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Clarke Ok I did a quick little shadow test approximating your pose.
Light intensity was 50, spread 50. White. Shadow settings illustrated.
I had a small soft fill at her back, should have moved it more to her shoulder. No shadows on it.
Im just punting. Maybe the pros know better. I know the light needs adjusting, just playing quick with the shadows.
Hello,
@clarke: Well done. But there's always something... :-)
My first impression is that it lacks depth. How did you setup your lights? Guess behind the plant is a light, any more lights? When it's behind it, it's a weird shadow at her chest.
What do you think to cast some light through the windows? Put one ore two overlapping spots in the windows and let the day cast into the room.
It could emphasize the depth, which I'm missing...
I think the second one is better framed.
Hopefully that helps.
Your suggestion to Clarke to shine light through the windows is good, but I wouldn't do it as direct sunlight. Take a look at the buildings through the windows. The windows letting in the light would be on the shady side of the building. Instead of sunlight, I would recommend a slightly lower intensity, diffuse, wide angel, blueish light. Not shining down, but shining in horizontally. But as I said with my other posts, if you want to work on lights, cool, but it is a DOF contest, so if you're getting down to the wire, or getting frustrated, concentrate on the Contest. Mostly, have fun!
It is the freebie tutorial scene included in DAZ 4 Pro. "Ready to Render - Dragon Slayer" in products.
I'm using that set in an image that's rendering as I type. Actually, the image is done being rendered, I'm waiting for the DOF to be applied (it's a post-render effect in Carrara.) It'staking longer to apply the DOF than it did to render. Probably because of the particle generator.
You can see the start and end time of the render, and the current progress bar and time in the screen shots. Ugh! There's a reason I do it in post-production. The image is 2000X1500.
Clarke, that's very nice work. I agree with what's already been said...just wanted to add one more thing: your subject might seem a bit more lifelike if you change her facial expression a little and/or have her looking in a direction other than straight ahead. Maybe you already know how to do that, but in case you don't, right-click on her head and choose 'Select "Genesis" head,' then go to the posing tab, click on Pose Controls, and you'll see a number of different sliders you can use.
Here's what I was working on. The DOF was done in Carrara. I used a particle generator with little billboards that had an alpha map applied, and a color gradient keyed to the "life" of the particle in the glow channel. The longer the particle was in the scene before decaying, the darker it got. Makes a nice effect, but played hell with the DOF. The edges of the fire showed jaggies and artifacts, so I had to fix the edge of the fire in Photoshop. Other than that, it's as-is out of the software.
I'm providing a screen shot of my light rigs and settings if anybody is interested. I did use a rectangular shape light at the bottom of the set to provide a uniform lit-from-below effect.This was my brightest light. The top banks of lights are to simulate reflected light from the ceiling. A shape light emits light evenly across it's shape, whereas a spot light, bulb light etc, emit light from a point. If your software doesn't have shape lights, make a bank of of spot lights with a wide angle pointing up. Probably would work best in two rows, but that's for this set. Each scene is different, so your mileage may vary.
Thanks gang, for your kind comments as well as for not letting me off easy! :coolsmile: Your constructive criticism really means a lot to me.
This is exactly what I was attempting...the gorgeous light coming in a north-facing window. My degree (years ago) is in photography, so I know beautiful light when I see it, but trying to create it in a 3D app is entirely new to me.There are several lights in this scene...I left 2 or 3 spots in that came with Apartment 39 (plus I added another) pointing down, illuminating various parts of the apartment. I put one UberAreaLight in each window to try and simulate the window light...they don't add too much to the scene because cranking them up got the stuff in the background too bright.
The model is being lit with two lights, the main light is a large UberAreaLight being used as a soft box, that's what's casting the shadow from her hair. I love the light these produce (like a soft box in a RL studio)(but murder on the render time, tho), so first thing I'll do is try to move it so it's at least coming from the same direction as the window. The backlight is a pale yellow spot.
There's also a dim Distant light illuminating the whole scene in a faint blue...I was trying to cool down the background so the warm backlight could help her pop out of the environment.
I'm going to at least attempt all the suggestions you've made so far...hopefully I'll have something more for you to look at in a few days!
Since it looks like this thread is still on the go and we are on the topic of lighting I thought this little tutorial might be of use to the Brycers. It was designed for people who know their way around the standard Bryce lighting model and maybe have already have their scenes setup to use that (or are using some components from pre-made scenes) and wish to upgrade their lighting effects. Since this is a DOF challenge already, it makes sense to upgrade the lighting as DOF in Bryce generally relies on the use of premium effects. And also since DOF is most suited to small scale subject material (unless you've been watching too many video games these days), it also makes sense to combine DOF with TA (true ambiance lighting). Here then Bryce 20 minute lighting project - upgrading lighting - a tutorial by David Brinnen
The scene is simple, the initial lighting set up is simple, adapting to TA or IBL is a conceptual step up... but I would hesitate to suggest it was beyond the grasp of a beginner who had a relatively modern computer and was prepared to invest some time experimenting.
Is TA (True Ambience) like Indirect Light (or Global Illumination) in Carrara? I ask because the image you posted looks like you have a sphere with a glowing shader that's casting light. Carrara also has a glow for it's shaders but they cast no light unless Indirect light is enabled. It can create some very nice effects, however the hit in render time can be enormous if the scene is complex.
@ Clarke The photography experience will help. As I stated before, this DOF thing didn't click for me till I dug up the "using the Spotmatic F" out of my dusty brain achives. (my mentor/instructor used a Speed Graphic 4x5)
You have the DOF down. Now, its just putting frosting on a nice cake.
Heh, 70's. I photographed horses, in natural light, did everything in BW. One.. two hour window in the morning for light.
At least here our "lenses" don't distort, foreshorten or flatten.
@ Evilproducer That set is worth working with. Nice effect and I dont feel the DOF was harmed much, the dragon still pops in the big view.
Is TA (True Ambience) like Indirect Light (or Global Illumination) in Carrara? I ask because the image you posted looks like you have a sphere with a glowing shader that's casting light. Carrara also has a glow for it's shaders but they cast no light unless Indirect light is enabled. It can create some very nice effects, however the hit in render time can be enormous if the scene is complex.
I'm sorry I can't answer that question with any real confidence of being right, I've tried Carrara and never really got on with the interface. What I can say is that (TA) True Ambience is an indirect lighting solution and a form of global illumination.
Here's the technical answer.
In Bryce the mechanics of TA are this. N (where N is a number determined by the RPP (rays per pixel) set in the render options) rays are traced from a pixel on the screen to a point in your scene geometry. When this is encountered a probe is generated from the polygon surface normal with a +-90 degree random factor in both axis of the surface normal and this probe extends along this new path and the process is repeated until either Max Ray Depth or the sky or a none diffuse surface is hit. The probes sum of encounters then contributes to the value of that pixel along with all the other rays allocated to that pixel. Reflections and transparencies needless to say push the calculations through the roof because they combine both diffuse themselves as well as spawning additional probes and direct paths which result in more probes. We have dubbed this entire process "light gathering" to avoid confusion with methods that rely on "light reflection". The difference being that, gathered light is highly diffuse while reflected light, because it is deterministically controlled and not random (even when softened), will result in image reflections.
Also, scene complexity does not increase TA render times, if it is just the geometry complexity that is going up. Which suggests that Carrara might be using a different form of global illumination. Material complexity in the form of reflection and transparency and the addition of direct light sources however, will increase TA render time dramatically.
TA is never fast, but it is good. Here'a another little tutorial to show it in action.
Bryce still life project - "capsules" - a 15 minute tutorial by David Brinnen
DOF is also used in this tutorial...
Thanks for the response. I perhaps used complex scene in the wrong context. When I typed it, I was thinking of transparencies, alphas, etc. I can't go into the depth you did, because then I would be out of my depth.
My only advantage is that I've had chance to talk to the programmers and they had the patience to explain the process to me time and again, until it seemed I'd finally "got it". Otherwise, I'm just as clueless - global illumination is a deep topic. From what you said though, perhaps similar to Carrara - nothing new under the GI sun. In the tutorial (if you watched it) you will see the glow effect is a combination of softened direct light and indirect light from material ambient properties. TA is top quality for ambient light, but somewhat boringly uniform if not backed up by direct lighting. Be nice to have photon mapping in tool box as well... but can't everything. Being able to drive the TA with TA optimised HDRI is best of all worlds, and a pretty rare feature I think. Worth the time spent learning it if you have a spare 20 minutes...
Here's two examples using no GI and using GI in Carrara. I also used DOF to keep on topic ;-) Sorry for the crappy composition.
My only advantage is that I've had chance to talk to the programmers and they had the patience to explain the process to me time and again, until it seemed I'd finally "got it". Otherwise, I'm just as clueless - global illumination is a deep topic. From what you said though, perhaps similar to Carrara - nothing new under the GI sun. In the tutorial (if you watched it) you will see the glow effect is a combination of softened direct light and indirect light from material ambient properties. TA is top quality for ambient light, but somewhat boringly uniform if not backed up by direct lighting. Be nice to have photon mapping in tool box as well... but can't everything. Being able to drive the TA with TA optimised HDRI is best of all worlds, and a pretty rare feature I think. Worth the time spent learning it if you have a spare 20 minutes...
I haven't had a chance yet to watch the tutorials. They're on my list, but my wife has a honey-do list today and it's only a matter of time before I'm called away...
I'm surprised newest Bryce doesn't have a photon map. One of the tricks I use when using GI is rendering a low res image, and saving the photon map, then using that map to render the full resolution image. Saves a lot of time calculating the lighting!
Edited to add that the sphere's use a glow. I didn't set translucency, sss, or the like.
Nice renders! Good use of DOF ;)
I concede that Carrara has some good render options, for me the issue isn't the render engine, just the interface I can't get on with.
Not a problem! Everybody has their comfort zone. I learned in Raydream and later Carrara. The first time I tried DAZ Studio* was the point between Raydream no longer working on my updated system and buying Carrara. The interface (version 1.x) made me want to crawl back and wrap myself in a Raydream blanket and suck my thumbs while I waited for my eyes to heal.
Strangely enough, I had dabbled with an early version of Bryce and I found Carrara's assembly room's view/camera manipulation controls fairly similar to Bryce. The RSE (Realistic Sky Editor) was similar back then as well. Since Carrara's roots are in the old Raydream Studio, I also found a remarkable number of things similar (some not even changed at all) to how they were in Raydream. The Spline modeler and some of the effect dialogues for instance are- or were practically identical in Carrara 5.
*Not a dig at DAZ Studio. Just personal preference.
Scaling textures in Bryce
Hi
Bryce 7.1 Pro
Any tips on how best to scale textures when using the transformation tool in the material editor?
There are so many variables that it would be difficult to offer a succinct "tip" as such. The best thing to do is consider specific problems. Not only are there many kinds of textures, the way they behave varies between channel to channel and the way they are mapped can also have a profound influence on how they scale. I have made many video tutorials which incorporate scale adjustments with the transformation tools. Perhaps these four might help you out (see image) if you are starting out - if you are more experienced there are tutorials to suit your skill level there also.
They can be found here http://www.bryce-tutorials.info/bryce-tutorials.html - scroll down the page a bit, look under my name.
Hey folks!! It's great to see so many tips and examples provided for people to learn from. Thanks also for the links From David, I'm sure the Bryce Users are Very Happy.
Now with that said, I belive we are getting just a bit too Off Topic for the Thread. The main thrust should Stick to DOF as much as possible. I think the Tip's are good enough to stay, this is a teaching Thread. Just keep DOF in mind when you give tips. If a user wishes to learn more on anther topic please refer them to another thread on that topic or start one to continue the conversation.
Thank You.
Hi
Thanks for the tip.
I'm hoping yo enter this contest. Part of the image is to use a texture, & DOF.
Hope you will see what I mean when I upload a image.
Thanks
I am here in spirit and check in once a day and there are some cracking images already. Some could do with looking at it and asking themselves what is DOF for really. I am not trying to be funny of difficult but understanding why we use DOF is just as important in knowing how to use if effectively. Don't be scared of losing the detail in the back and foreground. Yeah I know you spent ages placing the props, setting up the camera angle etc. What will it do to the image if more blur is used. Will it focus the viewers eyes instantly to where the sharp infocus subject matter is.
Memory saving tip: To save on memory remove all Bump and Displacement maps for any surfaces that are getting blurred. You don't need them if you are blurring the detail. :)
I've started a thread in the Art Studio section of the forums where I'll upload the work I've done the last few years. Right now, because of this contest I'm focusing on ones where I used the software's DOF or postwork to achieve DOF. Feel free to take a look, comment and ask questions if you wish. That way I can avoid diluting this thread with off-topic related posts. ;-)
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/5999/
That's a grand idea EP thanks. Some good renders in that thread.
I have been playing with this one for a couple of days and don't think I can enter it as i already have two.
Would love some feedback on what you think.
Looks really nice.
I think the contest is a success, because what you have learned made that image very nice.
Lovely.
If it’s possible maybe some more blur in the back and focus on a piece of the fountain and the two persons in the front.
Good work.:)
Lovely.
If it’s possible maybe some more blur in the back and focus on a piece of the fountain and the two persons in the front.
Good work.:)
I think I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. I personally think bluemoon has a very natural (to my eye) level of DOF. Anymore and it might appear forced, like a miniature photographed with a macro lens. That's just my opinion. So much is in the eye of the beholder.