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I really love that. So realistic, I would say that all of that work was worth it. and the good news is you will get faster as time goes by too lol.
So, another experiment for the laboratory (an especially tricky one for me!!) - So I went back to 3Delight to try out a traditional Toon/Comic type effect using Visual Style Shaders which at the time I was using 3Delight (many moons ago!) I had no idea how to use. Setting up the shaders was a lot easier than it used to be thanks to actually knowing how to use shaders thanks to all I've learnt with iRay so got an effect I liked quite quickly. Making 3Delight render the characters shadows though... total lost cause!! In the end I rendered the shadows in iRay and applied them with Photoshop, also used a filter I created in Filter forge to enhance the outlines a bit more - quite pleased with the results so I may continue to do some more actual toon/comic style renders as I go along and keep my hand in 3Delight as well as iRay.
KA1 I don't get why rendering shadows in 3delight was a problem, can you describe what made it difficult? Maybe I can be of help. I like waht you did with schaders and filter forge, it's an interesting style.
I remember that I used to have to check in 3Delight that shadows were enabled and that I had raytracing was selected for the lights, I played around within all of these settings but for the life of me could not get the characters casting a shadow on the floor. I could well be missing something (probably am!) but I couldn't figure it out!!
*Edit - As you can see from the attached image I did in April 2015 (a very early render of mine!) I did get shadows!!
Ok, trying to figure out what your light settings were, there is obviously one coming through the window that should cause the window pattern on the floor (if you did'nt make that effect some other way) From the angle of the light though the window a shadow of the people would come only very short and withing the "window on the floor" pattern.
From the lighter skin tones I take it that there is some light coming from the opposite direction as well? that could cause the shadows on the floor to be seen only verly slightly.
There is probably even a light coming from behind your characters? I will try to setup something and see what happens with the shadow. but now I need to go to bed...
KA1, I like the overall picture. Nice. I have to admit I haven't played with comics much although I have collected a few of the products to help make the. Linwelly will have to be the guide to 3Delight, though, as I haven't a clue how to do the shadows either. I'm still trying to work my way around 3Delight. That was actually a cool idea, though, to render the shadows in Iray and apply them later. I'll be interested to see if you can guys can pull this off completely in 3Delight.
I just got back from seeing the Jungle Book with my youngest so I'm just getting back on the computer. I've been away all day. Once I get DS booted up, I'll be working on a couple of screen shots to show my surface settings for the wolf fur. It took a bit of experimenting to get the look I wanted for my recent wolf image, but I liked the end result and, apparently, so did others. So, I'll be posting those in a little bit.
Once I get that done, maybe I'll attempt to see what kind of toon things I can do in 3Delight.
Very cool! I like the way it turned out and the idea of melding 3Delight and Iray in postwork is a very intriguing idea...
So, I got distracted by non DS related stuff and didn't get back into it until late. Finally, I pulled up my saved .duf file a few minutes ago. I've included a screen shot with the Scene Tab open and one with the Surface Tab open. Assuming you know how to export the FiberHair in LAMH for use in Iray, go ahead and export the fur. You'll end up with fur that Iray knows how to render. If you don't already know how to do this, you can follow these simple steps:
Load wolf (or any LAMH figure) into DS
Position your wolf in a final pose. Once you export the FiberHair, you can't change the pose. Every time you move your figure's pose, the FiberHair will need to be exported again.
Go to: Create> New 'look at my hair' Object from the file drop down and click on it. That should bring up the LAMH workspace.
Adjust fur how you wish.
Click on the big blue button that says 'Export FiberHair'. That should bring up a dialog box to get you started. Just follow the instructions. For the wolf, there are 3 FiberHair groups so there will be 3 dialog boxes that pop up as you need to export each FiberHair into an object.
In your Scene Tab, you should now have both the original LAMH group and a new group. You can hide the old LAMH group (the one that shows green in the viewport) as Iray doesn't know what to do with it.
My screen shot shows that I've already hidden these files, the ones that end in _Rman_body. The 3 groups that are not hidden are the ones we need to select for further steps. Added tip: For those who don't know this, if you highlight those last three fur groups that I have viewable in the screenshot and unparent them from the LAMH group, then DS will save them those fur groups and you won't have to repeat those steps the next time you open up your save file. As long as your pose is set and you don't change it, you can parent these to the wolf and move it where you want in the scene. You don't have to go back into LAMH to export the fur again. If you leave those fiberhair groups inside the LAMH group, they will disappear when you save your file and not be there when you open it again.
The new Hair group is the one you'll be working with when you change Surface settings as described below.
** I should note here that I'm using the paid version of LAMH. I'm not sure what the exact steps are for exporting the FiberHair in the Free version, however, I do know it is possible from what I've read. Alessandro does have a YouTube video detailing the steps involved and he explains how to accomplish this in both versions of LAMH which I'll post below. I've linked that video here for you. I should also state, here, that I have not been able to get the paid version of LAMH to attach as a tab inside DS. It is one of those little things I keep meaning to investigate, but just haven't had time and using the separate LAMH program works so I haven't investigated further whether this is something I can do with my version of DS and the LAMH plugin. It is on the ever growing list of things I need to figure out.
Once you have the FiberHair exported, you will need to change the surface settings so the fur will render in Iray. Select the 3 object groups of fur you exported so that they are all highlighted.
Open your Surface Tab and highlight all of the fur groups that show up there. You will then need to go under the Preset Tab inside the Surface Tab and find the Iray Uber Shader.
Double click to hit the fur group with the Iray Uber Shader.
Now you can change the surface settings by going back into Edit. We are going to use most of the defaults. The ones we will change are the following with the numbers to which you will change them. If you have all of your hair groups highlighted the changes will occur in all hair groups.
Wolf Surface Settings
Base Color - 180; 180; 180
Diffuse Roughness - 0.292308
Glossy Layered Weight - 0.132308
Glossy Roughness - 0.376540
These are the settings I came up with to get the fur to look almost wet as if the wolves had already been in a tussle. I didn't want the fur overly wet, just slightly damp looking. Most of this was achieved with the Glossy Layered Weight and the Glossy Roughness. The Base Color and the Diffuse Roughness help, but those settings are mostly to keep the fireflies that occur with the FiberHair in Iray to a minimum.
I think I've covered the basic steps. If I've missed something or anyone has questions, please ask.
one day 'll have to get myself to understand that LAHM player, then I will return to this.
For today I had a look at the shadow problem of KA1 but as I don't want to assimilate your thread Knitting I put up my thoughts on my thread.
I really like LAMH and what I can do with it in Iray. I have to admit that I haven't used them much in 3Delight so I'll have to go into 3Delight and make sure I can get everything to work the same in 3Delight while I'm working on these poses. I hope I don't run into any stumbling blocks.
I had a look at your thread and I have to admit that while I think I understand what you said, I'll probably have to follow what you did while I'm in 3Delight and see if I can figure out the shadows while actually using them in 3Delight and reading your post at the same time. While I appreciate the concern about not wanting to assimilate my thread, it is why I made the thread. While I love my experiments, I love the input and experiments of others, too. So, please post any thoughts you have about what others are doing especially if you have a solution or something you think will be helpful. I really don't want this thread to just become a thread of my WIPs and experiments. Experimenting is always more fun with other people because we don't all approach the same topics in the same way.
If you feel up to it, you could repost your comments and images here so they are all in one place, but it is totally up to you.
@KA1 I would be interested in seeing the version done just in 3Delight before you combined the two layers.
Ah, ok Knitting, I wasn't to sure about that, I will repost it here then, but that has to wait till tomorrow.
So, I was asked earlier today if I had Fit Control for Genesis 3 by @Zev0 and if I would recommend it. Well, my first thought was to immediately say, "Yes, I used it all the time and find it indispensable!" I changed my mind about doing that, though, for one simple reason. Everyone I've ever asked for advice from on a particular product usually either really likes a product or hates a product and they don't always tell you why. I'm a firm believer that if I'm going to recommend something, I should actually be able to tell you why I like it and why I would recommend it. Do I like Zev0s Fit products? Yes! Would I recommend the Fit products? Yes! Now, I'm going to show you why I have these.
Before I start I should mention that I couldn't remember how to get the nontextured figure to show up in the viewport. I decided, in the interest of sticking to TOS, to turn the figure into a statue with a stone shader. Hopefully, that was acceptable.
I took one dress that I have and loaded it up as it is a perfect example of why people need a script like Fit Control. It is the dress for G2F from the Skyler Clothing for Genesis 2 Female. It is a great dress, but it was geared for the younger 3D generation and has practically no breast adjustments. While it fits fairly well on most body types in the lower department, the breast is usually left just hanging out there. It has some nice morph adjustments for movement, but little else. I admit that I'm using the dress on a figure type that it wasn't geared to be used on, but then isn't that what a lot of us do?
So, in the first screen shot, I've loaded the dress on LY Trini by Lyoness which has one of my favorite female body shapes. The dress actually fits her fairly well in the bottom despite the fact that she is a little more well endowed than some of her G2F counterparts. It isn't perfect, but we can work with it. Her breasts are left completely exposed and there are no morphs to help us fix this. So, I selected my G2F figure, found where Fit Control is located (I tend to use the Library Content tab for everything rather than Smart Content.) I double clicked on the Fit Control Activate morphs (make sure you figure is selected in the Scene Tab and not the outfit). When it is done, you select the dress in the Scene Tab, go over to the Parameters Tab select >Actor and you should see a whole bunch of new morphs for the dress that weren't there before. Then it is a simple matter of playing with all of the morphs and getting the look you want.
With this dress on G2F, I not only fixed the breast, but also played with the underwear morphs to fix the indentation at the groin area so it wasn't quite as noticeable and lengthened the dress.
To keep this fair, I used the same dress on the G3F figure even though there is a version of the dress specifically for G3F. Realistically, not all of us are investing in G3F clothing and we have a lot of G2F clothing we would like to fit onto G3F. Surprisingly enough, the dress fits G3F better in the lower section than it does on the Trini body type. I admit I left G3F at default since she was coming in with a dress one generation behind her.
The breast still has issues, again this is mostly because the dress wasn't designed to be used on a full figured girl, but a teen. So, I did the same procedure and applied Fit Control for G3F this time and fixed the dress.
Now, I'm going to show you why I use this on all outfits even if they technically fit a figure straight out of the box. Most outfits have that shrink wrapped effect especially in the breast area. With Fit Control that is easily fixed with a few slider adjustments. The results of playing around with the sliders on G3F resulted in the following results. They are small adjustments but they can have a dramatic effect on how an outfit fits. As soon as they are finished, I'll post a rendered before and after of the last breast adjustment.
Sounds good!
No problem:
Thanks, @KA1! Now, at least, I have a reference of what you got or didn't get when I go back into 3Delight to see if I can get it to work following Linwelly's instructions!
I used to really struggle with shadows in 3Delight which is why I switched quickly to reality, a lot of my experiments now are because I like manga and comic styles and 3Delight seems to be the way to do those (although I appreciate my motion comic I am doing with iRay so has a slightly different style but hopefully it is avoiding uncanny valley!!)
I did another faux comic cover today I was a lot happier with, I used the Kimberly Lights that came with the 3DUniverse pack I bought and had no problem with shadows (although I didn't need them for this design!!)
So, here are the two renders I did with our G3F model.
This one is after the Fit Control morph to take care of covering the breast and nothing else. It is okay and some would be perfectly happy to stop there and that's fine.
Here is the one where I made a few more subtle adjustments to decrease the amount of shrink wrap effect between the breast cleavage.
I could have taken it a little further to show what it would look like as if the model were wearing a full support bra and there was no dip between the breasts at all. But, I like this effect and it looks more natural. Again, it is a subtle difference that I notice and others might not. It is, however, another reason why I think Zev0's products are so useful and why I'm glad he wrote them. They make my work look so much more realistic!
I am going to second your endorsement of the fit control products. I use it all the time even when things fit even if its just to pull the middle of the chest out so it looks like it should instead of two breasts encased in socks lol.
Forgive my jumping in here. I do see shadows on the floor. It appears you have two very strong lights that are 3/4 left and 3/4 right. It's likely they're cancelling each other out. Perhaps if you dropped the intensity (even as a test)?
@KA1 Did you use a background image or a prop?
It's a prop, The Ant Farms Office 2 movie stand (I think that's what they are called!!)
As mentioned above here is a repost of the shadow in the room problem:
I simplified the situation drastically and I stayed away from cartoony shaders which are somthing I haven't tried myself at. Setup is a backwall a floor an a ceiling plus a wall with a (physically functional) window at the left hand side plus my handsome warden as a replacement for Mr Steed and and Ms Peel.
Lights are for the first render three distant lights: 1st from upper left casting light through the window (shadows on) 120% , 2nd from front 70%(shadows off) and thid from right hand side 70%(shadows on) (plus an UE at 30% U guess I could have omitted).
Interesting point to your situation is the shadows cast by Distant light 1: the window crosses and my handsome warden but ony for the peace of light that comes through the window.
Setting 2 is the same as setting one plus a spotlight coming same angle as distant light 1 but inside the box, 100% and shadows on, the shadow of my handsome warden is more pronounced and reaches the full body lenght.
I really must find the time to go through your wolf tutorial @Knittingmommy , the results look fantastic!!
A background image would explain your lack of shadows.
Thanks, @Linwelly!
Well, if you do, let me know if I need to clarify anything or you have questions. I think I covered it mostly, but you never know until someone actually works through it.
I've afk all day, basically, and haven't gotten anything done on the computer today. Time to load up DS and work on a render!
The LAMH-Free-Player is very impressive to work with in 3Delight. All the Animals in my Gallery are rendered in 3Delight with the Free Player and I never did any adjustments in the Surface Tab.
@Linwelly: Just install the Free Player and render figures with LAMH presets. IMHO you don´t need to make further adjustments. It all comes down to your light set how good your results will be.
For LAMH Renders in 3Delight, Alessandro_AM once made his Promo Light Sets available there: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/819390/#Comment_819390
I had seen your Two Foxes, but I didn't remember seeing any of your other animals. I have to say that the saber tooth was my hands down favorite!
The one thing that I need to test in 3Delight is if I can get that nice matted appearance in the fur like I can in Iray. It was super easy to do that since I was exporting the FiberHair. I don't know how it will look since I can't use the same technique in 3Delight. We'll see. I will be going in to test out some poses in 3Delight in the next few days. I might have to go in and create another set of hair groups to get the same effect.
Just for the record here, to export as FiberHair the FULL version of LAMH is required, for the free LAMH Player you need to export as an object for iRay which @Alessandro_AM did a youtube video to explain.
Yes, this is correct. And that's how I actually started doing it until Kendall posted that you could just export the FiberHair in the paid version. I should have actually mentioned that. I know I mentioned that I use the paid version of LAMH, but I should have clarified that in my post about how to do that in the Free Version. I'll go back and make sure that is clear. It has been so long since I used the Free Player that I can't honestly give instructions for how to use it and you can't run both versions at the same time so I would have to drop my plugin to install the Player to see how it works again. Alessandro's video that I linked above does give instructions for how to use the Free Player and export the FiberHair to an object, I believe. I'll have to rewatch that part and make sure, though, before I update my post.
Thanks @KA1
At the moment I am playing a lot with GIMP and the Two Foxes are more or less somekind of postwork experiment. The Sabertooth was made some time ago and has not much postwork involved. The weekend isn´t far away, maybe I will find some time to throw a few tipps on LAMH in 3Delight together. But IMHO it all comes down to Lights and Render Settings. There is not much to tell about the LAMH Presets and the Free Player.