Keyframe Priority?

Deke

There's a quirk in setting keyframes that always confuses me: what keyframe settings take priority? If I move a characters hand, but then also set a hand-pose, it seems that conflicting keyframes area set. I think a better systems would be for keyframes to be organized based on the joint affected. That way I don't have to look for several different settings that all affect the same joint. 

Or is there a way to have a master control over a given joint?

Richard Haseltine

If you use two proeprties that affect a node (e.g. a direct bend and a pose control) then both will be keyed and applied (though limits may stop them from reaching some of their theoretical maxima and minima). I am not sure what you mean by priority in this context.

Deke

It's tough to describe, but let's say you're posing a hand. You can pose the hand by selecting that part of a figure in the scene panel and then adjust in parameters. You can also select the character and go into pose control, select the hand, and move some sliders around (like make a fist or grip). But which setting has priority?  I would think that priority would be equal, but I don't think that's the case. I can adjust a scene-picked item and the pose-selected change remains in effect. Of course, it is harder to find the keyframe of that pose selection as you need to have "values" selected.

crosswind

You're right ~ there's no priority...

Dartanbeck

The thing about using various joint rotation settings from outside sources, like pose dials, etc., is that they work in addition to individual joint rotation controls, like selecting Index 03 and bending it with its bend dial, then using a hand pose dial - the two will both be apparent on the figure.

 

So be cautious when working with animations. Please create a solid workflow and stick with it. That's not to say Not to test the waters and do something different, by all means. But keep in mind that things can get wonky pretty fast because every key that controls a joint (or joints) will have to be interpolated (with a tweener, either TCB, Linear or Constant) against its next change. If there are changes due to a lot of various things placing key frames, it can be a real bugger to figure out if something goes wrong.

 

If the animation is awesome enough, and it would be best to try and save it, look at where the problem areas are and try to nail down where the key frames are - try deleting one. See what happens. If there's no change, just undo. 

A simpler and faster way can be to select the offending joint controller, like a Pose dial, for example, and Alt+Click it to reset its default value across the entire timeline. This, too, can be undine if it turned out to be a bad move.

 

If any of this sort of stuff might be beneficial to your problem, let me know. I'd be happy to work with you on this.

Richard Haseltine

The pose cotnrol isa dded to the locally set values to get the final value, they are not set to replace each other.

Dartanbeck

Richard Haseltine said:

The pose cotnrol isa dded to the locally set values to get the final value, they are not set to replace each other.

Right. This is what I meant:

Lets say we have an animation which makes individual bends along the timeline for individual finger joints, but instead of having a key at each frame (like we'd get from a baked aniBlock, unaltered) the keys are spread out along the timeline.

Now we don't look at those, and start introducing finger bends from the Hand Pose Control dials. It can now happen that we'll get conflicting tweeners making the fingers do unexpected things, and we're wracking our brain trying to solve the issue.

 

To avoid this, I make more Hand Pose Control dials of various finger/hand poses. If I want to animate the hands, I'll first select the hand and then open it up in the Timeline, leave the "Properties" line if I want to keep the bends and side-to-sides, etc., select all of the keys below that (finger joints) and delete them.

Now I go through and animate the hands using my control dials ;)

Deke

Thanks Dartonbeck. This is very helpful and explains how some complex animations have gone off the rails.  Do you have a recommended "solid workflow"? Or is the best practice to just stick to one manipulation system or another...but never both?