a 'day job' that pays particularly well.

    I don't organize my stuff, though.

    Not even a little bit.

    I use the Content Library view to add items (including Genesis characters) to the scene, and I only vaguely use Smart Content (when it is working) to see if there are related items when I highlight an object. I let DIM install my stuff for me, 100%, and I don't move it afterwards.

    I'm tempted to write a 'better search' tool for content, because right now D|S's search is pretty asstacular, and because I'm just the kind of person who writes code like that for fun. :)

    But the core decision for me was to Just Not Care about organization. It's broken; the naming scheme is broken, and it has been broken since early Poser days. It can' t be fixed because there's vast amounts of Poser stuff that uses the terrible naming convention. (SRSLY! WTF is up with textures being under poses?!?) It's like learning English; you learn the basic language, then you learn all the crappy exceptions and workarounds, and then you muddle through, and if you play with it enough it becomes second nature enough that you can build beautiful things with it.

    But take a break. Don't stress over this. It's fun. It's supposed to be, at least for those of us who don't get paid to build 3D stuff. And if it's not, you're doing the right thing...walk away for a bit...and for longer, if you can't make it fun again. I'm definitely sorry to see you go, but it'd be sadder to see you get bitter.

    -- Morgan

    Post edited by CypherFOX on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited December 1969

    ...OK throwing my hat in the ring to say it will be sad to see you go


    If anyone understands your frustration with the way Daz has been handling things recently, it is I.

    I've been at this for just over five years, building my 3D toolbox on a limited (and since losing my job almost non existent) budget. When I realised that the software and content was outgrowing my old system, I took eighteen months to research how to design and build the most optimal system I could while purchasing components as I could afford them (a total investment of between 1,400 - 1,500$).

    I first began looking into setting up a custom runtime structure because the Daz/Content folder was pretty much a total disaster, even compared with the Poser Runtime. A lot of it had to do with poor packaging of the earlier installers which would place non content folders in the visible content tree, and as I mentioned elsewhere, content where ever like props and lights in the "Environments", or environment sets in the "Props" folder etc... The whole lack of establishing a naming convention and standard for runtime packaging is in my opinion Daz's responsibility and consequently their failure.

    So instead of a 3D artist, I found myself spending more time being a Database Manager (which in the business world pays a rather nice salary). I share your frustration that seemingly every update one has to go back and restructure their setup again and again because of some new change to the content (mis)management structure. I feel much of the hair that I lost was due to being torn out by the roots trying to make sense of this mess.

    My question, does this same situation occur with every update of 3DS, C4D, or Vue?

    At first the ideas of Zip files (which I even campaigned for) looked to be a breakthrough especially for those of us with custom runtimes. That was until Daz introduced the next annoyance (Smart Content and the CMS being the first), known as the DIM

    The DIM is a worthless piece of rubbish for my purposes. I could never get the bloody thing to work right. Heck it still can't even load my correct username. So I uninstalled it and decided I'll just stick to manual DLs and installs. That would be all fine and dandy until I discovered just about every one of the new Daz zips had no associated readme included to map out where things needed to go so one didn't get any broken paths. So what would be a simple workaround to the DIM just became more difficult than it should be.

    Add to this the lack of updates/fixes to their other products such as Hexagon (more than five years since the last "real update" which was basically the Daz Studio <> Hex bridge), Bryce (which seriously needs to be brought into the 64 bit world)., and Carrara (which has actually been crippled by attempts to support the original Genesis and continues to languish in Beta status).

    Meanwhile, almost unannounced, they spring G2F (not as versatile as the original) and Vicky6 on us. It's almost like the house is falling apart so let's slap a new coat of paint on it and maybe nobody will notice because it looks so shiny and new again. This recurring approach is frustrating to a community which buys their products that in turn supported and helped build this company in its early days.

    I still cannot help but feel the merger in 2010 has a good part to do with how Daz went from a community oriented company that listened to it's customers to one which just doesn't seem to care what any of us feel anymore.

    Roy take it easy, hope you will still drop by the Complaint/Stupid threads now & then.

  • ledheadledhead Posts: 1,586
    edited December 1969

    Son-of-a-bitch. I just typed this long ass paragraph, accidentally hit a button, no I don't know which one, and everything I typed disappeared. @$&*@#%@#*&^. I'll have to start all over, but not in this god forsaken forum with all it's quirks and screw ups. Copy and paste, copy and paste, dammit Roy, copy and paste.

  • ZenrelZenrel Posts: 245
    edited July 2013

    Ledhead said:
    Son-of-a-bitch. I just typed this long ass paragraph, accidentally hit a button, no I don't know which one, and everything I typed disappeared. @$&*@#%@#*&^. I'll have to start all over, but not in this god forsaken forum with all it's quirks and screw ups. Copy and paste, copy and paste, dammit Roy, copy and paste.

    I know that feeling... I used to write blogs or edit my wiki for my roleplay in Final Fantasy XIV then it got deleted due a admin reseting the site or accidentally hit back. Now I use word doc if I want write a long post then copy+paste. Such a frustrating feeling.

    Post edited by Zenrel on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited December 1969

    ...If you use FF there's an addon called Lazarus which saves what everything you wrote for that post up to whatever caused it to go *poof*.

    With my lousy connectivity and Magento logouts/'misdirects, I found it to be a lifesaver.

  • ledheadledhead Posts: 1,586
    edited December 1969

    I just wanted to say you guys have really touched me. When I was typing in the forum before it magically disappeared, I was fighting back tears and was losing. I have been so emotional lately because of being told I have cancer. I decided not to do chemo and radiation treatments, but to change my diet and take natural medicines. Have I made the right choice, I have no idea at this point, but it worries the crap out of me that I may have made a bad decision. Because of all of the things I am going through emotionally, I have decided to pursue other courses in my life. So Lordvicore, you are correct, there is more to the story than I have let on or is that led on. I am not going to say what they are or it is because I know most, if not all, will try and talk me out of it. My decision is made though and I have already taken the steps. If any of you that I have made a connection with want to know, then PM me and I will go into further detail about what it is. I just do not want to say in the forum. Now I’ll be damned if I’m going to tell everyone that PM’s me, so you should know who those select few are. If you’re not sure, then you more than likely will not be told.

    That still does not change the fact of my frustration with my initial statement. That very much is real, but I probably would be able to deal with it a helluva lot better if it wasn’t for the other things in my life.

    Okay, copy and paste time. I’m kinda glad I lost all I typed before cause it was more emotional when I was writing it, teary eyed and all.

    I’m also still going to get my freebies until my PC membership expires the middle of February. I just hope I don’t come across a sale and can’t help myself.

    Thank all of you that have supported my decision. It really means a lot to me.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 2,076
    edited July 2013

    Ledhead - I don't know if this is possible for you because I use Poser and I'm on a Mac, but . . . can you simply download your content into a folder labeled UNINSTALLED CONTENT. And make a little screen capture of the DAZ listing for each product (like the one I have included here). Then in your folder you will have the content and a picture of it - if you copy and past the name of the product onto the content file and the image file, then tell your folder you want everything in alphabetical order, you should get your content immediately next the picture of it. Then install the content when you want to use it. Otherwise, leave it in the UNINSTALLED CONTENT file.

    I had no idea there was any difficulty installing DAZ content into DAZ Studio. I've never had any problem installing it into Poser, and in Poser you can rearrange the files and folders really easily.

    If you've invested a lot of money in content already, then you must have ample content to create images with - without buying any more. And if you only install what you are going to use immediately, you don't have to waste any time installing hundreds of files.

    Oh, I just read your last post about having cancer. Of course it's an emotional hurricane for you, but if it's of any interest, I have family members who have had cancer, some - really the most horrific kinds, and they did treatments and had surgeries, and they are cured. My Aunt Belle had cancer in the 1930s and she lived to be 93. No matter what kind of ailment a person has, creating art can be enormously theraputic and comforting - and keeps your mind on something other than the illness - you can focus on making great pictures. But I agree - you don't need the frustration of misconceived software and content installers. :)

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    Post edited by Fauvist on
  • ledheadledhead Posts: 1,586
    edited December 1969

    Fauvist said:
    Ledhead - I don't know if this is possible for you because I use Poser and I'm on a Mac, but . . . can you simply download your content into a folder labeled UNINSTALLED CONTENT. And make a little screen capture of the DAZ listing for each product (like the one I have included here). Then in your folder you will have the content and a picture of it - if you copy and past the name of the product onto the content file and the image file, then tell your folder you want everything in alphabetical order, you should get your content immediately next the picture of it. Then install the content when you want to use it. Otherwise, leave it in the UNINSTALLED CONTENT file.

    I had no idea there was any difficulty installing DAZ content into DAZ Studio. I've never had any problem installing it into Poser, and in Poser you can rearrange the files and folders really easily.

    If you've invested a lot of money in content already, then you must have ample content to create images with - without buying any more. And if you only install what you are going to use immediately, you don't have to waste any time installing hundreds of files.

    Sure I do all of that stuff already. Make a separate folder for every product. I have folders under purchased content and installed content. I also have folders of the content in my wishlist. It is all part of keeping everything organized and part of the reason I am tired of it. I had no choice but to do that because it becomes more difficult to keep track of everything if you don't. Hell, I have a spreadsheet of everything I purchased with date and purchase order along with all other pertinent info. I also have a list of all the products sold at DAZ, almost. It was not completed. I have to have order. For those that don't mind chaos, I am guessing there is more chaos in your life other than DAZ. I keep all my paperwork, bills and other important documents, in notebooks. I am very organized. That is why this has been so frustrating for me. Hell in the beginning I asked DAZ if they had a list of all the content they sold in the store. I don't think i need to tell you the answer I got. That is when I began that long ass list of a spreadsheet for DAZ content so I would know if I purchased it, wanted it or just put a maybe by it. That list is up to date until yesterday except for the older items. So yeah, I got everything in separate folders, but I want it organized inside of Studio. I want to go to dresses and see all of my choices right there, not select folder after folder looking for the right one. I suppose i could put the promo image of all dresses in one folder. Hey not a bad idea. Maybe that's what I'll do, but will I be able to find it once installed, that is the question.

  • FauvistFauvist Posts: 2,076
    edited December 1969

    Ledhead said:
    I suppose i could put the promo image of all dresses in one folder. Hey not a bad idea. Maybe that's what I'll do, but will I be able to find it once installed, that is the question.

    If the promo image has the exact same name (except for the file extension) as the content, then the image will show up next to the content.

  • DustRiderDustRider Posts: 2,739
    edited December 1969

    Ledhead - I don't post much, but I do lurk a lot - really really sorry to hear about your cancer, you've got to do what is right for you, I really don't know what I would do with cancer.

    All this 3D stuff can be fun, but management of assets can be difficult. I get the feeling that maybe if it was a little less frustrating, it could really help you find some calm in the storm.

    When I started, I was a freebie-aholic, and also bought many things I never used (because it was really nice, and i might use it some day. Jeeezzze did I have an uncontrollable mess. I didn't do much for a while, and with a computer upgrade I decided I would only install the stuff I knew I would use, and also did some basic content organization. At the same time I began a practice of only buying something that I would use in a render (and had to use it before I could get something else). For the most part I've kept to this policy for several years now, and my life with Poser/DS/Carrara has been much less stressful (and cheaper).

    If you have a change of heart, you might try only installing the content you need for an image as you work back into the 3D world. It can still be frustrating finding the item you want to install/use, but I think the real value in this approach is that you get more of a sense of accomplishment when you actually make an image with what you bought/installed.

    I hope something I've said helps in some small way (I'm not very good at it). Life can be very very difficult at times, but hang in there. You have a lot of people here that care, and would/will miss your posts.

    Take care, hope to continue to see you around, and Gods Speed in everything you do!!

  • LordHardDrivenLordHardDriven Posts: 937
    edited December 1969

    Ledhead said:
    I just wanted to say you guys have really touched me. When I was typing in the forum before it magically disappeared, I was fighting back tears and was losing. I have been so emotional lately because of being told I have cancer. I decided not to do chemo and radiation treatments, but to change my diet and take natural medicines. Have I made the right choice, I have no idea at this point, but it worries the crap out of me that I may have made a bad decision. Because of all of the things I am going through emotionally, I have decided to pursue other courses in my life. So Lordvicore, you are correct, there is more to the story than I have let on or is that led on. I am not going to say what they are or it is because I know most, if not all, will try and talk me out of it. My decision is made though and I have already taken the steps. If any of you that I have made a connection with want to know, then PM me and I will go into further detail about what it is. I just do not want to say in the forum. Now I’ll be damned if I’m going to tell everyone that PM’s me, so you should know who those select few are. If you’re not sure, then you more than likely will not be told.

    That still does not change the fact of my frustration with my initial statement. That very much is real, but I probably would be able to deal with it a helluva lot better if it wasn’t for the other things in my life.

    Okay, copy and paste time. I’m kinda glad I lost all I typed before cause it was more emotional when I was writing it, teary eyed and all.

    I’m also still going to get my freebies until my PC membership expires the middle of February. I just hope I don’t come across a sale and can’t help myself.

    Thank all of you that have supported my decision. It really means a lot to me.

    Well now that you've revealed you have cancer then yeah, if you want to just drop this hobby like a bad habit and walk away. When one is struggling with serious health issues then stress is like throwing gasoline on a fire. Hell even without health issues stress does a number on you. Just look at how much any US President in your lifetime has aged while in office.

    Now while I say walk away I do agree that this hobby (the creating/rendering end of it not the spending/organizing/complaining end of it) might be a place of calm in the middle of a storm of fighting a serious health problem. So I would add that if you can find a way to come back without the frustration you feel now then I would encourage you to do so.

    Now with regards to your health issue, well I'm no doctor nor do I have cancer nor have I had someone in my life struggle with it. That being said though I do pick up on a lot of things and have listened closely to a lot of people that have struggled with cancer. From that what I can tell you is that there is no clear, one size fits all cure for everyone. I've heard success and failure stories for both chemo/radiation treatment as well as homeopathic treatment, I even know of people who had great success with a treatment based on extracts of marijuana. What I'm trying to accomplish here is to ease your concerns of whether you made the right choice in treatment or not. As near as I can tell all forms of treatment in use today at least in America, have had their share of successes and failures. So it's very much a personal thing and with personal things what the individual is most comfortable with is a very important consideration. Hopefully your doctor that is treating you for this is one you have a good relationship with and that knows the options available real well but more importantly knows you real well too. If you have that then just trust that your doctor wouldn't allow you to pursue a treatment unless he/she felt very good about your chances with it. If you don't have that relationship then consider seeking out a new doctor that does inspire confidence and trust.

    Like I said in a previous post I don't really know you but none the less I wish you well wherever your life takes you and I wish you success in your struggle with cancer. Hopefully you'll beat it and one day you'll come back to this hobby and I'll have a chance to get to know you then. In closing I want to leave you with a bit of hope and a positive view. The human body is really an incredible creation and is marvelously adapted to it's environment here on earth. Everything we need to live a long healthy life is all around us and within us, all we need do is to make smart choices. Over the years as mankind has advanced in things like medical science people have come to think that the discoveries of that science is greater then natural things like eating right and getting regular exercise. What they often overlook though is that science examines why those natural things do what they do for us and so many of the discoveries are in reality an artificial way to the same result of healthy living. So while eating right and exercising right may seem like a less impressive or effective treatment then chemo or radiation it really isn't.

    Anyway good luck and I wish for you a long and happy life yet to come.

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