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Ok, what I didn't know I could do was install Wine versions with PlayOnLinux, I'm now installing 1.8 RC2 Staging and will see how I go with it. Doing it via ppa's and Terminal did some odd things. This is why we need some crystal clear instructions that you don't need to have already used Wine and Linux to understand.
CHEERS!
Ok, here's where I am,
I managed via Play On Linux to install Wine 1.7.55 staging and DS 4.8, but, it still won't recognise my NVidia card when it comes to Iray and it still crashes when I try to switch the viewport to Iray. Wine Tricks is installed, but, I can't seem to access it. HELLLLLP!!!!
CHEERS!
Did you install the Nvidia linux drivers (as someone suggested above)? I think that would be necessary. I'm afraid I can't help guide you through that installation process though as I haven't done it on Mint. Hopefully someone else here can point you in the right direction.
For now here's a guide that seems to be useful:
https://mintguide.org/system/479-install-the-nvidia-driver-352-30-on-linux-mint.html
That's the guide I was going to link to...it's what I used when I was trying out Mint this past Spring.
That's the thing, I had the 352 driver installed as I did it via Driver Manager, but, DS didn't utilise it. I reverted to an older one and am now going back to 352.
I'll see how we go
CHEERS!
Just tried installing the driver according to the terminal commands in the link and still no joy, the GPU still will not show up in the Advanced portion of the render settings. Any ideas?
CHEERS!
LOL, me again, but, you might want to see this:
http://blog.linuxmint.com/?p=2947
Yeah, a new version of Mint is fully live! They say to wait a bit before a new version of Update Manager goes live before 17.2 users can upgrade, but, I think I'll go for it when it does roll out. From what I've read it sounds better. Whether or not it'll solve anything remains to be seen...
CHEERS!
Ok, I went back and looked at what Mork did and was able to install the components he listed via Play On Linux, but, still no joy. For those of you that can get Iray fully working, which Nvidia driver are you using? Is there something in the configuration I'm missing!?
CHEERS!
I don't think anyone has gotten it fully functional yet.
I'm still having trouble with the buggy sliders, long load times, and spotty CMS functionality.
I don't have an nvidia card so I can't test the hardware acceleration part in iray.It doe work in CPU mode, that's how I'm using it.
I've got mine back in and at least functioning, but, I want full Iray with the GPU otherwise this whole thing will have been pointless. I'll hang in there in the hope that someone can come up with a workaround to actually get that functionality back. I'm not doing anything more with DS till that happens.
I like Linux FAR too much to ditch it and go back to Windows now!
CHEERS!
Please understand WINE... in order for a WINE process to access the hardware, there must be support in the WINE support stubs to allow it. WINE works by lifting the windows application and reroutes the routines' calls to rewritten code or native support libraries if they exist. There is nothing magical that allows direct hardware access. You are most likely to only get CPU rendering from WINE and Iray unless someone has written code to reroute CUDA calls.
Kendall
See! I'm not the only one with the buggy sliders!
Actually I remember something when I was debugging my DAZ installation, when it kept telling me that it didn't find some nvidia libraries and therefore Iray wouldn't start or something. If I'm correct, it happened before I tried wine-staging (so with the most up to date standard wine.)
Rogerbee, care to run DAZ from Terminal and check what it prints from the startup till the crash? Maybe there is some clue there.
Everyone is going to have sliders isseus. I posted this back on Page 7 in response to the sliders: "It is caused by the switching of the input queues between the Linux desktop and the Windows input chain. This is the main "wine caused" issue when running Hexagon. This is quite a complex issue, and the Wine crew is aware of it as if affects other programs. Since most things can recover, it doesn't seem to be on their main list of "needed fixes"."
To add to the sliders issue, you'll find that if you are trying to type into the numeric portion of a slider and your mouse triggers a tooltip, your entry will be accepted at that point (incomplete) and your entry area will lose focus. Again, this is a WINE issue, not a DS issue. Long ago, I submitted a fix for the numeric entry part, but it was rejected at the time.
Kendall
There has been ongoing issues with trying to get full support of graphics cards in Linux. Linus has made a few comments on it basically along this line.
I gave up on using Linux for my graphics a long time ago because of various issues including performance but will probably go back to it for much of it, saving a dual boot of windows for specific areas that just don't play nice. My dual boot systems previously would be all loaded on internal drives, but I've been considering switching to solid state drives with a removable bay. If considering a similar route, one can use much of the creation and assembly in a Linux environment and boot into a Windows environment for specific tasks like rendering with IRay.
You know what folks, as fun as it was using Linux, not being able to use other things fully is beginning to grate on me big time!
I actually want windows 7 back!
Bye Linux, it was nice knowing you!
CHEERS!
...after watching this thread, it seems my concerns over having to play "sysop" a good part of the time to maintain Linux have been founded.
Calls to the GPU are important for rendering with Iray. When one drops £550 (including VAT) which is over 740USD on a GPU like a 980-TI for the express purpose of rendering, and it is pretty much useless, that is a waste.
Also when basic functions like sliders don't work properly I can see it becoming a source of constant frustration that would get in the way of one's creative process.
Well, Win7 is good for four more years. Maybe by then, MS will finally see the error of their way regarding forced updating and user data collection and give full control over these processes back to the users (or do I need to go find my light cycle and disk?).
One of the problems with data collection with a company like MS is that with the speed of the evolution of technology right now there isn't a lot of margin for things like understanding the user, how they use the technology, etc... If a company like MS were to opt out of data collection they run the risk of falling behind in the evolution of their technology over companies which do data collection (pretty much everyone.) This is not an excuse, nor is it meant to assuage the concerns of anyone who this makes uncomfortable. It's just an unfortunate truth. Ubuntu has been doing this level of data collection for quite a while with their Unity desktop and it's the most popular Linux distribution out which still boggles my mind considering that.
...as I understand most fo the telemetry with10 is primarily to help with the "public beta" (which is what I see the "free" version basically being). Once 10 goes to a "paid for" commercial status in August of next year, I would expect this to change significantly. I would also hope to get control over choosing/rejecting updates back.
I have a two bay tray that I have two SSD's in one has Linux Mint installed on it the other one Windows I just select which one to boot by pressing F11 (on my machine could be different on others) for boot override select the drive and go works well only problem is one that I haven't bothered to fix is that after using Linux and going back into windows there's a six hour difference on the clock
In general, using Linux does not need "sysop" work. Once configured correctly even computer illiterate people can use Linux without even knowing how to use Windows in a proficient manner. I have set up Linux Desktops in multiple offices where the staff have little computer knowledge. They have gone for years without problems. And I rarely have to mess with their systems outside of installing necessary updates. I get 1/10 the support requests from the Linux users than the Windows users -- it just works and does what it is supposed to do. In the rare case where something does go wrong, 95%+ of the time I can remote into the system in question and resolve the issue without the users even knowing it happened. And guess what, those offices have *never* had malware issues, even once in over 15 years -- and they use the internet constantly. Can anyone say that about even one office using Windows?
Just for everyone's info, there is an Iray for Linux and it DOES use the CUDA cores -- actually better than windows does. I have Tesla units and they are recommended to be used under Linux (CentOS specifically) instead of Windows. The problem here is that you are trying to lift a crappy OS's application that wants access to hardware onto an OS that has *REAL* security. WINE is really a neat thing, but it is still a hack. For reference, VirtualBox also has problems with DS 4.8 and 4.9. VMWare is better, but a VMWare license costs more than most people here are willing to spend.
Options are on the way, that's all I can say for the moment.
Kendall
MS so far has said that that ain't gonna happen
Well, I'm now in the process of getting Windows 7 back. Might take a while, but I'll get there. As Kyoto said it has a good few years left in it and a lot can happen in that time. I'm sorry, but, the less jumping through hoops I have to do in order just to do simple things the better. Linux while nice and shiny couldn't take me where I wanted. I got caught up with the idea of it and I don't think I really thought it through properly.
I'm afraid, for all it's faults, Microsoft will always have the upper hand where compatibility is concerned, and we have to like it or lump it I'm afraid.
CHEERS!
.....yeah "sysop" is a bad term I'll admit. Maybe more like IT tech, as from what I have been reading, there seems to be a lot of stuff one has to do, like having multiple desktops, logins, etc. to ensure things will work properly. Not my cup of tea.
When MS decides to actually sell their "last OS you'll ever need" for hard cash money, they better listen to their customers. Not going to pay 200$ to have them tell me what they think needs to go on my system and from what I have been reading on the tech sites, a lot of other folks feel the same.
So far Linux and most 3D-CG apps (save for Maya and Blender) just are not that compatible with each other. Hacks like Wine won't solve the issue. It will take the software developers, like Daz, biting the bullet and compiling their apps to work in Linux, which as I learned, isn't going to happen either. If Autodesk and Adobe won't commit development resources to it, how is a small company like Daz supposed to?
..I'm no "fanboy" of Microsoft by any means, I just use it because it runs the apps I use with little issue and I cannot afford to become a member of "Club Mac".
I'm sorry, it's just that a couple of comments back Rogerbee said I was the only one reporting that issue:
As for the rest of discussion, I think a dual boot at the moment is a fair compromise, till something (might) get better with DS compatibility. I still hope DAZ will start to work on Linux. It did before (the 32-bit version of 4.6 worked flawlessly except for long loading times), and I hope it will again. For now the annoying "I-dont-care-how-many billions users installed windows 10" is making me want to drop windows all together out of paranoid reason it might overwrite my windows 7 over night without telling me. I'm so happy my university has a customized version of win7, at least there I don't get those annoying notifications with "install win10 now or later" without option "how about never".
One does not NEED multiple desktop environments...but it is a nice thing to have (and much, much easier than Windows in that area).
As to multiple logins...if you don't have at least 2 in ANY operating system, you are in for a major world of hurt. It's not an if, but a when...just like hard drives.
The more I think about it, the more I want to forget about Linux. Microsoft has such a dominant hold globally that Linux doesn't really stand a chance. Development for Windows will always take precedence over anything else. As much as we'd like to hope that will change, I really don't think it will.
I may have started this thread, but, it's up to the rest of you if you want to continue it, as for me, I'm unsubscribing and leaving Linux behind for good. I should have remembered what curiosity did to the cat. I certainly feel like I've lost a few lives these past few days.
Have fun folks
Adieu!
CHEERS!
That has been being said for over 20 yrs...but Linux is still around and still making progress.
You realize Android is based on Linux right? And that the Apple iOS is based on BSD which is so close that kissing cousins doesn't do it justice. Most web servers and super computers run on a variant of Linux. Most of the embedded operating systems in cars, toasters, and the rest of the IoT is based on Linux...
With all that being said, MS hardly has a hold on anything other then the current desktop market paradygm, and that paradygm is undergoing changes. With the move to cloud services and internet apps the hold Microsoft has on desktops is even more precarious. Where they hold an advantage currently is in drivers for specific hardware such as video cards used for gaming and laptop/desktop systems.
They (desktops and notebooks) are like the mini computers of this generation. They were fundamental but as their successors become more powerful they will fall into a niche market and stay there for a while before slipping out of the picture to an entirely new paradygm. Microsoft knows this and is working to make the change by going to cloud services, which by the way, they run on (drumroll please....) Linux.
I wouldn't say Windows is dominate, it's just pre-installed on consumer grade computers.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems
Emulating an OS to run non-native software is going to work out about the same way no matter what OS you are starting with.
If/When Daz makes a linux version, a lot of these problems would get fixed.Just as you saw with thunderbird and GIMP, when you have native versions, they run just fine.
DAZ will most likely build a Linux (Android) version at some point in the future if they want to stay relevant since the mobile market is just ramping up and is already rolling over the desktop market in so many areas. With increased hardware performance and overall developments that are already currently in the works in the mobile platform it's the place to be.
This isn't to say that the desktop market won't be their primary platform for a while now but I'm hoping that someone at DAZ is forward enough to realize that a mobile platform for DAZ content is going to take some development and that sooner is better then later in at least getting their feet wet, even if it (the first version or two) isn't something they end up releasing to the general public. If they do that, then developing for Linux takes on a different cost/benefit ratio. This type of realization will happen for more companies as they jar themselves loose of the traditional paradygm we've all been mired in.
Again, the desktop isn't going away soon, but there is a transition period where a new paradygm becomes dominant and we as a society have stepped into it.
Side note: mobile doesn't mean small screens as we think of it today. New mobile platforms are gearing up to be a central processing system that can attach to various hardware and displays. This is part of the 'paradygm shift' I'm referring to. And yes, desktops will continue to have a hardware advantage over mobile, but as focus switches, that advantage starts to wane (eventually... talking a while in the future,) just as it did for mini computers. While this shift might take 5+ years to be strongly evident across the board, foundations take a while to put in place.
One more relevant point on this is how I've been stressing paradygm shift rather then evolution. We often think of evolution when someone says paradygm shift, but they are very different. With a paradygm shift, there are changes that come that have no relationship to the previous paradygm. New ways of thinking and doing. The most common mistake people make is to think in terms of an evolution when a paradygm shift is going on. By definition, with a paradygm shift, we don't know all of the pieces that are going to be in the final analysis. Everyone is guessing and grabbing. We can't plan the same as with an evolution of technology. What seems to work best is to put a reasonable amount of resources into staying current without overcommiting to technology that is changing faster then quicksand, but we must put some resources into it so we don't get left behind. When the changes come, we need to be prepared to take advantage of them rather the scrambling to come up to speed. At least this is my take after watching this industry for more years then I care to admit (for what that's worth.)