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SOLVED: Carrara Memory Leak: Myth or Fact? How to deal with it? Thanks for everyone Advice!

HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
edited August 2012 in Carrara Discussion

Greetings

I've just bought a new computer.
Carrara is on the 120 gig sd drive .
16 gig ram. Windows 64.
Carrara versuion 8.1 something


I use Carrara most days, all day.
I've noticed on the new rig that it tends to start getting laggy after a few hours (?)
Eg objects won't drag smoothly (I don't have collison detection on ;) )
On the old rig it wasn't a problem.
Closing down Carrara and restarting fixes it.


So, my questions....
Is this a memory leak?
If so, any way of fixing it without restarting?
If it is a memory leak, have the new versions fixed it.
Or perhaps I have my computer set up badly?


(And yes I have forgotten to clear out my Daz Temp Folder I just remembered oops)

thanks in advance

Post edited by Headwax on

Comments

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,615
    edited December 1969

    No idea, but if there is a memory leak it could be associated with a particular feature/function, which might not appear to others who don't use that function. Personally, I haven't seen any memory leaks, but then again I don't use it nearly as much as you do (all day, most days).

    I think a good way to see if it is a memory leak is to go into Windows Task Manager and monitor whether the memory used by Carrara is increasing over time for no apparent reason. If you have a scene that normally requires 2GB when you start it, but is sucking 15.8GB after a few hours of work, that could be a problem.....

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited August 2012

    Thanks JoeMamma, I'll keep an eye on task manager.
    One other thing I have noticed is that when Carrara is rendering it takes 99 to 100 percent cpu.
    Great for me and rendering but it hangs photoshop elements which I work with while carrarar is rendering.
    Illogically I think it haas something to do with the scractch disc .....
    gah, I'm not sure, but I've never had photoshop elements crash so much.

    Good idea on task manager so thanks for that heads up!.


    Edit: my usage is files consistently aroung 1.2 gig .... I am slack with my texture files as I use PSD files and don't collapse the layers.
    So it might be that as well.


    cheers from here :)

    Post edited by Headwax on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,289
    edited December 1969

    I had lagging, vanishing textures and all sorts of issues and not just in Carrara, mainly not being able to see what was on my computer in Windows explorer soon after getting my desktop new but found it was in fact a faulty external drive causing it!
    try unplugging all your peripherals.

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    Hey Wendy now that's a thought. I have five external drives attached (just from moving from one computer to another) - I noticed it takes a while to access my onboard drives initially.
    Thanks for that idea. That goes on the list.

    Gees its freezing here in Newie - I can hardly type

  • brian_d75022d89bbrian_d75022d89b Posts: 0
    edited August 2012

    head wax said:
    Thanks JoeMamma, I'll keep an eye on task manager.
    One other thing I have noticed is that when Carrara is rendering it takes 99 to 100 percent cpu.
    Great for me and rendering but it hangs photoshop elements which I work with while carrarar is rendering.
    Illogically I think it haas something to do with the scractch disc .....
    gah, I'm not sure, but I've never had photoshop elements crash so much.

    Good idea on task manager so thanks for that heads up!.


    Edit: my usage is files consistently aroung 1.2 gig .... I am slack with my texture files as I use PSD files and don't collapse the layers.
    So it might be that as well.


    cheers from here :)

    Hi Head Wax

    I'm using C8P 8.1 too, no memory leaks here........
    the 99-100% per core is normal. Howerver you can set priorities in windows on your I/O per proces (task mangager). Although W7 64 is pretty good in multi tasking (finaly) and should do it by default.
    The SSD doesn't make a system faster and can even slow a system down (depends completely on the kind of access ....Read/ Write Random/Sequential and so on). Seen it allot in my job as a storage architect .
    However If you render in Carrara you shiould still be able to run other programs smoothly. Just run the programs you want to multi task and start killing processen (most can be killed) until you got a few left, Maybey it helps
    Have fun and Good luck

    Post edited by brian_d75022d89b on
  • WendyLuvsCatzWendyLuvsCatz Posts: 38,289
    edited December 1969

    I have 5 external drives and 4 usb dongles plugged in to my desktop, sometimes more!
    all My Daz stuff and Carrara scenes on one inc C8.1 64bit exe if I need it instead of the beta

    just that one I no longer use, causes issues
    so it is ok but you might need to isolate if one is faulty

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    nl2012 wrote:

    Hi Head Wax

    I’m using C8P 8.1 too, no memory leaks here….....
    the 99-100% per core is normal. Howerver you can set priorities in windows on your I/O per proces (task mangager). Although W7 64 is pretty good in multi tasking (finaly) and should do it by default.
    The SSD doesn’t make a system faster and can even slow a system down (depends completely on the kind of access ....Read/ Write Random/Sequential and so on). Seen it allot in my job as a storage architect .
    However If you render in Carrara you shiould still be able to run other programs smoothly. Just run the programs you want to multi task and start killing processen (most can be killed) until you got a few left, Maybey it helps
    Have fun and Good luck

    thanks for that data nl2012. then I'm going to assume it's not a memory leak and have a look at those suggestions.
    thank you for responding :)

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    I have 5 external drives and 4 usb dongles plugged in to my desktop, sometimes more!
    all My Daz stuff and Carrara scenes on one inc C8.1 64bit exe if I need it instead of the beta

    just that one I no longer use, causes issues
    so it is ok but you might need to isolate if one is faulty

    thanks Wendy, it's a good idea.
    I noticed just then there was a lag initially on looking for a texture as it looked through all the drives
    nice pickup

    oh be careful of those dongles too

  • richard.chaos_91798ec102richard.chaos_91798ec102 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I seem to run into this on my older G4 running 10.4.11! On long renders I never set to render more than 2 seconds at a time then stick them all together later. Seems to help

  • richard.chaos_91798ec102richard.chaos_91798ec102 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    head wax said:
    Greetings

    I've just bought a new computer.
    Carrara is on the 120 gig sd drive .
    16 gig ram. Windows 64.
    Carrara versuion 8.1 something


    I use Carrara most days, all day.
    I've noticed on the new rig that it tends to start getting laggy after a few hours (?)
    Eg objects won't drag smoothly (I don't have collison detection on ;) )
    On the old rig it wasn't a problem.
    Closing down Carrara and restarting fixes it.


    So, my questions....
    Is this a memory leak?
    If so, any way of fixing it without restarting?
    If it is a memory leak, have the new versions fixed it.
    Or perhaps I have my computer set up badly?


    (And yes I have forgotten to clear out my Daz Temp Folder I just remembered oops)

    thanks in advance

    For one I would double up on that RAM!

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,615
    edited August 2012

    head wax said:
    . then I'm going to assume it's not a memory leak and have a look at those suggestions.
    thank you for responding :)

    Not sure I'd just assume it's NOT a memory leak...from what you describe it sounds like a telltale sign of a memory leak. If the system gets laggy after a few hours of using Carrara, and shutting down and restarting Carrara fixes it, then it sounds like something is probably going haywire with Carrara.

    However, unless you give us a little more info on what's happening we can't really narrow it down. But checking for a memory leak is very simple. Like I said, just monitor the Task Manager once in a while as you're working.

    There are other reasons for a system to get laggy, but if it's really as you describe and shutting down Carrara fixes it, then that seems to point to Carrara. Then the question is, what are the specifics about this situation? Is it always the same scene that causes trouble? Does it happen independent of anything else (other applications) running at the time? Does it happen consistently? Are the hard drives constantly being accessed when it gets "laggy"? And so on....

    My advice would be to 1. Check for a memory leak, 2. Simplify your system to narrow down what's happening (ie, get rid of extraneous applications), 3. Post more specifics

    Post edited by JoeMamma2000 on
  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    For one I would double up on that RAM!

    Thanks Richard. I accidently bought 16 gig, I only really wanted 12 ;)
    You know I once bout a computer with 8mb of ram. Every mb cost me one hundred dollars....

    JoeMamma wrote:

    Not sure I’d just assume it’s NOT a memory leak…from what you describe it sounds like a telltale sign of a memory leak. If the system gets laggy after a few hours of using Carrara, and shutting down and restarting Carrara fixes it, then it sounds like something is probably going haywire with Carrara.

    However, unless you give us a little more info on what’s happening we can’t really narrow it down. But checking for a memory leak is very simple. Like I said, just monitor the Task Manager once in a while as you’re working.

    There are other reasons for a system to get laggy, but if it’s really as you describe and shutting down Carrara fixes it, then that seems to point to Carrara. Then the question is, what are the specifics about this situation? Is it always the same scene that causes trouble? Does it happen independent of anything else (other applications) running at the time? Does it happen consistently? Are the hard drives constantly being accessed when it gets “laggy”? And so on….

    My advice would be to 1. Check for a memory leak, 2. Simplify your system to narrow down what’s happening (ie, get rid of extraneous applications), 3. Post more specifics

    Yes good point. I've been using Carr since 6.00 am today. It's n ow 12.30 pm. I;ve been working on two scenes, each 1.2 gig. I've only had to shut down Car once in that time. I did checl the task manager but forgot to take a snap shot :(. I have only done one big renders in that time, it weighs it at around 98 mb. I am also running Photoshop elements, windows internet explorer, avg and Chrome. And whatever other nasty's windows loads up as well.


    I'll check on those suggestions thank you.

  • JoeMamma2000JoeMamma2000 Posts: 2,615
    edited August 2012

    Okay, let's step back a bit...

    If a system is running unusually slow, it's generally caused by:

    1. The system is busy doing other stuff that takes too much time away from what you want it to do, or

    2. The system memory resources are being used to the point where the OS has to swap memory out to a slow hard disk, or

    3. An application is going wonky and takes all the processors' effort, or

    4. Other stuff I can't think of off the top.

    So to figure out what's going wrong with your system, you should try to simplify and isolate. Check to see if the system is busy doing other stuff (maybe it's downloading updates in the background, or has too many applications running that require processor time, etc.), or check to see if it's running out of memory (leak, etc.), or one of the applications is hogging the processors. And to check to see if it's solely a Carrara issue, shut down all other apps and just focus on Carrara.

    Whether you're also running Chrome and Photoshop really doesn't matter. What matters is if they are causing the problem or not. If there's a lot of disk activity when the system is "laggy", then that's good information. If the memory used by Carrara goes from 1.2GB when you load a scene, to 12.3 GB after 6 hours, there's a problem.

    Again, simplify and isolate. And again, Task Manager is your friend. It can tell you how much CPU time each app is taking, how much memory, as well as graphs of history, and whether the system is busy downloading stuff in the background. And check the disk access light(s), they'll tell you if the disk is working overtime and slowing things down.

    Post edited by JoeMamma2000 on
  • ManStanManStan Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    I must have missed out, are the DDR4 memory sticks out? Best I can do is 12 gig, that is max with 4 slots for DDR3/3gig sticks. Are there now 8 gig sticks? or 4 gig stick and 8 memory card slots? Don't even want to guess what that set up would cost.
    Right now I am running 6gig and will expand to 12 as finances allow.

    My dream is 4 more comps just like this one, for a render farm ;)

  • Kevin SandersonKevin Sanderson Posts: 1,643
    edited December 1969

    DDR3 8GB sticks are available for around $55 each from Newegg. Depends on what your motherboard bios will recognize as to whether they will work or not. See your mobo manufacturer's site.

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    JoeMamma2000 said:
    Okay, let's step back a bit...

    If a system is running unusually slow, it's generally caused by:

    1. The system is busy doing other stuff that takes too much time away from what you want it to do, or

    2. The system memory resources are being used to the point where the OS has to swap memory out to a slow hard disk, or

    3. An application is going wonky and takes all the processors' effort, or

    4. Other stuff I can't think of off the top.

    So to figure out what's going wrong with your system, you should try to simplify and isolate. Check to see if the system is busy doing other stuff (maybe it's downloading updates in the background, or has too many applications running that require processor time, etc.), or check to see if it's running out of memory (leak, etc.), or one of the applications is hogging the processors. And to check to see if it's solely a Carrara issue, shut down all other apps and just focus on Carrara.

    Whether you're also running Chrome and Photoshop really doesn't matter. What matters is if they are causing the problem or not. If there's a lot of disk activity when the system is "laggy", then that's good information. If the memory used by Carrara goes from 1.2GB when you load a scene, to 12.3 GB after 6 hours, there's a problem.

    Again, simplify and isolate. And again, Task Manager is your friend. It can tell you how much CPU time each app is taking, how much memory, as well as graphs of history, and whether the system is busy downloading stuff in the background. And check the disk access light(s), they'll tell you if the disk is working overtime and slowing things down.

    Thanks Joe , I took your advice and t ook snapshots of task manager over a few hours - that was very helpful!
    The culprit is in fact Photoshop elements. Once I close some image files the program still keeps what ever memory it was using
    engaged.
    What irony. There I was thinking Carrara was making Photoshop elements lag - when it was the other way round.

    Problem solved. Much obliged.

    Thanks to everyone who suggested things!

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited August 2012

    ManStan said:
    I must have missed out, are the DDR4 memory sticks out? Best I can do is 12 gig, that is max with 4 slots for DDR3/3gig sticks. Are there now 8 gig sticks? or 4 gig stick and 8 memory card slots? Don't even want to guess what that set up would cost.
    Right now I am running 6gig and will expand to 12 as finances allow.

    My dream is 4 more comps just like this one, for a render farm ;)

    Hi manstan :)

    This is what I have. The extra 8gig cost 59 dollars australian.
    I didn't do any research before I b ought it. Didn't have enough time...


    Intel i7 3770 CPU standard clock


    GA Z77-D3H motherboard
    16 g DDR3 Kingston 1333Mhz

    120G Corsair SSD Force 3 SATA 3 SSD + 2 times 2TB Seagate SATA 3

    2G Geforce GTX 670 PCI Express


    Lg Blu-ray Burner SATA
    Windows 7 HP 64 bit
    Built in Gigabit lan USB 3.0 SATA 3.0 SATA Raid.....


    seems to go okay except for the lag mentioned in this thread

    Post edited by Headwax on
  • GarstorGarstor Posts: 1,411
    edited December 1969

    head wax said:
    Thanks Richard. I accidently bought 16 gig, I only really wanted 12 ;)
    You know I once bout a computer with 8mb of ram. Every mb cost me one hundred dollars....

    You can never have too much RAM! ;-)

    To monitor system resources over time, I would strongly recommend using Performance Monitor. It can be a bit tricky if you aren't a systems guru. However; it will allow you to collect very detailed information about your performance over time.

    I tried doing a series in the old forums on performance troubleshooting. I may re-do that if there is a demand.

  • GarstorGarstor Posts: 1,411
    edited December 1969

    head wax said:
    This is what I have. The extra 8gig cost 59 dollars australian.

    Aussie prices for stuff like this are insane! I've often wondered about moving back Down Under -- but I'm not sure that I could afford my 3D hobby anymore!

    My new beast has 64 GB RAM. I can't imagine what the cost of building it in Australia would be.

  • HeadwaxHeadwax Posts: 9,996
    edited December 1969

    Garstor said:
    head wax said:
    Thanks Richard. I accidently bought 16 gig, I only really wanted 12 ;)
    You know I once bout a computer with 8mb of ram. Every mb cost me one hundred dollars....

    You can never have too much RAM! ;-)

    To monitor system resources over time, I would strongly recommend using Performance Monitor. It can be a bit tricky if you aren't a systems guru. However; it will allow you to collect very detailed information about your performance over time.

    I tried doing a series in the old forums on performance troubleshooting. I may re-do that if there is a demand.

    thanks Garstor.
    I will keep an eye on that.
    I r emember that series - it was very good - thankyou.
    Out of interest that computer I bought coast 1862 Aus $

  • richard.chaos_91798ec102richard.chaos_91798ec102 Posts: 0
    edited December 1969

    wendy♥catz said:
    I have 5 external drives and 4 usb dongles plugged in to my desktop, sometimes more!
    all My Daz stuff and Carrara scenes on one inc C8.1 64bit exe if I need it instead of the beta

    just that one I no longer use, causes issues
    so it is ok but you might need to isolate if one is faulty

    Sounds like you got a DONGLE fetish! LOL!

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