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Dynamic Breasts, Softbodys, bullet physics, figure Collision(s)

sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 Posts: 0
edited June 2014 in The Commons

Looking for some help,

I'm looking for the easiest way to get dynamic breast movement in daz studio. I have seen a lot of amazing things poser can do with soft body bullet physics and was hopping to get something similar in daz studio.

model: Genesis

3 goals for the project i am working on.

1. Dynamic breasts so when my model walks jumps ext. they move realistically.

2. similar to goal 1, I want to have a scene were a model gets punched in the face and the skin acting as such?

3. again similar to goal 1 and 2, I want to be able to have genesis have birth.

I know you can do some of this with d forms, but i cant seem to get the right effect i want.


Budget: you can recommend anything but i want to keep it under $50 if possible.

I have seen a picture were someone have a orb under genesis's skin and made a bubble:

wancow said:
We already have collision detection in DS

Here's Genesis with a sphere under it's skin...

collisiontest.jpg
386 x 500 - 8K
Post edited by sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 on

Comments

  • Tramp GraphicsTramp Graphics Posts: 2,411
    edited December 1969

    joe imune said:
    Looking for some help,

    I'm looking for the easiest way to get dynamic breast movement in daz studio. I have seen a lot of amazing things poser can do with soft body bullet physics and was hopping to get something similar in daz studio.

    model: Genesis

    3 goals for the project i am working on.

    1. Dynamic breasts so when my model walks jumps ext. they move realistically.

    2. similar to goal 1, I want to have a scene were a model gets punched in the face and the skin acting as such?

    3. again similar to goal 1 and 2, I want to be able to have genesis have birth.

    I know you can do some of this with d forms, but i cant seem to get the right effect i want.


    Budget: you can recommend anything but i want to keep it under $50 if possible.

    I have seen a picture were someone have a orb under genesis's skin and made a bubble:

    wancow said:
    We already have collision detection in DS

    Here's Genesis with a sphere under it's skin...


    The first one is pretty easy. Just use this.

    For the second, your only real option is DFormers. Daz really doesn't have "Soft body dynamics".

    For the third, I'm not sure if you're asking if you can make the female figure look pregnant or actually have a baby pop out. For the first, you'll simply need a Pregnant morph. Luckily for you, that is included in this set. For the second, you'll first need a female genital prop or geograft, as well as special morphs that work with it. For that, I typically use this with the morphs converted for use with Genesis using this (I used the original Gen X).

  • Herald of FireHerald of Fire Posts: 3,504
    edited June 2014

    Right now you can do none of the things above directly... also a big 'eww' to number 3. Right now, there are no soft body physics in Daz Studio, however there is a plugin being worked on which will incorporate Bullet physics into the mix.

    The issue with most soft body physics is that it doesn't take into consideration bones. Since, by default, Genesis doesn't actually have a real skeleton, this means that the deformations would be done across the entire mesh. A blow to the jaw, would cause the entire face to flex and distort, including the teeth, eyes and any thing else in the affected area. To an extent, you want this since any impact will ripple across the surface of your skin, but there are certain parts you want to be considered 'rigid'.

    The catch is that these rigid parts are connected to soft body parts rather than a proper skeletal structure like the human body, meaning changes to one will affect the other. So simply applying rigidity to these parts still doesn't quite give you the level of control needed. You could do a very simplistic version, but making it believable is a lot more complex than simply adding collision mechanics.

    The Genesis 2 Female figure has poseable breasts, meaning they have their own separate bones and can be moved independently of each other. The advantage of this is that you can also animate movements for say, jogging, and move the breasts manually to match. Genesis is a bit trickier, but there are some movement and 'squish' morphs which you might want to look into that could help.

    Post edited by Herald of Fire on
  • sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 Posts: 0
    edited June 2014

    Glute and Breast Movement for Genesis looks like it isnt animation friendly\you need to spent to much time to make a smooth animation. as for birth i was more talking like the skin moving down and out , with a cloth covering the legs(PG Friendly)

    i should of noted that i would be only working with animations and not poses.

    Thanks for your time regardless

    Post edited by sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 on
  • Tramp GraphicsTramp Graphics Posts: 2,411
    edited December 1969

    joe imune said:
    Glute and Breast Movement for Genesis looks like it isnt animation friendly\you need to spent to much time to make a smooth animation. as for birth i was more talking like the skin moving down and out , with a cloth covering the legs(PG Friendly)

    i should of noted that i would be only working with animations and not poses.

    Thanks for your time regardless

    To my knowledge it's as animation friendly as any other movement morph set. It's really the only set out there that provides "realistic" breast and glute movement morphs for Genesis.
  • sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    HeraldOfFire said:
    Right now you can do none of the things above directly... also a big 'eww' to number 3. Right now, there are no soft body physics in Daz Studio, however there is a plugin being worked on which will incorporate Bullet physics into the mix.

    The issue with most soft body physics is that it doesn't take into consideration bones. Since, by default, Genesis doesn't actually have a real skeleton, this means that the deformations would be done across the entire mesh. A blow to the jaw, would cause the entire face to flex and distort, including the teeth, eyes and any thing else in the affected area. To an extent, you want this since any impact will ripple across the surface of your skin, but there are certain parts you want to be considered 'rigid'.

    The catch is that these rigid parts are connected to soft body parts rather than a proper skeletal structure like the human body, meaning changes to one will affect the other. So simply applying rigidity to these parts still doesn't quite give you the level of control needed. You could do a very simplistic version, but making it believable is a lot more complex than simply adding collision mechanics.

    The Genesis 2 Female figure has poseable breasts, meaning they have their own separate bones and can be moved independently of each other. The advantage of this is that you can also animate movements for say, jogging, and move the breasts manually to match. Genesis is a bit trickier, but there are some movement and 'squish' morphs which you might want to look into that could help.

    Thanks for the detailed response, i currently run daz 4.5 so i guess i need to upgrade for starters. I was hoping for a quick fix. I did read somewhere that cararra 8.5 had softbodys?

  • sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 Posts: 0
    edited June 2014

    Tramp Graphics said:
    joe imune said:
    Glute and Breast Movement for Genesis looks like it isnt animation friendly\you need to spent to much time to make a smooth animation. as for birth i was more talking like the skin moving down and out , with a cloth covering the legs(PG Friendly)

    i should of noted that i would be only working with animations and not poses.

    Thanks for your time regardless

    To my knowledge it's as animation friendly as any other movement morph set. It's really the only set out there that provides "realistic" breast and glute movement morphs for Genesis.

    Thanks for the info, I guess i will look on youtube to see it animated.

    I was truly hoping for something like poser and soft bodys. were you can take just 1 minute and come out with really good animations. Without the $130 price tag and having to learn a new software.

    Post edited by sharedwebsite_f3eda7d2c6 on
  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    joe imune said:
    Tramp Graphics said:
    joe imune said:
    Glute and Breast Movement for Genesis looks like it isnt animation friendly\you need to spent to much time to make a smooth animation. as for birth i was more talking like the skin moving down and out , with a cloth covering the legs(PG Friendly)

    i should of noted that i would be only working with animations and not poses.

    Thanks for your time regardless

    To my knowledge it's as animation friendly as any other movement morph set. It's really the only set out there that provides "realistic" breast and glute movement morphs for Genesis.

    Thanks for the info, I guess i will look on youtube to see it animated.

    I was truly hoping for something like poser and soft bodys. were you can take just 1 minute and come out with really good animations. Without the $130 price tag and having to learn a new software.DAZ studio simply does not have this at this time. The fact it is Free and doable with a cheaper than $130 set of morphs and some time spent on key framing the animation is still better in my book. Maybe look at the Tool Puppeteer and see if your goal can be reached a bit faster. I've not used Puppeteer in DS4.6.3 yet but have in the past with good results.

  • grinch2901grinch2901 Posts: 1,246
    edited December 1969

    joe imune said:

    I have seen a picture were someone have a orb under genesis's skin and made a bubble:

    wancow said:
    We already have collision detection in DS

    Here's Genesis with a sphere under it's skin...


    Is there a way to toggle which way smoothing goes? Like, if instead of a bubble poking out, what if I wanted to create a crater with the same sphere? The effect of smoothing would have to be reversed but I cannot see a setting to do that.

  • Tramp GraphicsTramp Graphics Posts: 2,411
    edited December 1969

    grinch2901 said:
    joe imune said:

    I have seen a picture were someone have a orb under genesis's skin and made a bubble:

    wancow said:
    We already have collision detection in DS

    Here's Genesis with a sphere under it's skin...


    Is there a way to toggle which way smoothing goes? Like, if instead of a bubble poking out, what if I wanted to create a crater with the same sphere? The effect of smoothing would have to be reversed but I cannot see a setting to do that.What determine whether collission will cause an item to envelop an object it's colliding with or be indented by it is based upon the two item's relative positions. In the case of the ball under the skin, it was enveloped because it is positioned deep into the figure's body. If it were brought out further away, it would only create an indentation.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,202
    edited December 1969

    even Poser cloth would not acheive what you want.
    unless deflated balloons on her chest the desire!

  • ghastlycomicghastlycomic Posts: 2,531
    edited December 1969

    wendy♥catz said:
    even Poser cloth would not acheive what you want.
    unless deflated balloons on her chest the desire!
    that_is_my_fetish.jpg
    303 x 312 - 16K
  • icprncssicprncss Posts: 3,694
    edited December 1969

    ghastlycomic said:
    wendy♥catz said:
    even Poser cloth would not acheive what you want.
    unless deflated balloons on her chest the desire!

    Do curious minds really want to know? :ohh:

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,202
    edited December 1969

    actually I since ran a hybrid cloth sim on D3D DSON imported Gia in PP12
    clothifying left and right pectorals
    result rather surprising will upload video soon, with some tweaking dynamic bouncy boobies may be actually feasable in Poser

  • jestmartjestmart Posts: 4,449
    edited December 1969

    Just like to point out that Genesis also has the pectoral bones.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,202
    edited December 1969

    my clothified boobs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNx6Efpspw0

  • Testing6790Testing6790 Posts: 1,091
    edited December 1969

    This isn't the software for you, unfortunately. At least nor for a long, long while. We're still pushing for dynamic cloth. Dynamic, believable human body movement would be welcome but orders of magnitude more difficult, I suspect.

  • JaderailJaderail Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    Movie quotes that say what Believe is doable in DAZ Studio 4.6.3.50

    Damn it Jim...
    We have the tools...
    We can rebuild him... If it was easy everybody would be doing it...
    It's Alive!!
    Push buttons and see what happens...
    So, what would you little maniacs like to do first?...

    The tools the morphs and all needed content is Right here, if a user wishes to invest the time a simulated softbody is doable in DS.

  • Mr Gneiss GuyMr Gneiss Guy Posts: 462
    edited December 1969

    Jaderail said:
    Movie quotes that say what Believe is doable in DAZ Studio 4.6.3.50

    Damn it Jim...
    We have the tools...
    We can rebuild him... If it was easy everybody would be doing it...
    It's Alive!!
    Push buttons and see what happens...
    So, what would you little maniacs like to do first?...

    The tools the morphs and all needed content is Right here, if a user wishes to invest the time a simulated softbody is doable in DS.

    The reason why this doesn't work in DS?
    "We forgot to hook up the doll!"

  • Neuron EdGeNeuron EdGe Posts: 21
    edited December 1969

    “We forgot to hook up the doll!”

    Not THAT's funny!

  • KaribouKaribou Posts: 1,325
    edited December 1969

    I hope it isn't "illegal" to post this link, but here's the result of one user's tragic outcome when first testing Poser's soft-body physics on V4...

    http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?message_id=4068499

    I laughed until I cried when I saw poor Vicky's fate!

  • MardookMardook Posts: 292
    edited June 2014

    LOL... You're right it is painful. Been laughing on and off.

    Anyway, since we are on the subject of dynamic bits and bobs, I hope to see some dynamic man parts for Michael in the future. :D

    And just to be clear, I am talking about his penis, testicles, buttocks and pecs. :o

    Post edited by Mardook on
  • Testing6790Testing6790 Posts: 1,091
    edited December 1969

    mardook said:
    LOL... You're right it is painful. Been laughing on and off.

    Anyway, since we are on the subject of dynamic bits and bobs, I hope to see some dynamic man parts for Michael in the future. :D

    And just to be clear, I am talking about his penis, testicles, buttocks and pecs. :o

    I think it's safe to say that soft body dynamics of any kind are not coming to DAZ within the next couple years.

  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,202
    edited December 1969

    I must try hybrid clothifying the geograft in Poser next

  • IvyIvy Posts: 7,165
    edited December 1969

    joe imune said:
    Tramp Graphics said:
    joe imune said:
    Glute and Breast Movement for Genesis looks like it isnt animation friendly\you need to spent to much time to make a smooth animation. as for birth i was more talking like the skin moving down and out , with a cloth covering the legs(PG Friendly)

    i should of noted that i would be only working with animations and not poses.

    Thanks for your time regardless

    To my knowledge it's as animation friendly as any other movement morph set. It's really the only set out there that provides "realistic" breast and glute movement morphs for Genesis.

    Thanks for the info, I guess i will look on youtube to see it animated.

    I was truly hoping for something like poser and soft bodys. were you can take just 1 minute and come out with really good animations. Without the $130 price tag and having to learn a new software.

    I've been working with Daz & poser in animation for awhile. I sorry to say this but you can not achieve at this time realistic soft body tissue movements in animation with daz studio as you can in poser pro 2014 and even in poser there are a lot of limitations to what soft body movements can be achieved. due to the limits of the sub-division in the mesh. unfortunately more realistic body movements require more powerful 3d programming.. I can feel your pain. I don;lt know anything about Carerra to know if that physic engine will achieve what your looking for or not.
    the best you can do with daz studio body moments at this time. for such as breast movements in Daz Studio animation is use Generation 4 figures and V4 alive ani-blocks http://www.daz3d.com/victoria-alive or m4 Alive ani-blocks

    I also found that the genesis alive ani blocks http://www.daz3d.com/genesis-alive don't seem to work as well as gen 4 one. they seem more blocky for lack of a better word.
    either way both sets gen 4 and genesis ani-blocks will still have limitations on how real they looks and that they are not really soft body tissue controls.
    As far as your needs for a baby to come out of the characters vagina you will need to do some creative editing with either daz or poser to achieve that effect. just because those morphs sets have not been developed that I know of for these programs.

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