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Michael 6 Victoria 6 - Are they anitomically correct?

red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
edited December 1969 in The Commons

I have never had any dealings with genesis before & have not found the information on this. Are Michael 6 & Victoria 6 Anatomically correct?

Is Michael 6 like Michael 4, where that male body part is added as a additional character item or is it already part of Michael 6 genesis mesh?

Thank you

«1

Comments

  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,899
    edited January 2014

    DAZ3D's policy in this respect isn't changed. Genitals are addons to main figures and only available in (some?) Pro bundles. If I recall correctly, currently genitals are geografted and as such can follow the main mesh without any seams, like they are a part of the mesh. But initially no, unlike Project Human or Apollo, they aren't there.

    Post edited by Kattey on
  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thanks Kattey.

    You say its available only in some Pro Bundles. I don't understand that. I have to buy the pro bundle of M6 in order to get the addon genitals?

    When I buy textures for M6, do they usually include textures for the genital addon as well? The same way it once did for M3 & M4?

    Thanks

  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,899
    edited January 2014

    red1 said:
    Thanks Kattey.
    You say its available only in some Pro Bundles. I don't understand that. I have to buy the pro bundle of M6 in order to get the addon genitals?
    You are welcome.
    Yes, this is very strange practice (presumably rooted in American laws and taboos) but this is true: you can only get genitals if you have Pro bundles, in particular M6 Pro bundle for male genitals and any of Olympia 6, The Girl 6, Gia 6 and Victoria 6 Pro bundles for female genitals (not all of them, any one from the bunch)
    Teen Josie 6 Pro Bundle doesn't have them.

    When I buy textures for M6, do they usually include textures for the genital addon as well?

    I can't say for sure as I don't own any of them (I think) but usually on a tab "What's Included & Features" it should be mentioned if the texture has genital maps, especially if this is male character. If it doesn't mention it, it is safer to assume that the character doesn't have those texture maps.

    The same way it once did for M3 & M4?
    Actually from my personal perspective, M3 and M4 character had genital maps included almost all the time while Genesis and G2X characters rarely have them. It is because, I think, that Gen3 and Gen4 genitals were more easier available and there wasn't any $125 threshold to get them.

    Post edited by Kattey on
  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited January 2014

    Thank you so very much Kattey. You have been a great help! I guess I will have to buy the Pro bundles, of M6 & V6.

    Are Olympia 6, the Girl 6 Gia 6 & Victoria 6 similar? Only one female pro bundle needed for the female genitals? Will the genitals of Victoria 6 fit the other female characters?

    Sorry for so many questions. I am just now making the decision to use Daz Studio along with Poser. That's only because I am not one for DSON. So I no absolutely nothing about Genesis.

    Would you suggest I start off with Genesis 2, since I am just getting into DS? Genesis one is sort of not as common any more?

    Thank you

    RIck

    Post edited by red10_3d4cbcdd19 on
  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,899
    edited January 2014

    red1 said:
    I guess I will have to buy the Pro bundles, of M6 & V6.
    Well, it is up to you, essentially. There is a store called Renderotica that might have some stuff for G2X in that respect that isn't that expensive, I don't know.

    Are Olympia 6, the Girl 6 Gia 6 & Victoria 6 similar?
    Depending on criteria. OIympia and Gia similar in that they both somewhat muscular and closer to reality but still idealized females, where Victoria is less muscular and more idealized female. Girl is more of a toon character. Josie is a teen. Their Pro Bundle content is very different as well but - if we only speak of genitalia, you need just any of them (not all), as genitalia are made for G2F base, so yes, genitals from any Pro bundles will fit any of G2F characters. You only need 1 Pro bundle (any, except of Josie) to get female genitalia.

    Olympia, Gia, Girl 6, Josie and Victoria 6 follow the same model as Victoria 4 had and Genesis refined: all of them are basically morphs for the main female figure, which is called "Genesis 2 Female" (G2F). So you don't need to have Victoria 6 to use 'Genesis' 2 figure if you don't like Victoria 6 as a character. V6 is just a morph, Girl 6 is just a morph, Olympia and Gia are just morphs, Josie is just a morph. G2F main base figure, the mesh and rigging itself, you get for free in G2F Essentials if you have DAZ Studio 4 Pro which is also free, so you might never need any of the official morphs or characters if you don't have a use for them. Same is with M6 and 'Genesis 2 Male' (G2M) - Michael 6 is just a morph for the base main G2M figure.

    Sorry for so many questions.

    Not a problem, it is ok to ask questions :)
    So I know absolutely nothing about Genesis.

    Genesis and G2X characters (G2F and G2M) have differences, so some stuff from Genesis might not work on G2X and otherwise, although it is rare to stuff be completely unusable. Genitals are most probably one of such things, as geografted stuff (and I believe they are geografted) generally don't work well on another figure even with autofit. Although I didn't practically tested it because I didn't buy any G2X characters. If you remember what alternative geometry was, geografts are a bit like that, only more modular, so you don't have to hard-wire alternative geometry into a base figure, you can add it piece by piece.

    Would you suggest I start off with Genesis 2, since I am just getting into DS? Genesis one is sort of not as common any more?
    According to my tally, currently Genesis, G2F and G2M have about the same amount of outfits, if you count since G2M release, so Genesis is still running.
    Personally I prefer Genesis and I see no point in G2X. Other people may point out that G2X characters have some improvements in geometry loops and rigging and this is true although those improvements aren't as significant as hype blurbs claim. But if you are transferring from Gen4, Genesis offers much more backward usability with that generation, as you can use all your V4, M4, Kids4 textures and clothes (via autofit) from the start, while for G2X you will have to spend quite a lot of extra money to get the same level of usability with Gen4, and also run through hoops/spend even more money if you want to get the same level of usability as Genesis has with Gen5/Gen4/Gen3 characters and morphs.
    If you just look for 'next-gen' M4 and V4 and don't care about money, G2X may be your choice.
    At the end it is up to you, of course but personally I'm unwilling to let go of that level of user-friendliness and backward capability that Genesis has.

    If you want to know more about Genesis and G2X again, I'll be glad to answer all questions I can :)

    Post edited by Kattey on
  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank you so much for taking the time to help me with this.

    I will probably get both genesis 1 & genesis 2. Which means I would install both genesis 1 & 2 starter packs, that come with 4.6 pro. IT will cost a mint having both. But, I do have a lot of content for V4 M4 & the kids 4. So, as you said, Genesis 1 has better backward compatibility with them.

    A few months back, after 10 years, I dropped my Platinum Club membership, because it was not worth my while with Gen. 4. Now, I may end up starting it up all over again at a higher price. :( I can see many dollars involved in the Genesis 1 & 2 adventure. :)

    You probably don't know the answer to this question, but I will ask it anyways. Since I have never used DS, do you have any idea how the DS renderer compares with Posers renderer? I do know there are external renderers like Reality 3 & Octane.

    Thank you

  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,899
    edited January 2014

    red1 said:

    I will probably get both genesis 1 & genesis 2. Which means I would install both genesis 1 & 2 starter packs, that come with 4.6 pro. IT will cost a mint having both.
    If you decide to go full 100% support for both, then yes, it will be very expensive. I'd suggest to try both as they are free bases, look at the results and then sit and calculate how much it will cost you to get the same level of functionality for Genesis and G2X that you need. I have G2X Essentials installed for testing purposes (think Mad Scientist Lab with kittens ^_^") but I'm using only Genesis for real renders therefore I don't even buy G2X characters or poses although I bought about total dozen of G2X outfits, mostly for testing but some to use with Genesis.
    But, I do have a lot of content for V4 M4 & the kids 4. So, as you said, Genesis 1 has better backward compatibility with them.
    Just to clarify: you _can_ get the same level of backward capability on G2X with Gen4 as Genesis has from the start. But, if you can't dabble with manual transfers it will cost you quite a lot of money on PA items to get it. Not only that, if you want to get your G2F female characters wear male Gen 4 clothes or otherwise like Genesis can it will require you to have some knowledge about manual transfers anyway even with PA items, although PA items will make it a bit easier.

    I can see many dollars involved in the Genesis 1 & 2 adventure. :)


    Personally I'm buying G2X outfits in PC because they are excellent for testing :p
    But I think I'll skip to Genesis 3 in all other respects.

    Since I have never used DS, do you have any idea how the DS renderer compares with Posers renderer? I do know there are external renderers like Reality 3 & Octane.
    Reality 2.5 for DS so far but DS has a much less expensive and still wonderful Luxus plugin which also allows you to use LuxRender. DS also comes with free uberenvironment light (which adds Ambient Occlusion and some other indirect lighting modes) and you can make your own shaders with SSS and translucency or buy them. But I believe that default lighting in DS Pro is (a bit) weaker than in base current Poser.
    As for render times, I can't really tell, sorry.

    Post edited by Kattey on
  • icprncssicprncss Posts: 3,694
    edited December 1969

    Inclusion of the genitals only in the Pro Bundles is a result of the claims made back in the V4/M4 era that they were need by professionals to make professional biomedical illustrations. As a result of those claims DAZ came to the decision that if "professionals" had need of them, they would also have the funds to purchase the higher priced "professional" bundles (this is a condensed paraphrased explanation form an thread in the old forums with DAZ_Rand).

  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank you again Kattey! You have been really great! You have helped me a lot here. It's nice to meet wonderful people, such as yourself. :)

    Take care & have a great week!

  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited January 2014

    icprncss said:
    Inclusion of the genitals only in the Pro Bundles is a result of the claims made back in the V4/M4 era that they were need by professionals to make professional biomedical illustrations. As a result of those claims DAZ came to the decision that if "professionals" had need of them, they would also have the funds to purchase the higher priced "professional" bundles (this is a condensed paraphrased explanation form an thread in the old forums with DAZ_Rand).

    Thank you icprncss. That is good to know. Can't say that I agree with it, but its good to know.

    Thanks again! :)

    Post edited by red10_3d4cbcdd19 on
  • KatteyKattey Posts: 2,899
    edited December 1969

    red1 said:
    Thank you again Kattey! You have been really great! You have helped me a lot here. It's nice to meet wonderful people, such as yourself. :)

    Take care & have a great week!

    Anytime :) You too have a happy week ^_^

  • icprncssicprncss Posts: 3,694
    edited December 1969

    red1 said:
    icprncss said:
    Inclusion of the genitals only in the Pro Bundles is a result of the claims made back in the V4/M4 era that they were need by professionals to make professional biomedical illustrations. As a result of those claims DAZ came to the decision that if "professionals" had need of them, they would also have the funds to purchase the higher priced "professional" bundles (this is a condensed paraphrased explanation form an thread in the old forums with DAZ_Rand).

    Thank you icprncss. That is good to know. Can't say that I agree with it, but its good to know.

    Thanks again! :)

    You're welcome. Not everyone agrees with the reasoning but it is what it is.

    You also might want to check out the V5/M5 combo bundle

    http://www.daz3d.com/daz-bundles/genesis-michael-victoria-combo-bundle

    Not only does it give you the M5 and V5 morphs for Genesis and the gens, it gives you the Evolution Morphs for Genesis including the head, body, expression and muscularity morphs.

  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited January 2014

    icprncss said:
    red1 said:
    icprncss said:
    Inclusion of the genitals only in the Pro Bundles is a result of the claims made back in the V4/M4 era that they were need by professionals to make professional biomedical illustrations. As a result of those claims DAZ came to the decision that if "professionals" had need of them, they would also have the funds to purchase the higher priced "professional" bundles (this is a condensed paraphrased explanation form an thread in the old forums with DAZ_Rand).

    Thank you icprncss. That is good to know. Can't say that I agree with it, but its good to know.

    Thanks again! :)

    You're welcome. Not everyone agrees with the reasoning but it is what it is.

    You also might want to check out the V5/M5 combo bundle

    http://www.daz3d.com/daz-bundles/genesis-michael-victoria-combo-bundle

    Not only does it give you the M5 and V5 morphs for Genesis and the gens, it gives you the Evolution Morphs for Genesis including the head, body, expression and muscularity morphs.


    Thank you icprncss. I really appreciate the heads up about M5 & V5 bundle. You are absolutely right, it is what it is.

    Have a great week! :) icprncss, does gens refer to the gentitals? I assume it does, just want to be absolutely sure, before I spend the 124.00.

    Thanks :)

    Post edited by red10_3d4cbcdd19 on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited December 1969

    ...what they really needed to do is set up a "true;" pro bundle that included both the base V6 & M6 characters, the base Genesis 2 body & head morphs, base character poses, the "basicwear" clothing for both, 1 set of contemporary Daz Original clothing (& footwear) for each, 1 Daz Original hair for each, a base set of texture maps for each (like the old M4/V4 pro bundles included), The HD sets bundle, along with the the gens.

    That would be worth the higher price.

    I tend to just go for the base figures as the current pro bundles usually include a lot of clothing and characters I never use. The last pro bundle that actually interested me was the YT5 one as it actually had one of the nicest collections of clothing, hair, poses, and character content I had seen (but of course as they were teen characters, no gens which makes sense).

    I only ended up with the V5/M5 pro bundles because I upgraded to Carrara 8.5Pro.

  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    That would be nice Kyoto Kid. I have noticed a fair bit of stuff in the Pro bundles I won't use. However, to get the gens, you need the pro versions. IT would be nice to have an option to build your own pro bundle. (Keeping it in the price range.) Being given options to choose from.

    I have sleep apnea, and a mask comes the same way. They send you the mask & 3 nasal prongs. Small, med & Large. You end up throwing two of them in the garbage. Then, when you need to replace the prong, it cost you 50.00. :)

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited December 1969

    ...yeah, unfortunately that's how biz works these days.

  • SilvheSilvhe Posts: 819
    edited December 1969

    I think Renderotica has some gens props for M6 and V6. It's an adult site so I can't post a link but you can find it easily with any search engine

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited December 1969

    ...I certainly wouldn't give them my card number though and as I understand, PayPal will not work with them.

  • Male-M3diaMale-M3dia Posts: 3,581
    edited December 1969

    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...I certainly wouldn't give them my card number though and as I understand, PayPal will not work with them.

    I've ordered stuff from them for years and no problem.

  • FSMCDesignsFSMCDesigns Posts: 12,754
    edited December 1969

    Male-M3dia said:
    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...I certainly wouldn't give them my card number though and as I understand, PayPal will not work with them.

    I've ordered stuff from them for years and no problem.

    Same here. They may have a bad reputation because of the nature of the site and some peoples prudish attitudes, but I have always found them to be professional and never had any issues. Can't be any worse than giving Target your credit card info, LOL.

  • SilvheSilvhe Posts: 819
    edited December 1969

    FSMCDesigns said:
    Male-M3dia said:
    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...I certainly wouldn't give them my card number though and as I understand, PayPal will not work with them.

    I've ordered stuff from them for years and no problem.

    Same here. They may have a bad reputation because of the nature of the site and some peoples prudish attitudes, but I have always found them to be professional and never had any issues. Can't be any worse than giving Target your credit card info, LOL.
    Yes, I had the same experience with them, very professional and supportive if you have any problem. I think they process credit cards using some external service, more or less as many otther sites (even DAZ, if I recall correctly)

  • red10_3d4cbcdd19red10_3d4cbcdd19 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate it!! :)

  • Cayman StudiosCayman Studios Posts: 1,135
    edited December 1969

    Kattey said:
    ...
    When I buy textures for M6, do they usually include textures for the genital addon as well?

    I can't say for sure as I don't own any of them (I think) but usually on a tab "What's Included & Features" it should be mentioned if the texture has genital maps, especially if this is male character. If it doesn't mention it, it is safer to assume that the character doesn't have those texture maps.
    ...

    So am I correct in thinking that only the M6 Pro Bundle contains the genital textures for Michael 6? So that if someone were to buy, say, the Gianni or Lee Pro Bundle, yet only had Michael 6 basic, the genitals would have to remain textureless?

    I was aware that the basic models did not include the genital meshes, but not that they also did not include the textures.

  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604
    edited December 1969

    Cayman said:
    Kattey said:
    ...
    When I buy textures for M6, do they usually include textures for the genital addon as well?

    I can't say for sure as I don't own any of them (I think) but usually on a tab "What's Included & Features" it should be mentioned if the texture has genital maps, especially if this is male character. If it doesn't mention it, it is safer to assume that the character doesn't have those texture maps.
    ...

    So am I correct in thinking that only the M6 Pro Bundle contains the genital textures for Michael 6? So that if someone were to buy, say, the Gianni or Lee Pro Bundle, yet only had Michael 6 basic, the genitals would have to remain textureless?

    I was aware that the basic models did not include the genital meshes, but not that they also did not include the textures.

    Well there really isn't a lot of point in including a texture for something that is not included in the product

  • arcadyarcady Posts: 340
    edited September 2014

    When I bought the pro bundle of either Aiko 6 or Olympia 6 - I forget which I bought first, I ended up with the genital kit for the female Genesis 2 figures, and I got the male from getting Lee 6 pro. (I believe this is how it worked out - but you might get both gender's from a single pro buy... doubtful though).

    Every texture I've since bought has had the needed textures - even textures made for figures like Gianni... and I don't even have Gianni in any form (he's sitting on my maybe list for today though).

    So at the MOST, you need 1 pro kit for each gender. Not for each figure. At the least, one pro kit period - but I doubt that is how it worked.

    If you watch the sales right, a pro figure always seems to cycle in at some point on a deep discount.

    In an effort to figure out ways to work around a bug in Carrara 8+, I also bought one kit from that 'otica' website - and it has been... rather difficult to work with... as it was UV mapped for Victoria 6 rather than the base genesis 2 female. You need to know your way around photoshop to use it. So if you go that route... do so with caution. The 'otica ones also have more detail than you're going to need unless you're doing 'adult' work. The pro figures have enough detail for a normal nude. Not having the pro versions leaves you with strange looking nudes, male or female.

    Oh and ps: The 'otica prop I bought did NOT solve the Carrara issue. I solved that by exporting my figure out of Daz as an obj... which means Carrara will still not be viable for someone doing 'nude animation'...

    Fortunately I have no need of that, and not much need for nudes... but I'm a bit completionist and the lack was really bugging me.

    Post edited by arcady on
  • Cayman StudiosCayman Studios Posts: 1,135
    edited December 1969

    chohole said:
    ...
    Well there really isn't a lot of point in including a texture for something that is not included in the product

    But that is exactly what happens with all the other G2M models. I am just surprised that Michael 6, whom I bought today, is not the same, and does not include the textures.

  • FistyFisty Posts: 3,416
    edited December 1969

    One thing to keep in mind, if you're going to be using them in Poser Genesis 2 produces better results than Genesis 1 and there are more compatible items available. If you're using DS it's more personal preference.

    And add me to the list of people that have never had a problem with Renderotica.

  • ZarconDeeGrissomZarconDeeGrissom Posts: 5,412
    edited September 2014

    Cayman said:
    chohole said:
    ...
    Well there really isn't a lot of point in including a texture for something that is not included in the product

    But that is exactly what happens with all the other G2M models. I am just surprised that Michael 6, whom I bought today, is not the same, and does not include the textures.What!? :ohh:
    I thought as long as you had one pro pack, any other daz original figure could use the equipment with it's own mats. Now there resorting to not including the mats??? Or has that always been the case with the guys including gen5? I only have M5 pro, and D5 pro right now.
    (edit)
    I never considered ArchaeopteryxDR to be erotic, lol. It never ceases to surprise me how many twists of that site's name there are on this forum.
    (edit)
    Renderosity, Rendo, Skimperosity, and now Renderotica, lol. Yes they have some skimpy outfits there, they have more then just that.

    Post edited by ZarconDeeGrissom on
  • arcadyarcady Posts: 340
    edited September 2014

    I have multiple pro packs but my Michael is basic Michael.

    I'll have to check this when I get home.

    Here's the wiki and I don't see it in there:
    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/read_me/index/17229/start

    But it would be odd as my other figures that I have thus far tried have their textures.

    The Lee wiki page:
    http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/read_me/index/19219/start

    Also fails to mention it - and I know its there for that one's pro version, which I don't find a separate wiki for.

    Post edited by arcady on
  • arcadyarcady Posts: 340
    edited September 2014

    Ok, I have the Michael 6 Genital textures, and I only own Michael 6 base.

    They are in this folder:

    /Runtime/Textures/DAZ/Characters/Genesis2/Michael6/RyNevio_genital.jpg
    and then for bum, specular, and a torsoGen.

    Note the name of the file is Nevio, not Michael.
    The regular Michael 6 skins are also named Nevio.

    I got these files NOT from my purchase of Michael 6 though... I got them from my purchase of Lee 6 Pro Pack, which included the G2M Genitalia.
    - As long as you have ANY G2M pro pack, you will have Michael 6's textures for that part of the body, and textures for the 'base genesis 2 male', named M5Phillip for whatever reason, but in folder under Genesis 2.

    EDIT: L2Spell Michael... :)

    Post edited by arcady on
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