Realistic Clothing
Cinnatwist
Posts: 91
This is a tired and beaten topic, I know, but I figured I would toss it out there again. Forgive the rantlike tone of this...
Can we or are there any plans for some *actually* realistic, detailed clothing? Specifically, pants most of all since all the current Dforce options look like shapeless silken trousers or pajama pants better suited for a Diane Keaton Rom-Com. Going through even all the new G9 options, I am still seeing this lack of options. There are tons of skin-tight options, and a few "jeans" that have absolutely no geometry beyond their textures. I keep having to revert to age-old Genesis, Gen2, and Gen3 options with a few Gen8s tossed in. Mostly, it comes down to the Tactical Pants, SW Jeans, Sdeb, and the Urban Survivor options. It takes ages of tweaking to get these to fit and look good on current gen models. We get dozens of fantasy-themed/Sci-Fi or sundresses and booty-shorts, but ... no detailed just regular clothing.
I'd vomit money to get some new stuff like this.
Am I the only one that wants some current-gen, updated content like this? Just regular style, wrinkled and detailed pants (and other clothing)?
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Comments
Preach.
Are you going to program a more realistic clothing simulation for D|S to make that even possible?
Being a paying customer of these products does not mean I am unable to make criticisms of the existing products unless I pre-qualify by doing it all myself. I wouldn't be a paying customer then, would I?
I offered evidence of this type of clothing -- Tactical pants, or really any of Sdebs offerings. There doesn't need to be any "realistic clothing simulation" besides actual geometry on the clothing itself. I don't see why you would think this.
And guess what! EACH of the examples you offered is a piece of conforming clothing, with the realism being restricted to a very limited set of poses. Meanwhile DForce clothes - which you were complaining about - are dynamic and require simulation. Completely different things.
Why are you arbitrating what is allowed on Product Suggestions? Or trying to pick it apart? I am commenting and requesting more, wait for it: products.
I have nothing against Dforce, and never said so -- what I did say is *a lot* of Dforce selections tend to be shapeless and silk-like and otherwise not very realistic beyond pajamas and airy lounge wear. This thread is just a plea, if anything, for more things styled and quality of those older gen options.
What is your problem here?
The standard of clothing put out could definitely be improved overall. Of course there are some PAs that put out really good clothing and armour. E.g., there's numerous almost photorealistic conforming and dforce-friendly clothing on daz store, it's just rare. We are limited by talent of PAs and time they are willing to spend on outfit.
Anyway, if you are disatisfied with Daz made clothes, you can expand possibilities by using other non-daz, generic marketplaces (artstation, turbosquid, cgtrader).
... or become a PA producing the quality clothing you feel is required. This is a hobby where it's still possible for users to become makers.
Regards,
Richard
I don't know wy Cinnatwist needs to be shouted down and told to make their own. If you go to a restaurant you expect to be served food that tastes good and aren't told to go to to kitchen and cook your own if it doesn't.
There are some very well done clothing pieces in the store, so it can be done. But a lot of clothing item comes out that makes me sad–I love the idea of the set but they are outright cartoonish. Pant legs that look look like plastic tubes, etc.
Not shouting, suggesting. In some ways I'm suggesting the conclusion I came to with poses. I offer one or two as freebies here & at another site because some of the ones I was getting weren't great. It wasn't quite an 'Even I could do better' moment, but I was left wondering if I could. Jury is still out, but maybe I have made one or two that someone might find useful one day.
Occasionally a suggestion has to be made to make someone realise there are other options. If the suggestion is ignored, it'll be situation normal. If the suggestion is not, that'll be both unusual and it could open up a huge range of possibilities.
Regards,
Richard.
Everyone is perfectly fine to disagree with my sentiments, but I do find the telling to me "do it yourself" comes off as rather "shut up" to my opinion or the purpose of my thread. Any person commenting or providing criticism on these forums, which literally state is also what this forum is here for, should be encouraged to do so without being told to go do it themselves.
I'm a customer and I pay for Content. I'm also a customer on plenty of other sites providing Daz options, but we can all agree the Daz Store is the main provider.
All I want it to convey that more clothing options might be made that have more geometry put to them. Wrinkles and "HD details". Dforce is honestly great when applied to some of these options, but I find myself literally reusing the same pants, the same shirts, over and over again due to lack of similarly detailed content. I just want more selection...
That is all.
Let's keep the discussion in a civil tone and discuss the topic and not go at each other which is just counterproductive. Everyone is entitled to an opinion and no one is right or wrong in their opinion, they are just opinions.
It's a legitimate point, tube like pants are not very interesting, in the same way skin tight leggings are not interesting either. And nicely sculpted and designed pants would be welcomed. Pockets with morphs, wrinkles and folds, functioning flys, all would be welcomed. Its easy to pass on the very average usually available.
Yeah, this is valid, as is the initial criticism of a lot of current Dforce options being shapeless. The previous generations weren't all perfect but the ones that nailed it are still the only options today. It's more than reasonable to want more like those, if not updated versions.
This may be slightly off topic, but the OP is one of the reasons I haven't really embraced G9. From what I have seen, the main themes seem to be sci-fi/fantasy/medieval, which is fine, but not my cuppa. Maybe it's because I have a ton of G8/G8.1 items, but I was really hoping to see more from G9, being a single base figure
Two separate points:
1. Yes, one of the downsides to dForce is the tendency with many PAs to present us with shapeless tubes, either as parts of the garment (sleeves and pant legs) or as the garment itself. The ultimate dForce garment would be either the kaftan or the muumuu. Maybe the poncho. Less labor for the PA and smaller file sizes for us to download and install but, unless I need for a skirt to drape on a seated figure or other situation where relatively loose fabric is shaped primarily by gravity, I get better results faster with well made conventionally conforming clothes. If you're not searching primarily for outfits with either geoshell snugness or that just hang freely or drape loosely, the Daz store can be frustrating sometimes.
2. Suggestions that content be altered with image editors or 3D sculpting apps, or that content be made from primitives are in no way malicious. They're well intentioned. However, as with some others here, I tend to react to variations of "you can make it yourself" with some tiny amounts of anger and/or nausea. The reasons should be obvious, but perhaps aren't to some: (1) Time is a limited commodity; (2) Good PAs should be able to achieve better results than most Daz users. It's a "Product Suggestions" subforum, for discussions about the sorts of content we'd like to see but don't seem to be currently available, or maybe suggestions to someone looking for specific content that is already available but they haven't found. Suggestions involving kitbashing or applying new shaders should also be welcome, but suggestions that involve using non-Daz apps or that imply that most users have the time, interest, or ability to make a copy of Chartres Cathedral from primitives might be more appropriately posted in another subforum.
if you want to use marvelous designer, your options for dressing daz characters will increase signifiantly as you can drape various clothing, not just Marvelous Designer made clothes, as long as the mesh is fully welded. I realise that does not address critique about daz vendors, but is a practical solution given that daz vendors will likely not change in short term future.
The thing is that dForce being shapeless tubes just means you have to run the simulation to get it to not be shapeless. It is like actually wearing a piece of clothes that was just on the hanger. I don't use a lot of dForce clothes but that seems to be the intent.
Yeah... When a dress looks like a sack of potatoes after being fitted on a figure, I'm not going to run simulations after each and every change I make to the pose... I just find something that works without the need for constant simulation.
just run it once you have final pose then?
Dforce won't miraculously make poor quality clothing into high quality. A dforceced sack of potatoes is still a sack of potatoes.
pants with real pockets
that don't explode
would be nice
I think the tube complaint is about things like unpressd trousers, where there are no pressed-in creases, rather than lack of draping folds. These are quote tricky to do, I think - there are methods, but they have limits.
The pants with real pockets comment is, well, *real*. Both for the geometry, but yeah, they tend to not work too well with Dforce, either from deforming unnaturally or just exploding. That's a limit of it, so no true complaint there.
Main reason all the Dforce and other more current clothing isn't "realistic" is that mentioned shapelessness. Even unironed or non-creased pants have don't hang like silk or convey the look of it. Again, unless you're going for that silky loungewear or Mama Cass muumuu look, then it just doesn't work. You can change some setting to get broader folds, but that's it. Looking at both gens of Urban Survivor or the Streetwear pants from G1, or even the Billy Bob pants from G8 shows that this level of detail is very possible. If updated for current gens, they may even work well with Dforce. If not? Oh well, realistic clothes all the same.
I wish Linday made normal clothes too.
nor did i imply that. that wasnt the critique i was responding to.