Daz Products
Digger
Posts: 8
I would spend a lot more on Daz Genesis products if they had the Poser Companion files, a lot of artists are not including these in their products, is there a reason this isn't done.
I use Poser as I am used to it and it works well for me, I cant get on with Daz as it seems to crash a lot of the time for me and also I have an illness that means it makes it hard to learn things.
Please Artists add the Poser Companion files so I can use more of the products out there.
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Comments
I whole heartedly second that sentiment. It would also be nice to know sometime,s there are Issues with poser compatibility and sometimes it is just because the artist doesn't want too.
I'm not suggesting this as a user solution since many can't or won't use DS, but I've had no problem creating Poser Companion Files for any product that include DUF files, and have encountered none so far that didn't work fine. It's a fairly easy process, actually. I can only assume that concerns over making Poser-specific materials is part of the problem, but if a product uses materials and not shaders, they seem to convert fine as well.
Doesn't seem to work for me and invariably locks my pc up when I try to use it.
But If a Daz user can create the Companion files then why not the Artist as part of the package.
It is easy to make Poser companion files if your computer can run DS, obviously the PAs who are making DS only content are using it without a problem, but making it Poser compatible goes far beyond the 5 minutes it takes to make those files.
You can run that on pretty much any type of file, figures, props, materials, poses, etc.
Poses are the easiest, I see no reason not to make them Poser compatible. I've never seen it mess up or require any adjustment other than making sure the poses are in the right runtime folder.
Figures are harder, if the figure has extra bones added, like long skirts, scabbards, etc, they will either work badly or not work at all once they're ported over. Even short skirts that follow the thighs don't work nearly as well most of the time.
Props usually work okay but you have to have modeled them ahead of time to take into account being used in Poser, you need to have quite a few more polygons in Poser to keep the ballooning type smoothing from causing problems. With a normal Poser format item you can turn that off before you save the prop, I haven't found any way to have it turned off on load with a dson prop so the end user has to do it themselves. (which would make them have to read the readme to know which people don't so as a general rule.. they'll just get an ugly model and blame the PA)
Matfiles can be ported over but they're even worse than using a poser matfile in DS. They are only the texture map and the transmap if there is one, it's utterly terrible. You absolutely have to make new Poser specific matfiles. For me, being a long time DS user, it is harder and time consuming to make Poser mats. I do it though. I don't really understand why some long time Poser content creators who are now making Genesis content won't.. it would take them very little time being so familiar with the material room.
So.. it's time in a lot of cases. In some cases it's not wanting to be held down by the extra requirements in your model, morphs, and rigging to make it work acceptably in Poser. And you can't make Poser companion files and say it's good.. to get through Daz QA it needs to be good quality and work well, if you add Poser files it needs to work well in Poser, just like if you add the heavy morph it has to look good and take poses with the heavy morph applied. That it why people rarely support that morph, it's a bugger to get working perfectly in all situations. 90% good in 50% of situations isn't good enough for Daz products, it has to be 95% in 95% of cases at least. I strive for 100%, 100% of the time with my own products, this included Poser files. As such I won't make long dresses/skirts, I'm making native Poser format props for my next product because they need the mesh smoothing turned off and DSON won't do it, and I've spent the last 3 days with my head stuck in the material room making matfiles.
and because of everything you have said, is exactly why I prefer Merchant made Poser companion files. They work better than anything I am gonna make using DS to do it. and as far as I am concerned you are right it is not an easy fix. So many merchants have lost sales from me that I have hated to miss out on but it is what it is. I do highly prize the merchants who have made the efforts to make PCF for the Genesis items.
As someone who is working on becoming a PA, the idea of supporting both programs is daunting. Right now I don't have the time or budget to add Poser to my toolbox, so that pretty much limits me to DS items, except for simpler props. So if I did add it, I'd seriously have to consider pricing the items that supported both HIGHER...because of the extra time and work involved, on my end.
that is one way to look at it for sure and if necessary I would pay more for said item if it was something I wanted but you can also consider you are increasing the number of folks who will be able to and want to use said item as well. You are just considering more work on your part (and that is not unreasonable) but not the increase in the number of folks who will buy. Just food for thought.
There is a script that will allow you to load duf/dsf files straight from Poser without the need of the companion files. Look up Semidieu at RDNA. You'd need his Library Manager 2.6 and his free LM2 Daz Studio plugin. Whether the benefits outweigh the price is up to you.
There's a free script that can do this too, but it's more of a pain since there's no gui and is just a standard open file dialogue, but it does work.
http://d3d.sesseler.de/index.php?software=poserpython&product=dson_loader
You'd still need the DSON Importer installed for both.
Keep in mind that this still will not ensure items will load or be usable in Poser. If items, like clothes and props, were not made with Poser use in mind, you will still have issues.
I don't for a few reasons:
1. I've worked with texturers who use UberSurface or SSS shaders. These do not translate, and I cannot fairly ask the person who did 50% of the work to do hours more recreating those shaders in Poser. Sometimes I want to use this sort of shader in my solos, too, and I don't want to do that extra work either. The number of additional sales does not pay enough to justify it.
2. I like to work with special rigging and tricks in Studio. In my testing the companion file generator chokes and dies on a whip with 900 bones as soon as you try to load it from the library subsequently; and it is persnickety about custom bone rigs in general and how they have to be set up. I would rather not support Poser than not be able to use Studio to its full potential on things like this.
3. Some of my bestselling products are utilities for DAZ Studio that depend on functions of Transfer Utility and Autofit, and obviously those don't translate at all.
4. I don't care for working in Poser. This wouldn't stop me if the payoff were big enough to offset the headache, but in my experience it isn't (versus for someone who makes props with no bones, where it is often TOTALLY worth it).
I completely hear all of that, and I respect it, I just won't be buying from you, and that is as simple for you, as it is for me, and no I don't mean that in snarky way just factually. I do remember when you did make items for poser and they were very good ones, they are still used in my graphics work. I have a tremendous respect for your work and admire it. I just won't be able to use any of your new stuff but wish you all the success in the world ;)
I completely hear all of that, and I respect it, I just won't be buying from you, and that is as simple for you, as it is for me, and no I don't mean that in snarky way just factually. I do remember when you did make items for poser and they were very good ones, they are still used in my graphics work. I have a tremendous respect for your work and admire it. I just won't be able to use any of your new stuff but wish you all the success in the world ;)
And that's fine. I, too, wish you the best with your renders and projects. But the OP asked, so as a PA that is my answer.