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DAZ Productions, Inc.
224 S 200 W, Suite #250
Salt Lake City, UT 84101
Licensing Agreement | Terms of Service | Privacy Policy | EULA
© 2024 Daz Productions Inc. All Rights Reserved.
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Oh, I should have thought of that opacity fix! I'll give it a try. Thanks.
Edit:Yes, that worked just fine!
I actively use this plugin. I created about 30 scenes, mostly static frames and a few scenes with animation.
For static scenes, it is better to use "Static thickened object". You just need to simulate the source with d-force (clothing that does not have a thickness). After that, create a static thickened object for the desired frame on the timeline. Click the render button. Yes, it is best to create a thickened object at the very end of your work.
I am adding a sub-division Level for a thickened object. And the source remains in the base resolution. I've read this thread and everyone is basically adding a Sub-Division Level for the source. So you have a subdivided source and a thickened copy that also has more polygons. I think this additionally loads the PC.
Now about the Dynamic Thickened object. This works best if you set the necessary parameters once.
And here is my error report. After I added a dynamic thickened object to the scene, I set all the necessary parameters and assigned a sub-division level for the dynamic thickened object. I decided to reduce the number of sub-divisions in the border from 2 to 0. This reset the mesh resolution of the thickened object in the viewport to the base one. But the parameters will indicate that this object is still in high resolution. But if you switch the viewing window display mode to wire shaded mode, you will see that this object has a base mesh. And even deleting and creating a new dynamic thickened object will not help. Closing the daz3d and reopening it solved this problem for me.
I did a little experiment to see how the thickened result would differ for subD before and subD after thickening. I used Static thickening for this experiment. My conclusion is that the results depend a lot on the original object's resolution and curvature and the amount of subdivision applied. The difference between subD before and after thickening can result in a drastically different final mesh topology. Admittedly, this is a pretty extreme example, since I wanted to investigate what actually happens. On clothing and with lower values, the difference is much less obvious, I'm sure! It could come in handy when resources are tight.
I created a primitive cube. Then I used the geometry editor to remove the 4 center top polygons. I used Mesh Grabber to raise the center up. I used subD 4 in my test.
On the left, the original object with subD 4 applied. On the right, the original object at base resolution. I have Triangulation Wireframe Opacity set to 41% in the Draw Settings pane, to show the underlying "hidden" triangulation of polygons done by Daz Studio.
The object on the left had subD applied before thickening. The object on the right had subD 4 applied after thickening. Notice the drastic difference in mesh topology.
Iray render of the thickened objects. Notice the scalloped and ridged pink border on the right.
These are the settings I used.
I'm not sure if I understood you:
By sub-division level you mean the Subdivision of border, don't you? The mesh resolution parameter of the General parameters of a geometric object is independent of the Subdivision of border. The latter controls the only some subdivision of the border, that is, the facets that closed the open mesh. This subdivision is different from the SubD level.
Edit - Object - Geometry - Convert to SubD
This is what I did with a Dynamic Thickened object. If after this action you open the parameters of a dynamic thickened object and change the "Subdivisions in border" parameter, the object's resolution level will change to the Base in the viewport. But the parameters will say "High resolution"
Try removing the check mark from the "Triangulate non planar facets" item. This will make the result better.
But I decided to repeat your experiment and did the same in blender. I have attached the images. It seems that "after subD" works something like in blender. I mean these not perfectly round edges between the border and the outside of the mesh. But I also noticed geometry distortions at the top on the thickened object, which was then converted to a SubD. I do not know what caused this. I have attached an image of the base mesh. The distortion is clearly visible in the top view.
I think that "SubD after" works correctly, because it is similar to how blender works. With the exception of the mesh distortions that I described above
If you use a negative offset value (thickening inwards), then this works even better. And now it really looks like blender.
Although the border is still distorted to "SubD after". Do you see this wavy border?
I actually like this plugin. I just want it to get even better
"High resolution" is an option of the Mesh Resolution parameter. This parameter isn't a Thickener one. They're completely independent. If you use SubD, it would be unnecessary to use the Subdivision in border for most cases.
Yes. I know that these are independent parameters. I just wanted to get a sharper border. I have set 2 sub-divisions in the border and set the border protrusion to 0%. After that, I converted the dynamic thickened object to a SubD, so that the rest of the mesh was smoothed out
I like it too, very much! Look at all we are learning about it by experimenting!
Yes, I see the wavy distorted border, too. I think to get a nice symmetric border from the thickener, we need to use the Scaling option instead of the default option. Look at the difference in the way the border topology is created, between the default thickening and the scaled thickening. The border is in dark red in the attached images.
Edit: Scaling makes quite a different, more angular shape from my object, so it would be nice if the default option created a more symmetrical, less wavy border. I don't know if that is even feasible or not.
The border is part of the thickened mesh, so won't it get smoothed out, too?
It will be smoothed out, but taking into account the geometry in it. Here's a look at these images. The border is marked in red. If the border has 2 sub-divisions, then it will be slightly sharper
I hope that someone posts a video tutorial at some point because I'm getting rather lost just trying to follow what's going on in this thread, never mind actually using the plugin. For example, I am clueless about when to use static and dynamic. I thought that dynamic should be used for dForce items but now it seems that either can be used but I have no idea when or how.
Just now I had a scene loaded with a dress and I thought that a lace trim could do with a bit of thickness but I chickened out because the procedure is just too complicated (at least in my mind - trying to remember all the tips I've read here). For example, the lace trim was not the original texture - I had loaded a shader preset to give it the lace look - but I remembered that there's some problem with loading shaders. Anyhow, I loaded a different dress instead.
That doesn't look like a "thickened" object. I am having trouble underatanding what you are trying to do with the thickener border subdivision and the overall mesh subdivision after thickening.
Did you find and read the PDF manual that comes with the product?
I just wanted to show how the upper part bends. Here is a thickened object
I did and I have read it through but I must be getting thick in my old age. For someone who used to write technical manuals, I find that PDF inpenetrable. For example:
Whatever that means is completely lost on me.
When thickening an object, to create the extra surface the original vertices are copied and translated some distance in the normal direction. As a result, some of the new quadrilaterals may take a "bent" shape: not all the new vertices are in the same plane. These quadrilaterals are known as non-planar quads (The geometric shells also produce this benting).
Sometimes, the non-planar quads could produce rendering artifacts. The option Triangulate non planar facets tells the plugin to divide these quadrilaterals in triangles (Triangles doesn't cause these artifacts).
I do appreciate that you took the time to explain that but I have to say that it means little to me. I am not a 3D modeller. I know very litte about planar facets and quadrilaterals so an explanation that uses those terms is over my head. I just want to know how to add thickness to a dress or some pants or a blanket. I want to know how to do that if I use dForce and what to expect if I animate the people wearing those clothes.
I am sure that many who buy your products really would like to know all those technical details and will understand the potential of the product better for it. There will be others who will read this thread and decide against buying because it seems to require such a technical understanding. I am on the verge of returning it because of that.
@marble stop selling yourself short.
Here is one way to add thickness to a dress:
That's it. Now you have a thickened dress in your viewport.
If you want it thicker, go back to the Parameters pane and change the Offset(cm) to a larger number.
If you change the character's pose, Toggle the Thickener mesher Enable control to Off and back to On. The thickened dress will be updated to match the new pose. If the dress is dForce and you have to resimulate, set the Dynamic thickened object Enable to Off first. Then simulate. Then set the Dynamic thickened object Enable to On again.
Oddly enough that's exactly the procedure that I followed, if only due to guesswork and logic (with some help from you regarding the disable/enable control). I still don't know why I opted for dynamic other than I suspected that would be what works for dForce cloth. The PDF manual was little to no help - the technical jargon really is over my head. I discovered the Stretch UV thing just because the dress I tried had an opacity map which caused an odd band around the hem when I ran the Thickener. I started pushing buttons and that one was the one that worked.
This thread has benefited greatly from your testing and highlighting bugs. We can argue about post-purchase beta testing but I think that a product that adds an obvious and desireable feature should be presented to the customer base working and well explained in simple-to-follow terms.
I don't disagree with your statement, but I will counter to say that Alberto has provided MUCH more help than most PAs provide:
I am very pleased with what Thickener has added to the Daz ecosystem. Alberto should be quite proud of what he has created. When I get something this useful, I dig in to see what all I can do with it. I find bugs in just about everything that is this complicated. Some PAs use me as a beta tester for that reason.
So let's march on and find more interesting ways to use the Thickener...
This wouldn't work for everything, but for this tank top, I found that I could essentially add a wide border with the Thickener. The border is a separate surface. I could have used a different shader on it, but I chose to use the same one as the tank top and adjust the tiling to make it look of similar scale.
Thin
Thickened
Settings
Alberto is the best
And mesh topology is not "technical", it's all based on high school geometry. Any triangle defines a plane because it consists of three points, and they define a plane (we live in a three-dimensional space). When you add a new point - to make a quad - it may or may not lie in the same plane. If it's in the same plane as the triangle defines, it's a planar quad. If not, it's a non-planar one. You just need to recall those problems all of us had to solve for math tests and homework in juniour high :)
So if your 3D mesh has non-planar quads, it creates a sort of ambiguity that some algorithms do not like. This is why many cloth sims want a triangulated mesh.
I just submitted the update with fixes to DAZ.
Thank you!
Yay! Thanks.
I have been playing around with the plugin and you did a great job! Congratulations. How would Content creators go about if we want to include the thickened clothing item for resale. Apologies if this has been covered in a previous post, but the process is still unclear for me. I am talking specifically about the dynamic thickened object.
You can include the dynamic thickened object, but for it works, the final user has to own the Thickener plugin.
And for the static one, the plugin isn't required.
Whatever you create with the plugin is completely yours (well, as long as you owns the rights or permits of the original clothing or object).