What age am I? (Attempting to test my "proportions".)
JD_Mortal
Posts: 758
I had a target age setup, but I would like to know what "YOU" think, the age of this looks like.
Yes, I realize models are not alive and have no age... But, in your opinion...
This is just the default Gen3Female model, modified with nothing other than the DFormer tool (using the weight-maps not the goofy ball)... Unfortunately, I have not done anything on the body yet. The morphs are all in the face. The body and pose is just altered to the target proportion and stance of the model. (I have no idea what age the Gen3Female is intended to be. She is a mixture of 9-yr-old, 12-yr old, 16-yr old, 24-yr old, and 34-ish in the chest, and proportions... Like a disney character. xD.)
For comparison, the default model, without any modification, is the other photo.
Skins will not follow until I erase all the muscle-tone and old-age specific details of the base-model. (Horrible thing to provide for a "foundation" to build off-of. All this specific detail, instead of generic minimums to expand-on. Leaving us to have to erase all the details.)
Image isn't showing for me... Not sure if it is showing for you... Linking to it directly. (I think it is bacause I "edited" the post and the "edited" thing is somehow removing the "attached image", or stopping it from showing.)
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Comments
Not one guess... opinion... or even a critique? Is it that bad? (Begging for any reply now. lol.)
I was shooting for about 4 to 5-ish... (So I can use that base to transition/morph, down to an infant, or up to 10-ish and 15-ish and 20-ish.) {Actual individual targets were 0-3-6-9-12-15-18, but that was too many morphs for me.}
The compromise was 1/5/10/15/20. This being the 5-target.
Looking at it, (Besides the neck being too long and her being too short in scale... Her face needs to go a little thinner. That was the limit of the neck-shrink in Daz. I didn't unlock it, like I should have.)
I thought 5 or 6 mostly based on height. Difficult without seeing the skin though
Thanks for the reply. I was starting to get a complex.
Blah... the skin is the default skin... it looks old... worn... and still has annoying bump-maps in it. I am almost comfortable enough to attempt to make a generic skin for it, just to stop the bumps from interfering with the shaping process. I keep trying to erase bumps that are, well, bumps in the bump-map. (Got frustrated at one point trying to smooth-out a wrinkle. xD)
I also need to find some clothes that are not, well, made for exotic dancers. This was all my sister had for "kids", that fit on gen3. All my stuff only fits on gen1 and V4. That is going to take some work to fit them.
Made a HD close-up, of just the face. (Took the liberty of adjusting the Iris, which was not done yet.)
The skin, is still the default G3F skin.
I was having issues with the hair, with the default SubD level, whole chunks were not rendering. Went too high on the model, and crashed the computer. This image survived.
I did a google search to help. I don't know what the height is of the adult, but still this chart might help
Average Height to Weight Chart - Babies to Teenagers
my first search gave me an approximate of how tall the child will be as an adult
Height Calculator
Maybe 5ish, judging from the face, but her legs (and therefore overall height) should probably be a little shorter.
I guessed 5 before I read the thread (didn't want anyone else influencing me.)
If you want to 'de-age' a skin texture, a quick way to strip a few years off of it is to take it into an image editor and apply a very slight gaussian blur to it...
That will be done soon... But I also have to adjust a few hard-lines that didn't translate into the morph. (On the nose, the bridge shadow is painted on, and it doesn't match the wide bridge of the child.)
Thanks, everyone for the input. I feel like I am on the correct track. More than when I posted the original image.
Now I just have to decide if I want to do this to the male figure, when it comes-out, or just use this as the neutral foundation. The way the models are distributed, it is better to use this one as the male and female, as the female components are still there for post-morphs. While the male, well... it only has male forms. I think I will still have to do the same things to the other model. Lucky that I saved the DFormer stuff. I hope it can be fit to the male model, when it comes.
Be careful with your proportions. She's looking a little too scrunched. Hairline should be higher/forehead longer. One mistake most make is they use adult textures with manicured brows on children, so they look like miniaturized adults. Head looks a bit on the smallish side, compared to the adult figure.
Yes, I have a slightly "non-proportional" round monitor. (I have to adjust it for that still. So a circle is actually a circle, not a circle in 3D then an oval when rendered in 2D.) In 3D, the head isn't that "scrunched" and "wide". Gotta love GL disproportions on non-square pixel monitors, which is 98% of all monitors.
I did try to "shrink the eyebrows", but it disrupted the brow morphs. Those will be fixed with the skin.
Once I pinch her cheeks-in more... that should fix the "short looking cranium". (I am still creating my proportions tool, which compensates for screen out-of-round or out-of-square.)
When it prints, it does actually "look like the GL screen", as the printing adjusts for square-proportion of the DPI and twips per pixel. (Actually something I am fighting in my program at the moment too.) I think I can somehow setup windows for those adjustments, but I may be wrong... Might have just been color-profiles, not DPI spans.
Her hands are too adult. Kids hands are pudgy and you can't see the 'inner workings' as well as you can on an adult. I'd ditch any "HD" morphs you've got on the little one has they would not be accurate at all for a child.
That is the skin still... (Playing with that now.) Need that done before I adjust the body more.
The base model has so much detail, irreversible detail, that is making this difficult. (Breast-sides built-in to the ribs-sides, doesn't "shrink" right.) Muscle-tone that shouldn't even be there, is all over the whole base-model. Hard-wrinkles and skin-blemishes that make it 100% non-generic, are also making it difficult.
The foundation G3 is junk, as a foundation. However, there is nothing-else yet, provided as an actual foundation that isn't pre-uniqueified into being a specific model.
Who uses a middle-aged person as a foundation? That is like using a formula-1 racer as a foundation of a car. It just doesn't translate into a VW-bug like a standard 4-door generic car could.
I also just realized the "teeth" didn't morph well. Somehow I have an unselected chunk inside the mouth. (Going to have to get the bones working for the morph first anyways. Which isn't working for me. They disconnect the bones in the morph, and then later expect you to translate and place and re-position them individually. Impossible, because the morphs are all done with the deformer. I have no clue where the bones "should be". That is the deformers job. When it removes them, it just breaks the model when you try to move the bones to something that actually resembles the correct location. Which is why I am focusing on the skin.)
All this, in an attempt to make it so others don't have to buy some other component, just to make mine work. I hate that.
P.S. Mods... where did my attachment go? I KNOW there was nothing wrong with it... (It shows in the "Edit" as still being there, but it doesn't show in the first post. Forum glitch?)
How, exactly, did you start this morph?
If you exported to a modeller and sculpted it there, did you zero out the base before you exported?
All the HD morphs (actually any 'detail' morphs...) need to be zeroed out, or they will be doubled on import. Things like the mouth problems are signs of that doubling.
Also, 'adjust rigging to shape' is the 'automatic' fix you are looking for, when dealing with realigning the bones after extreme morphs (by extreme...enough to move the mesh out of current alignment with the rigging).
To the best of our knowledge, no attachment was removed, but please remember to limit the width to no more than 800 when using an inline image.
Should be a programmed limit... handled by the forum, if it is some kind of "limit". But, I will try to keep that in mind. The website put the info in the box, I just clicked OK. Yell at the website creator. CSS does wonders, without having to code anything or tell anyone anything. Simple javascript checking, prior to posting, or while entering numbers, is like day-1 programming on the W3schools web-site.
width=800, scale=50%, max=800, link-icon=thumbnail... all easy one-time solutions, in code. (Not raw code, obviously. But just about.)
Telling everyone, one by one... Not a good use of time or skills. (FYI, your own banner is 887 px wide...)
Fixing the issue, inline, before they become an issue, to "desires"... Priceless. (By the way, it resizes with the page size, so "size" is irrelevant.)
The morph is all just deformer-tools, each with weight-mapping, and the "ball" removed. (Which, if done at the wrong time, in the wrong order, crashes DAZ.)
There were no prior morphs or bone-transitions. The model was fresh, and zero, and reset, just to make sure. (Can't adjust rigging to shape, because the OBJ export is not exporting the bones, only the shapes of the moved vertex locations and groups. When making the morph, it is creating the points of the "new position", on the "existing models bones". Moving the ones after, moves the morph where it shouldn't be. Moving them before, has the same results. I am still playing with the process to subtract base morphs, but, because there are none, the result is always "nothing", an empty object, or just the "morphed components", minus the unchanged components, which still places them in the same location, acting the same way, when the bones are moved to where they should be.)
The problem here is that the bones in this model don't change, when they need to. Which makes me have to move them manually, so they "function" as they should, to compensate for where the altered morph should be. (Eg, morphing the jaw to the floor but bending it at the default position would cause it to swing-up and in front of the model, not open and close, in relation to the lower morphed lip, which is still just above the ground. Okay, I didn't move it that far... But that is the same effect I am getting. This is the same issue I was having with the eye, and why I avoided the entire eyes of this model. But the mouth was unavoidable, because it doesn't belong where an adults mouth is, in relation to the eyes/face-scale.)
Still, I am focusing on the "looks" not the "model function" at the moment. So I didn't want to even bring that issue up. It was just relevant to the situation of the mouth.
No, OBJ format NEVER exports rigging...never has, in anything, ever. It was and still is, a mesh data format...geometry and some surface details, only.
After you export as an obj (base resolution) you don't IMPORT the morphed model with the import dialog, you use MorphLoader, instead. That basically creates the morph based on the changed between the base and edited obj you are 'importing'.
I do... "import as a morph"... But then the bones have to be manually moved, which causes the morph to move too, which deforms the morph, as it morphs onto the original rigs bone-positions, but the "shape", of the object of the "morphed+bones"... Doesn't matter if I move bones before loading as a morph, or after, it is always deformed. (Are you saying to do the "deform", and also the bones moves required... but before exporting as an OBJ, save the bone positions and then reset the bones to zero... so the object looks all deformed now, obviously... THEN, after morph-loading {it still looking defromed then}, move/load the bones now... {saving that corrected bones+morph as the asset?})
Arg, I wish they would use standard text-boxes here... google-spelling checker doesn't work in these custom dynamic boxes.
Are you adjusting the rigging to the shape and then linking the adjustments to the morph with ERC Freeze? You were having distortion issues before when you had baked a transform into the morph and then tried adjusting the bone afterwards, leading to a doubled-up effect.
Same issue... (Like I said, avoiding it at the moment though.)
Yea, the ERC freeze thing still does nothing but destruction for me. It still does the double-up effect, but adds the non-functional bone transition into the mix, so now the bone and the morph are both wrong, in the end. (That was where I was getting the "it erase the whole model", or "it leaves just the morphed components", or "it does nothing at all", or "it does the double-up and the bone is in the default location", or "the morph is messed-up but the bone is in the right location". Thus, just more bad results.)
Seriously, I am just waiting for that "One button", "Create morph", that just does everything that needs to be done, the way it should be done, without having to manually do all this stuff. (Like I said, I followed the tutorial to the letter, and got different results doing the same exact thing as the tutorial itself.)
Not to mention that some of these things, just doing one thing, instead of ten, does the same thing... or does exactly what the ten-step things may once have required. Yet, I still keep being instructed to do things with old ten-step procedures. But finding that the ten-step procedures don't function as expected, like in this instance. But in this instance, the one-step procedure isn't working either... So there must be something being overlooked.
I still think, though I have not tried it yet, (getting ready for work), that the method of "Move bone, Shape to desire", then "save bones as pose", then "revert bones, deforming the desired shape to a mess", then "saving that mess as an exported OBJ", then importing that mess as a morph onto a fresh model... Then loading the pose, which places the bones correctly (Now thus, being in the correct location and turning the deformed deform back into the desired deform now... Then saving as a morph asset... [That, I believe should do what I want it to do... Make a morph... What it should be doing, when I just click a button that says, "Make a morph". but without having to "save crap" all over and import and do the ten-step plan. (Using the morph loader is still importing. Same, same. It imports it, with a specific purpose, but it is still an import.)]
Don't move the bone.
Before or after? Both have undesired results... Except when I have not done the morph thing. (While still as deformers on the base model.)
After, I am not moving the bone... The bone is already moved on the "new model", (moved back to the original position), which has to be used to create the morph.
Don't move the bone with the transforms at all. If the mesh has moved you need to move the start and end points (with Adjust Rigging to Shape or with the Joint Editor tool) but there should be no posing applied.
I'm late entering this conversation; but, to your original question about age, proportionally she'd fit a five year old. But, look at the face of a toddler they're rounder, fuller, and softer. You won't find a toddler with cheekbones unless their starving. A toddler's nose is more upturned. Noses and ears grow continuously throughout a lifetime. Ears will be somewhat smaller and noses only reach "horizontal" at maturity. They eyes will be rounder (ethnicity not withstanding). Even at 5, the head will be somewhat disproportionately larger than an adult. That disproportion becomes greater the closer to infancy s/he gets. For the body, the toned shape of arms and legs only start to develop at puberty with the introduction of hormones.
My two penny's worth (and we all know the worth of a penny).
.
same problem (As I mentioned, I'm avoiding it right now.)
Yes, I still experience nothing but destruction from the ERC freeze. Even though the double-up effect is still present, the non-functional bone transition has been included, making the bone and the morph ultimately incorrect. (That's why I was receiving messages like, "It erases the entire model," "It leaves just the morphed components," "It does nothing at all," "It does the double-up and the bone is in the default location," or "The morph is messed-up but the bone is in the appropriate area. Thus, merely more negative outcomes.)
Seriously, I'm just waiting for the "Create morph" button that does everything automatically.
This is a seven year old thread, so it may be as well to make sure it really is the same problem. What excatly is happening for you?