blurred reflections? mithril metal? :)
Mistara
Posts: 38,675
can core CA do blurred reflections?
i have a character looking at his reflection in a dagger blade.
are there must-have plugins, or like, more brushes for displacement painting?
thanks!! :)
Post edited by Mistara on
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In the reflection channel of the shader there should be a way to turn on blurry reflections. I'm in the middle of a render right now so I can't check exactly but I'm pretty sure it's in there somewhere. Just a warning - I've heard that it really slows down render times.
Can't really answer on plug-ins. I have all of RingoMonfort's 3D paint brushes for Carrara (http://www.daz3d.com/dp-3dpaint-brushes-bundle) but I actually just started playing with them today for the first time (by a strange coincidence). They are on sale right now too. :)
yeah, just go to the shader that you want to have blurry reflections, and in the reflection channel there's a check box for Enable Blurry Reflections, and a slide to enter how much blur...and the quality.
I have used blurry reflections quite a bit on skin, one suggestion is to drag the 'depth' slider down to 1. Blurry reflections will slow your render time, but if you drag the depth down to 1 it won't be nearly as much of a slowdown and still gives nice blurry reflections if needed.
Good point...I had forgotten about that setting in reflections. I tend to use the overall "Ray Depth" in the rendering settings, which I believe does the same thing. Not sure if the rendering setting overrides the shader setting...I assume it does. Might be an interesting test to see what happens.
If you set the ray depth in the render settings at, say, 2, and the shader depth at 5, what is the result I wonder?
Also, keep in mind that when you crank down the depth, you might miss some reflections that you WANT to appear. Just something to keep in mind.
i amazed again at how easy ca makes the complicated things .
thanks. :)
my scene needs about 200 frames. would expect it to render a couple days
also needs rain particles and not so easy wet hair. :lol:
my favorite prop wet hair is the one Adamthwaites (spelling could be way off there) sells at Rendo.
I know how to make dynamic hair react as if underwater (really strong air dampening setting) and with a low collision distance, no volume in the shader, the right highlight/shininess, and a high friction setting on both the hair and the scalp/neck of the model (I recommend a low proxy) I think you could get an even better strand based wet hair from carrara dynamic hair, but I haven't zeroed in on the settings for that yet to be honest, though it's on my to-do list for hopefully the near future. Carrara hair would be the better solution long term if we can find the right settings, because you could have some of the hair plastered to the scalp and neck, and other strands hanging free but clumped wetly together, and also if you need it animated Carrara hair will react to scene forces.
Joe is absolutely right that setting the depth of the blurred reflections super low at 1 might mean you'll miss some things you actually want reflected. Since I was using it for skin and for other surfaces in the scene solely for the purpose of giving a natural and realistic 'highlight' or sheen, and didn't care at all about seeing anything clearly in the reflection, it never became a problem for me, but depending on your purpose you might want to have the depth higher, just be aware that higher depth can mean dramatic slowdown, especially on an object which curves in such a way that it might have a piece that reflects itself...
With a modern computer, blurry reflections are usable albeit can be slow. What you really want to avoid is having two (or more) surfaces with blurry reflections which can "see" each other. Blurry reflections work by computing multiple reflection lines, and if some of those hit another surface (or even the same surface which is concave) and it then needs to compute multiple reflections for those, etc things can get exponential really fast! (meaning really slow renders, if you see what I mean!)
A great example of one of the myriad of opportunities available to those who delve into compositing... :) :) :)
A great example of one of the myriad of opportunities available to those who delve into compositing... :) :) :)
Agree 100%, I even did a forum thread a while back outlining a method of using blurry reflections via multipass and compositing to save on render time dramatically and still get the same effect.
Agree 100%, I even did a forum thread a while back outlining a method of using blurry reflections via multipass and compositing to save on render time dramatically and still get the same effect.
I remember that thread Jon. You wouldn't have a link would you?
You did??? Wow, I'm impressed !!! :) :)
Now you are officially a Carrara ANIMAL !!! :) :)
Bordering, dare I say, on scrumtrulescence..... :) :)
I'd love to see it if you can recall it...good stuff....thanks.
Eh it was pretty amateurish, a bunch of screenshots cobbled together :) I'll see if I can dig it up, or if it's lost in the ever shifting sands of time...
edit, found it: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/45695/
It's pretty unpolished, and focuses mostly on the blurry reflections and less on the compositing, though I did a little bit on compositing (mostly because I'm pretty unversed with postwork to be honest)
liking those check boxes.
render test
That's a really nice effect. Think I'm gonna try that out.
A good demonstration of how much more real adding blurred reflections makes the image.
You could also try a low intensity noise in the bump channel instead of enabling blurry reflection, which will render faster (how it works in real life)
Well, but doesn't the "real"-ness depend on the surface you're duplicating? If it's a highly reflective surface, like a mirror or chrome or a reflective floor tile or glass or an automobile or....on and on...then "real" is reflections that are NOT blurred.
On the other hand, if the surface is slightly rough, like a reflective plastic or something like a polished aluminum then yeah, you might want either blurry reflections or some sort of highlight.
It depends upon surface characteristics. It's not a surefire, cookbook thing you always want to use. I suppose that's obvious, right?
BTW, that's why I *always* recommend that people first look around them at surfaces, or use photos from the net, before they start making surfaces on their 3D stuff. That way it's easier to decide if you really need blurry reflections, or you can just use a simple highlight, or a non-blurred reflection
FWIW, one of the areas I see that folks should often focus on more is not necessarily the blurred reflections, but rather the uneven-ness of most real life surface reflections.Too often surfaces are shown as perfectly smooth, when in fact they are slightly, but very noticeably wavy.
For example, the glazed ceramic tile on my floor is highly reflective, with fairly clear reflections. However, and you don't realize this unless you look at it, the reflections are slightly wavy due to the fact it's slightly uneven glazed ceramic. And most surfaces in real life are slightly uneven like that because, in fact, it's very difficult to make perfectly flat, even surfaces. Mirrors are specially designed to be almost perfectly flat and even, but many things aren't.
Just look around you at surfaces that are, say, chrome or porcelain or reflective plastic or metal....what often stands out is the unevenness of the reflections, not necessarily the blurriness. Of course there are cases you need the blur...no question.
It's one of those subconscious things that people see that makes things seem realistic or not. Subtle, but important. I think a focus on uneven reflections is often more critical than just blurred reflections.
IMO, that is... :) :)
Here's an example of what NOT to do with reflections... :) :)
Here I made a very reflective floor. And the reflection is fairly reasonable for the type of material that might be used...a highly reflective linoleum or plastic or some sort of tile.
The problem is that the reflections are perfect, indicating that the floor is almost mirror like. Now I've seen at auto shows where they do place vehicles on a mirrored floor so you can see the cool chrome underside of the car. But in this case that's not the intent. The surface is intended to be a highly reflective plastic or linoleum, which is, by definition, slightly wavy and uneven with corresponding wavy reflections.
Notice how the reflections on the auto are closer to what you'd expect...uneven, and following the curves of the car body.
So the next step, IMO, is to modify the floor shader to resemble a non-perfect, slightly wavy floor material.
Oh, and fix the horrendous, out-of-the-box shaders on the camera equipment... :) :)
(never mind, nothing happening here...) :) :)
Well, but doesn't the "real"-ness depend on the surface you're duplicating? If it's a highly reflective surface, like a mirror or chrome or a reflective floor tile or glass or an automobile or....on and on...then "real" is reflections that are NOT blurred.
On the other hand, if the surface is slightly rough, like a reflective plastic or something like a polished aluminum then yeah, you might want either blurry reflections or some sort of highlight.
It depends upon surface characteristics. It's not a surefire, cookbook thing you always want to use. I suppose that's obvious, right?
BTW, that's why I *always* recommend that people first look around them at surfaces, or use photos from the net, before they start making surfaces on their 3D stuff. That way it's easier to decide if you really need blurry reflections, or you can just use a simple highlight, or a non-blurred reflection
You are quite right - if obvious as you say. It is just that pin-sharp reflections where they should really be blurry is a bit of a give-away of 3d rendering.
P.S. Just saw your later comment - good point about the uneven reflections too.
Just a very quick example but you get the idea (highlight and shininess set to none)
blurry reflections rendered in 20 minutes 21 seconds
noise bump - blurry relfections disabled rendered in 2 minutes 22 seconds
I agree that mirror-perfect reflections everywhere screams "3d", but I would also caution that blurry reflections and depth-of-field are two that are also very often overused.
Frequently I really prefer the "noise in the reflection channel" style of roughness rather than "blur" which to me seems to imply either a dirty/greasy/smudgy surface, or a very fine surface roughness while still being "shiny" which really isn't all that common. There's also a matter of if you want something that looks like brushed metal, you're really best off with a very faint noisy reflection and solid anisotropic specular highlights, not blurry reflections at all.
When I look around my office right now, I see exactly one thing with a blurry-type reflection: It's a "sandblasted" finished candle holder tin with a smelly candle that I wish my wife would throw away. Everything else either has varying levels of reflectivity and surface roughness, but the reflections are "pure", or is matte enough that there is no reflection worth mentioning and simple anisotropic specular will do the trick just fine.
Rounding out a rambly post, the "Nice Dice" tutorial had a very good example (and the most complicated procedural shader I've ever seen)... but it appears to be lost. Maybe we could get mmoir to re-post it.
Absolutely !!! DOF is one of the most overused, and too often it really detracts from the image because it's used incorrectly and makes the viewer confused.
there's also to consider, the blurred reflections are pretty.
And kewl... :)