Weird bending of body parts

xstanxstan Posts: 37

I've made several models and this is the first time I'm running into this problem where the body parts aren't bending the way they should and I'm getting these really weird folds. (Picture attached -- don't mind the weird vein on his bicep. That's not the part I'm concerned about.)

I've done a lot of work on shaping this model over many different sessions in daz and so I'm really hoping I don't have to start over.  Really hoping some of you may recognize the issue and that it will be an easy fix. 

 

Thanks for looking!

Test.jpg
800 x 800 - 376K
Post edited by xstan on

Comments

  • felisfelis Posts: 3,576

    Are the bones in the character properly aligned?

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    I don't know a lot about bones and how they work. Can you tell me how to check that?

  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • xstanxstan Posts: 37
    edited January 2022

    This happens in any way I try and bend his shoulders. I first noticed it with a preset pose and thought it was the pose that was the problem. Then tonight I went to manually pose him using the parameters settings (bend, twist, front-back) and it is clearly doing the same thing, which makes me pretty sure it's something wrong with the model.

    Edit: I tried several different poses, zeroing the pose in between, so it doesn't seem to be dependent on the order in which I do the movement.

    Post edited by xstan on
  • felisfelis Posts: 3,576

    Have you done any heigth scaling of the character?

    If you activate the joint editor tool, you can see the bones inside the character.

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    I know I did some tonight but the problem was there last week when I tried to do a quick render with him. I may have adjusted it before with a different slider than the one I used tonight though.

    How do I know if the bones are aligned correctly once I look at them? Or is it just how it sounds, where I just look to see if they seem to be connected?

  • felisfelis Posts: 3,576

    If you take the default male and put him in the same pose, then compare where the bones are in G8M with your character.

     

    My knowledge of rigging in Daz Studio is limited.

    But I think, that If it is misaligned, then you can try to rightclick and select transfer rigging to shape.

  • If you are not using custom morphs, and have not undone any ERC links (e.g. by clicking the chain icon on the slider) then it shouldn't be bone placement, but Edit>Figure>Rigging>Adjust Rigging To Shape is how it would be fixed (as a first draft) if it was an issue, so try that and see if the bends improve.

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    I was hopeful, but I tried that and it didn't help. So I decided to load the default male and try the same position and now I'm thinking maybe it's the default for daz that their shoulders are messed up in this position? It just seesm exacerbated by how many muscles my custom model has. It's a shame if so.  Any ideas for how to fix that so you could do images of males with their arms up?

    Test2.jpg
    1000 x 707 - 287K
  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    You know, you could be right that it did change. Or it could be the angle. I'll pull it up again and see.

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    Okay, so I don't think it's a texture thing. Here he is with his green Orion skin texture and a random one I put on him.  The first image is before I did the 'adjust rigging to shape' setting, the second is after (so there is a change, and it definitely helps, though it still looks strange), and the third is after the rigging setting with another texture.

    (Again ignore the veins. I keep forgetting to save the model after dialing them way down)

    test1a.jpg
    1000 x 707 - 310K
    test1b.jpg
    1000 x 707 - 308K
    test1c.jpg
    1000 x 707 - 306K
  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    It's more the strange shoulder bulge going down into the weird shoulder fold (or rather, weird lack thereof) that I am concerned about. I'm not concerned with the bicep/tricep part at all.

    Am I being picky and it doesn't look weird to others?

  • felisfelis Posts: 3,576

    It does look weird too me. Humans are not supposed to have such a bulge.

    Does posing other parts of his body work as expected?

  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • Which bones are bending/twisting, using which parameters?

  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • Just bending the shoulder up like that isn't, generally, a natural move - and Daz has, historically, been conservative about the movement allowed. Personally I can raise my arm that way to about sixty degrees above the horizontal. I think most people will instead swing the arm forward and then striaghten up, so the palm faces inwards rather than outwards with the shoulder just bent.

  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    I was trying to get a pose where the model has their arm resting on a bar or something above them, based on a reference photo of a model that I was using. I tried getting it to bend that way a few different ways and it always deformed this way.

     

    Cridgit, do you know any of the bend helper tools in the store? I'd definitely look into one.

  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    lol That may be what I have to do if I can't figure out how to fix it myself. I will keep working at it and post back if I figure something out. 

    Thanks for all your help and suggestions everyone!

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    So I finally got the pretty much the result I was looking for. The best results I got where from twisting the upper arms and shoulers so the armpits were facing out front, the shoulders were not bent all the way up, the arms were bent just slightly out and I angled him a bit and used the necklace to hide the worst of the deformation. So, from what I can tell, that's the best solution I could find.  

    Overall I don't think the pose turned out too bad.

    StunningComplete.jpg
    1697 x 2400 - 1M
  • cridgitcridgit Posts: 1,757
    edited May 2022

    Redacted

    Post edited by cridgit on
  • Genesis not like extreme Bend.... xD

    Dependly of Model, some model can accept large mouvement, other make strange deformations....

    G8 and other Rigg use deformer, it is not reality at 100%... Just a simply deformer actually.

    If you want change you need to make your MORPH with Blender or other.

  • Anarkia333 said:

    Genesis not like extreme Bend.... xD

    Dependly of Model, some model can accept large mouvement, other make strange deformations....

    G8 and other Rigg use deformer, it is not reality at 100%... Just a simply deformer actually.

    What do you mean? I don't see any way of interpreting that which is in accord with reality.

    If you want change you need to make your MORPH with Blender or other.

  • jestmartjestmart Posts: 4,449

    The original Genesis had to use a general purpose, gender neutral  approach to its weightmapping.  Furthermore its joint limits where set to a lower range of movement perhaps so new users wouldn't complain about bad joint bending.

  • xstanxstan Posts: 37

    cridgit said:

    That does look much better indeed; well done. I wouldn't notice it if I hadn't been looking for it.

    Now if you'd like to spend some more time on this picture ... :-)

    I did notice how the necklace seems to morph along his right pec, which is ok for fabric but shouldn't be the case for a rigid body (it looks like metal). If you parent in place to none then un-fit it it should stop curving along the pec bulge and look more like a rigid body. You might need to reposition it slightly but worth a few minutes to see how the two images compare.

     

    HOW DARE YOU?!

    jk lol   Thanks for the feedback.  I'm still pretty new to actually rendering anything with daz and I did  fiddle with the necklace a bit, but forgot that un-fitting was an option. 

Sign In or Register to comment.