Modify (and overwrite) Morph (with ERC subcomponents)

kitakoredaz

When I hope to modify and overwrite morph, I need export shape as obj then
modify obj in other modelor (hexagoon, blender, etc)
finally import modified obj to ds by morph loader Pro.

But I think, there are several pattern, and several way.

I hope admins or other skillful user confirm , check or correct my way.:blank:
(tweak and overwrite morph with ERC is sensitive, I think,,)

And hope other users who have interesting about how to,
have question, advice , or show tips, please join here free.

To simplify, I call the morph which need to modify and overwrite as "FBMdefault"

If The "FBMdefault" have no subcomponents (ERC link) it seems easy.

Just Export current Actor shape which morphed by the "FBMdefault" (keep zero sub-d)
and modify to good shape in modelor, then export as FBMgood.obj

Import the FBMgood.obj to the daz studio for the Actor by morph loader.
( must need to check scale, or x,y,z cordinate option ^^; as same as export, or import )
and overwrite as FBMdefault

But if the FBMdefault change nodes scale, rotate, or translate by ERC,,
(eg,, FBMdefault translate eyes node x-axis, and change head Z scale,
then rotate neck,,)

It can not work., and need more adjustment to modify and overwrite FBMdefault with keep all ERC.

then I usually use these ways,,,

=========================================================

1
Set FBMdefault to Actor (As for me genesis or genesis2(female ^^;))

then Remove all ERC "sub componets" in property hieralchy pane, from the FBMdefault.
(Acutualy may not need to remove all ERC, but it make easy)

I believe, it must reset all changed node to default. (scale, translate, rotation,
and rig rocation value, (center and end), and other linked morph value)
with keep FBMdefault current value.

(if there is exception case, tell me please ^^;)

Now Actor are deformed only by FBM morph. (before export, I should check,
the FBMdefault value 100%, but other node properties are default value
,no other morph work too)

Then I export current shape as obj, modify it in modelor , save the new obj.

Buck to daz studio, I delete and re-load Actor (to load FBMdefault with all ERC subcomponets link)
then select the Actor, import new obj by morph loader , then set name as FBMdefault (delta only)
and overwrite.

It work I believe. FBMdefault keep ERC as same as before, then it modify shape too.
But there is one problem , I can not adjust real FBM morphed shape in modelor.

I could only adjust shape which removed ERC defomation.

(eg Eye sclaes had been changed by ERC of FBMdefault, I hoped to modify current scaled eye shape,
but I needed to reset the scale to default size,,then eye size returned default size,,)

Then I sometimes need another way for more detail work,,,

==============================================================

2
Set FBMdefault to Actor, keep ERC subcomponents link,

export current shape (FBM modified , and Node changed( eye translate, head rotate too) as obj.

Then modify the obj in modelor, after that export as newshape.obj

In daz studio, keep Actor current morphed shape. (FBMdefault (with ERC node defromed))
import the newshape.obj by morphloader pro.

But about this case, I can not overwrite morph , if I did, ERC node change will effect double.

Then,, I use Reverse option, and make delta Morph which can deform shape from current morphed shape.

(I usually call it as "delta morph" from Current morphed shape". though I know
all morph should be delta morph,, from something ^^;)

then make new controller as "delta-shape" morph. (of course,, it has no ERC)

To work it, I need to add delta-shape morph with the FBMdefault in parametr tab at same time.

I may plan to add the delta shape morph as new subcomponent of the FBMdefault,
after that, When I use the FBMdefault, the delta-shape morph work too.
(It means I make new MCM to modify FBMdefault )

or make new controller which change FBM and delta-morph at same time
by ERC. then use the controller as subistitute of FBMdefault.

Yes It should work, (or I say wrong? please correct when you find ^^;)

but not so happy,, because I do not hope to add new morph or controller any more,
my plan is simply overwrite the FBMdefault to get ideal shape by one Controller of FBM
as same as before, with keep all ERC node change.

Then,,, need more work,,

========================================================

3
I add "FBMdefault" and "delta-shape" to Actor. now it keep good shape which I planed.
Go to property hieralchy pane, (old name,, property editor)
then remove All sub components of the FBMdefault again. as same as my first way mentioned above.

when remove subcomponet, Current Actor shape change .
Now,, current shape are defromed by FBM (no ERC) + delta morph only.(all nodes are reset to default)
I export current shape as "ideal shape".obj

In daz studio, delete the Actor from the scene, and re-load the Actor (with FBM which have linked subcomponets)
then import the "ideal shape.obj" by morph loader , set name as FBMdefault.

it overwrite the FBM and keep ERC subcomponents (scale,translate,rotate nodes)
Now I set FBMdefault, my Actor shape change "ideal shape" with keep node changing.

========================================================================================

I tested about somecase ,it seems work as I expected.
but I know it is not so simple and easy :roll:

then,,,Is there miss understanding ? I really hope someone check my way.
and hope to know more clever and easy way,,
if morph-loader pro have option which make these steps more simple? ^^;

Richard Haseltine

Choosing the Deltas only in the Morph Loader pro options should not break existing ERC, You don't need to delete the ERC links in 1, you can just click the chain icon on the controlled property to temporarily suspend them (chain will show broken), then click again to restore when done.

kitakoredaz

Thanks ,,, Richard.
then Yes, I know Choosing the detlas only when overwrite them,
not to break ERC. (I do not use other option, because I need to keep ERC to overwrite morph)

then, yes I can cut link in parameter tab, As you said by click the icon.:)

but I do not know which node property are linked by the Morph , untill check them in parameter tab.
and iif there are many subcomponents which change node,

I need to select each node, to cut linked parameater one by one with confirm them.
Or is there option, cut all ERC ink at same time about rotattion,translation, scale only?

Select the FBM then, "show in hieralchy pane", and remove all ERC of subcomponent,
with shift click, seems more clear and delete link at once.
(I know without saving them, never actuall file change )

then in my step2 to step3, do you think more easy way? :coolhmm:
to modify the morphed shape with ERC, in other modelor,,,
then overwrite the morph.

I want to know, if there is more option.
(eather, cut link by parameter tab, or remove from proeprty pane)

And,, I have now one more question,,
To make one character shape,, I need to mix shape by two FBMs,
(eg if transfer genesis morph by generation X2,, usually ,,
I need to add, genesisClonemorph,, and the transfered morph,,)

then both FBM have many ERC, which change nodes and, rig center ,end points too.

I really hope to gather them as one morph,,
to make it, I want to save the current ERC morphed rigs and poze.
(after that re-make ERC linkes) but there seems no good way,,,

I test save as property, or save as poze etc,, but it do not save the current value,
which changed by ERC,,

After all, I need to re-adjust rig manually, (about genesis2female,
tongue jaw ,, Adjust rigging to shape, not work correctly I beleive,,)

Is there good way, to save only current morphed rig (center points, end points Orientattion) status,
and current morphed node translation, rotation, scale, cuased by ERC link?

I tried memorize then, transfer rigging etc,, but it seems not work , it not memorize ERC changed Current rig status.:roll:

Richard Haseltine

An ERC freeze should save all the changed settings, and as long as the links save with the controller you can then just save the new morph as an asset and be done.

I think it is possible to replace a morph with a modified version while using Reverse Deformations to subtract ERC linked morphs (but not scaling) - however I'm not certain, and I certainly can't recall the settings needed.

I don't know if a script could temporarily switch off the ERC for a morph, then another turn it back on again. I'll add it to my list of things to try, but that may take a long time.

kitakoredaz

Maybe there are some miss understanding,,(my english problem?)
I know how to save,, after ERC freeze already.
An ERC freeze should save all the changed settings

I ask the way because,,
eg I need to adjust FBM (FHM) which change eye node scale, neck scale,root scale,
and translate x, rotate eye by ERC too.

as for me, I usually do not make these morph. If I need to change scale, or translate eye,
I make obj as the shape and current size, current positon ,
then change rig positon by ERC. maybe change root node scale only.

but I have some morph which need to modify,transfered by generation X2 from Victoria4.
it work well, but I hope to modify a little the morphed mesh
and hope to overwrite it with ERC. not hope to make new morph and add, then ERC freeze.

If I do not reset current scaled and translated eye shape ,and each scaled node,
the shape has changed by ERC already as you know.

just export it, and modify ,after that import it to the genesis2female,
and overwrite the morph with ERC, by delta only, it must double effect about eye or each scale.

of course ds work correct, just keep ERC, and overwrite original, then
the morphed shape change node scale, eye positon etc again.

you know well, when forget to remove scale to overwrite generated morph, , and double scaled.
the efefct are dobule calculated. before and after.

So that, remove scale or node translation from morphed shape. and export modify it.
now it can overwrite original morph with ERC, as I planed.

but I mentioned above , it is not good when modify detail. I need to modify in modelor not actuall shape.
(the model are removed the ERC effect already)

on the other hand, morph loader pro can make delta morph, with reverse option from current shape.
then I can modify actuall morphed shape (not remove scale, or translattion of eye) in modelor.
but not hope to keep the morph. include the delta in the original morph then save and overwrite as one morph.

About this case, I think there is no way without doing same as I menitoned above , step2 and step3.
is it wrong?

kitakoredaz

About keep current rigs status (change Start and End point by Controller morph)
,(I think it may need script,, I request it daz of users ^^; too if you will make it I really thank you.
though I often say thank you every time ^^;)

I test again,, I am sorry,, maybe memorize figure rigging seem to work for keep current rigging modified by ERC too.,,
(About my test morph which ERC freezed with rig positon change,,,may need test again,,,)

then I can transfer the memorized rigs,,to new load genesis
and ERC freeze make new empty morph. maybe I can overwrite the morph by the way I menitoned above I think,,
I test again,,

But I hope option to save current rigging , and I need to save each node value, which changed by ERC too,,

though I can save poze preset with morph,,
but when I remove the morph to zero,, I can not re-apply the poze. (eye translation etc,,)
I may need check and memo one by one to re-make all ERC, it seems terrible,,

I hope save option, about current node rotation,transltation,scale only without controller,,,
(Or I miss something again ^^;?)

Richard Haseltine

You don't want to memorise a changed rig as that will break the base shape - the memorised settings are what the figure starts from, and the ERC Frozen changes are movements from the memorised state.

kitakoredaz

Richard, I understand clear what you talked .

But you can transfer rigging from memorized Actor. (which moved RIgs by ERC)
without prolbem.

I load genesis2female, then set two morphs value. each morph move gnesis2female rig positon
by ERC too.

I memorized the figure rigging.

of course it change the Rig postion as default, I know. I never save it.
I set name it as Transfer to clear see.

then Load new genesis2female as target too. it rigging is default not changed.

After that I transfer rigging from Transfer Genesis to Target.with shift click.
(I do not use transfer utility, about transfer Rigs)

it change genesis2female Curernt rigging (but keep the default value. only change current rig positon etc(
So that I can ERC freeze, as new morph . After that I just remove Source genesis2
then save the ERC linked morph (or controlelr, I plan to overwrite the morph, then make it as empty morph)
for genesi2female.

it work to chang Rig from default positon to morphed positon,without changing shape.
that means I mix two morph ERCs about RIg movements.

why I am serching the way is,, I transfer Ksenia head(for V4) to genesis2female by generationX.
generation X (and tansfer utility too) need to set Souse shape , then add transfered shape to
make Ksenia head. And each morph has many ERC. see my pic please.
pic1 = transfered Ksenia head ERC, pic2 = Victoria4head for genesis2female.

I simply hope to merge these two morphs delta with keeping ERCs.
the ERCs are about Rig positon, and node rotation too and save as one new ksenia morph.

I want to keep each character head moprh,(V4head, and Kseniahead for genesis2female) without ERC.
I hope to make new Ksenia head, and not hope to set ERC for V4 for gensis2female.

I can mix two morphs delta as one morph easy. but about ERCs I planed to save somwhere and transfer to the
new morph, then ERC freeze .

Above way is to transfer RIG movements only, cuased by two morphs ERC, (V4head and KseniaHead)
But About ERC linked node translation,Rotation,Scale , , I have not find good way.

You must feel, why I do not plan to ERC feeze, and make new controller,
or simply add V4head as subcomponent of Ksenia, but About character shape , I keep them
each morph, without link to other morph.

Genesis2 is good because it divide head and fullbody clear. if each parts character morph are no link eachother,
I can free mix each shape or subtract eazy.

Richard Haseltine

I think I follow, and I think that's probably going to be about as an efficient way of doing it as you can get.

kitakoredaz

Thank you much follow .:lol:
but ,, I can not manage well about each part scaling and rotation problem,,

the way (memorize and transfer rig (center points, end points) can not work about
tongue1 ,tongue2 scaling etc,,,

To simplify,,

Now I have two morphs for Actor Figure.

Morph1= delta vertices A + ERC subcomponents ( nodeA scale, Move RigsC (center,end,orientate))
Moprh2 = delta vertices B + ERC subcomponents (nodeB rotate, Move RigsD )

I want to make new morph by Morph1 30%, Morph2 70%
Morph 3
= ( delta vertices(0.3A+0.7B) + ERC subcomponents (nodeAscale*0.3,,nodeB rotate*0.7 ,MoveRigsC*0.3, MoveRigsD*0.7)
About this case, Morph1 and Morph2 are not linked by Morph3.

Not hope Morph3 = ERC subcomponents ( Morph1 * 0.3 + Morph2 * 0.7)
because,,, Morph1 and Morph2 are linked by Morph3.

I hope daz or Richard or some vendor offer these script, or plug in,
I must bought it,, (or I may need to try tweak formula ><;)</p>

I expect,, if Richard can find clear steps to achieve it,,, without using script,,,

My plan is,,, not only two morph mix,

eg when I make character presetC which change many morphs and properties value.
I want to gather them as one character morph, but which have no link to other character morphs.
only have subcomponents, which Node and Rigs change.

(of course I know the mixed morph can not be distributable,,without permission,,
but user can easy make and save as new character controller,
without linking other character morph,,, @@; of course,, I never mix head and Full body parts,)

Silas3D

Sorry to hijack this thread but it sounds similar to what I'm trying to achieve as per the thread I've created: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/43430/

Scenario:

1. Have created a triangulated dress that I want to conform to G2F.
2. Due to the amount of detail it is not practical to convert to quads in order to use smoothing modifier to aid mesh deformation.
3. Whilst I am able to load new dress morphs for figure shape presets (eg G2F to V6), I can't do the same for poses. When I've tried to do it, because the dress is conformed to G2F it tries to apply the transformation twice, is my best guess.
4. Ideally I want to be able to load morph targets for certain poses to behave automatically like the shape presets, rather than create a manual dial.

Is this possible?

Essentially I guess what I'm trying to do is transfer the CTRL morph created from ERC freeze in the figure to the clothing, so that I can replace the morph with a nice one that's not deformed. From what I can see its not transferring the CTRL morph when I use transfer utility but I may be doing something wrong!

Renpatsu

How about having a morph on G2F with autofollow that basically got the reversed morph on non-autofollow? This is essentially what the clothing modifier products do I think. So if you trigger said morph on G2F (e.g. via your pose ERC), it won't effectively modify G2F (the morph and the reversed one cancel each other out), but it should still trigger autofollow and thus would be replaceable by morphloader on the clothing.

Silas3D

This sounds like it could work but my understanding of how it works is quite limited given that I'm only just foraying into content creation hehe! Would you be able to give me step by step instructions how to do this, if you don't mind of course?

Assume that I have an obj of a t-pose dress, plus an additional obj for the pose preset. I'll also have other morphs for different base figures in G2F line (eg V6, A6, G6 etc) but for the sake of this lets just assume its G2F.

Silas3D

I've got a separate thread running so will stop hijacking this one ;)