SKin and Facail morph Help
Kids Fantasy Art
Posts: 34
I have created this skin morph for the general Genesis Male character in DAZ3D. When I load the texture map, it doesn't quite look the way it should. My question is, am I doing something wrong by just loading the texture maps, displacement maps, and specular maps? Is there a better process to get my created face to actual fit the model I intend it for? Please any help would be great. I have attached the actual jpg to show what I have created.
mefaceTrans.jpg
1024 x 1024 - 490K
mefaceMain.jpg
1024 x 1024 - 748K
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Comments
What did you use as the basis for the skin texture?
The textures that come with any particular figure, are produced from templates that are UV Maps of the skin surface. Each figure will have it's own UV Map, and some of them have several. For example, Genesis (original) is UV Mapped to take skins for V4, M4 and Kids 4. Which did you use, and what Genesis figure is it for (Genesis, Genesis 2 Male)?
I used the starting base of Basic Genesis Male. I found the original Map files for that figures and just used those guides to create my skin map. Did I not do the that right? I Was trying to turn Genesis male into my character I created.
What you have created, is a new skin map for Genesis. I thought that you meant that it was not lining up properly.
It will NOT change the genesis figure in any way, only the skin. If you want your figure to have a particular look to it, you would need to create a morph, by using the morph packages that are available in the store, and then moving the sliders in the Parameters pane to get the desired effect.
You could use this : http://www.daz3d.com/genesis-evolution-morph-bundle the two are also sold separately, Head Morphs and Body Morphs. There are also free morphs available on ShareCG which you might find useful as well.
I'd add some things to what Jimmy said.
Your texture map looks like you were working from an actual (and poorly lit, but we'll come back to that) photograph of an actual human. Converting photographs to figures is a complex, two-part process.
1) You have to make a texture map (the "warped picture" like you're showing us) that conforms to the figure's "UV Map" (the "map" that stretches and pulls the texture map to exactly fit the shape of the figure). This is a painful process, requiring expertise in an image editor that allows you to stretch and squeeze parts of the image. You can do it in Photoshop, with practice. Some parts of the map are especially hard to manipulate, mostly around the eyes and nose. The texture map doesn't control shape, it only controls texture. If you put your map on Teen Josie, you'd get a young girl with a perfectly shaped young girl head that would look like someone had used makeup or paint to give her rotten skin, dark eye sockets, stubble, and pock marks.
2) You need a "morph target", a set of "instructions" that tell DAZ Studio (or Poser, or Blender, or any other 3D program) how to change the shape of the face. It only controls shape, if you applied that morph to a teen, they'd get a saggy chin and upturned nose. You could select a uniform gray texture, and your new morph would give the "statue" the proper facial shape. There are tutorials for starting with a photograph and morphing a figure underneath that photograph to get the face into the proper shape. Unfortunately, those tutorials are complex.
There are a couple of programs on the market that can automatically convert a picture to a "matched set" of morph (to transform the shape) and a properly mapped texture map.
Faceshop http://www.daz3d.com/faceshop-8-win
Face Gen (not DAZ, so you have to google it).
I've used Face Shop. It's "iffy". I'd suggest trying the Face Gen demo.
OK, now to the fine art of texture maps.
A displacement or bump map is a whole lot more than a texture map converted to B&W. Poor bump and displacement maps are the number one cause of really unrealistic looking figures.
Making a texture map from photographs requires photos with flat (soft), uniform lighting. The lighting in yours was too hard (specular) and directional. When you render a 3D scene, the "3D engine" creates highlights and shadows based on the positions of the lights in the scene and the shape of the figure. It makes the right kinds of shadows in the eye sockets, under the nose, under the chin, etc. and the right highlights on the eyebrow ridge, the nose, the lips. Your map already has highlights and shadows from the light that the picture was taken in. When the 3D engine renders that image, it will add its highlights and shadows to your highlights and shadows and create a ghastly caricature of an image.
There are lots of good tutorials on this. You'll have to dig up a few and read/watch them.
Thanks Jimmy_C and WIz for the useful information. I am going to try the morph bundle as suggested because the actual Face Map I did, I actually wanted to fit a model and that become the face of the model but it did not line up that way. I thought it might be that simple. Do any of you guys offer 3d services? I am illustrating a book and the need 2 characters to look like a certain character I was wondering if that is something you guys would like to help with? I only need the face and hair to resemble my son. I am using the Kids4 bundle and morph pack for him. Would you recommend me making a face mat for the as well using hi res photos or just playing with the morph sliders?
Thanks again for your time and help.
I would like to help you if I can regarding advice on custom-dialing Genesis, Gen2F and Gen2M. I love creating morphs. What do you want to do? Keep in mind K4 is a different figure than Genesis. For hair, you simply need to find a style that fits your image (check the shop, freebie sites and so on; or if you prefer to delve deeper straightaway, start modelling yourself in Blender or something similar).
If you are just starting out, creating a custom texture sounds too complex. Doesn't a texture you got with DS or something from the 3D market (shops, freebies...) fit? Remember you can make adjustments to an already created skin - you only have to check the EULA if you want to publish it. Resource kits allow redistribution (some for freebies, most for paid-for items only), typical skins usually don't.
When it comes to the skin you posted, I only know how to use resource kits (I have never created a skin completely from scratch), but it is quite obvious the nose should be much flatter.
Thanks cecilia.robinson. What I am trying to do, is take the photo of my son (attached) and make the main character in my book resemble him. I thought it would be as simple as a skin and face mat but it seems like it would be a little more that just that. I purchased and downloaded the Genesis Morph Bundle last night and thought about starting with that and see if I can create the look myself instead of using the K4 Kids. I would to get some help with the sculpting or morphing of the face so I can focus on the other creations like, costume, furniture and props to be used in the book. @cecilia.robinson if this something you are familiar with, I would love to get you involved somehow.
Thanks again for everyone's useful information.
What a nice little guy! You must be proud :). Yes, I think making a morph similar to his face shouldn't be too difficult. Genesis is more flexible than K4 in my humble opinion. Sometimes, I dial in quite a lot of adult morphs to get a kid. What I'd like to advise you in to get yourself DieTrying's 182 Morphs for Genesis. They are free and very useful. Young Teens are extremely useful too, but we can try to do without them to diminish your costs. Do you know a character that could be a quick starting point?
Thank you for the compliment. I would say that "Toon Boy Sam - http://www.daz3d.com/toon-boy-sam" would be a great starting point or "Edmond - http://www.daz3d.com/platinum-club-items/edmund" Basically, any character that would make morphing heis face easier would be a great starting point. I willing to try things that I have not tried before, because I want to make a serious out the character once he is created...I have plenty of photos to reference if the one attached is not good enough for a starting point.
Toon boy Sam you would find very limiting, because of the lack of morphs available.
Edmond, is a texture for a clothing set for the K4 figure
The K4 figure is here http://www.daz3d.com/the-kids-4-base you would also need the morphs++ pack http://www.daz3d.com/the-kids-4-morphs
However, you would actually be better of buying a bundle like this one as it contains both of those, and some other items, some clothing, some extra skins and character packs and some poses. http://www.daz3d.com/the-kids-4-complete If you decide to use K4.
You can see here how much is available for this figure http://www.daz3d.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=kids+4
The skin you are working with looks too grown-up (forehead wrinkles)...might be better to work with a skin made for a child character. I'd recommend Children of the World by Virtual_World, which works with both Kids 4 and Genesis (the set also includes morphs for Kids 4 only).
When loading any skin textures, if it doesn't seem to fit the figure properly, make sure that you have the figure's skin surfaces set to the appropriate UV set.
For the morphs, if you're using Genesis and wish to dial your own character, I'd highly recommend both Growing Up and Thorne and Handspan Studios' Head Morph Resource Kits (#3 is particularly good for children).
@chohole I actually have the Kids 4 Base and the Morphs Bundle as well. Thanks for the suggestions @Scott-Livingston I am looking at the Growing up Bundle and see how that could help me as well. This is really going to be a fun project for me that I am excited about. I am just a newbie to 3d character modeling. It seems the best way to approach this, is by doing a morph and try to get the look I want by using the sliders. Thanks guys.
In fact... While Sam as a standalone figure would be limiting indeed, 3DUniverse made his Genesis version: http://www.daz3d.com/3d-universe/sadie-and-sam-for-genesis. Basically, you are covered here: he's very similar to your boy! See that promo: http://www.daz3d.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/3/d/3dugnsadiepopup3.jpg - they look so alike!
Of course, there will be some toon touch to a character out of Sam, but with Genesis, you can always dial in the morph partially, say, 75%. You can also dial in a negative value - it is useful. Regarding the skin, Scott is right. This (http://www.daz3d.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/m/a/main_20.jpg) or that (http://www.daz3d.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/p/o/popup2_65.jpg) look particularly convincing for him. I also thought about the following:
http://www.daz3d.com/children/jamika-for-k4
http://www.daz3d.com/base-young-teens
http://www.daz3d.com/children/jade-for-the-kids-4
http://www.daz3d.com/children/sammy-for-kids4
So what is your plan?
My plan is to dig deeper into the morphing. I am so stoked about this book that I actually purchased everything you guys have been talking to practice with. Although, If you have some free time and want to earn some extra $$ I would love to see what you can come up with to make the character look very similar to my sons image. As much as I am attached to this project personally, I still want it o come out right. :) I am sure with time I can get the morphs down right but at the moment I would love to spend that time on designing the backgrounds and other characters for the book. Would you be willing to take a crack at the main characters resemblance?
What do you think about this starting point for the morph?
I think for a start it looks pretty good. I love the colors of his skin minus the freckles. lol also the bottom lip could be a little fuller. all together I like it. I'm sure hair color and style can all be tweaked overall design is complete. Also, here is a skin without Freckles that I started, I can send you to overlay on what you have been doing. I unfortunately haven't gotten to the hair yet. I'm getting excited as things are moving forward.
Also, I would love to keep in touch this weekend. Feel free to email any thing you come up with to this address: "[email protected]" my weekend email.
Thank you again for all your help.
Acapers
I used WildMane Hair to ensure you have it without spending anything - it is included in DS. I could not find a better skin, so if you created your own, it will surely be better. More reference images is also appreciated. I will try to prepare an email on the weekend, it's almost midnight now ;).
Almost Midnight...Where are you located?
That would be awesome if you can send over an email this weekend. I have also attached a couple more images of my son so you can see as requested. I will most likely use the skin mat I created for the texture so it looks more like his. I really appreciate your help with this.
Feel free to reach out to me any time if you have questions.
ACapers
I'm sure it's easier to communicate over e-mail, but if anyone has time I'd love to see updates too! I'm about to start a similar project, creating a character that resembles my daughter so I've been eagerly following this thread. Your results so far have been very encouraging!
We switched to emails in order not to swamp the forum... Ask Anthony if he has nothing against showing the progress, I treat this kind of work as rather confidential, the morph is as closely resembling a certain private person as possible.
Hey Guys, thanks for checking back in. I am not opposed to showing the images and progress once they are created to my liking. Yes, email has been a lot easier and safer as Cecilia is correct. This is an image of a person that I do not want floating all over the internet. Although, it might be too late. lol @Bduncan I can only say that with time and patience, it can be done using DAZ. I am having a blast creating my main characters. You just all the pieces to morph everything to your liking.
I understand that confidentiality is a consideration, but seeing as the gentleman already posted three pictures of his son I'm hoping he'll be willing to allow me the opportunity to learn from his progress. I'm most interested in the steps involved in reaching the desired result. When I start a project I find myself getting discouraged if it doesn't work out just right the first time, I'm hoping that observing someone else's trial and error will be the motivation I need.
It's very kind of you to help, btw!
Thanks for getting back to me :-)
No problem. In fact, the only important step is divided in two:
- having as many morph kits as possible,
- experimenting with the dials keeping the reference images at hand.