Carrara vs. DAZ Studio
ebergerly
Posts: 3,255
I admit to really disliking DAZ Studio for recent years, and Carrara seemed a quite a bit easier for character work. But honestly, with the lack of development of Carrara, and the cool stuff going on with DAZ Studio, I guess I'm a convert to Studio. Here's one of my first Iray renders with a stock G3 character in a room using Iray. I'm certainly not any sort of expert, but IMO it's looking pretty stunning. Not because anything I did, but I think the Iray, together with the materials, and the G3 characters, really has some impressive stuff. Yeah, the hair needs some work at the roots, and the skin needs a bit more life (SSS or something), but I'm pretty impressed. All I did was tweak some of the materials, like the glass in the sunglasses.
I'm sure the experts will say "yeah, we can do that in Carrara", but for us newbies I think it's easier to achieve good stuff.
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Comments
As long as you think it is "easier to achieve good stuff" in DS, then that is likely where you need to be.
But this is the Carrara forum. We actually prefer to use Carrara. In my view, based on your previous (negative) posts, you are starting to look like a troll.
Wow. Suggesting an additional tool is trolling?
I don't care what you use, I was just trying to be helpful.
Now you express fake outrage.
You've got it down, my friend!
Confidently declaring to the forum that "Carrara is dead" is neither helpful nor appreciated..
ebergerly, I have a thread about tips and tricks for using Studio. Please stop by and help me. Very eager to "learn additional tools" as you say.
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/146056/diomede-s-studio-sketchpad/p1
Here is the Daz description of the Carrara forum.
Official updates, news, and other announcements related to Carrara.
If you are not here in the Carrara forum to share information about using Carrara, but instead are here to market another program, then that meets the definition of trolling, sorry. If anyone does not understand how going out of the way to visit the X forum to suggest that people stop using X is trolling, I suggest they look up the definition of troll.
Aside on another topic.
So, I can use Carrara's dynamic hair in a PBR render engine (octane) and Poser's dynamic hair, but free Studio does not have it. Oh, I could pay for LAMH, but it does not play well with PBR Iray, and even then it would not be free. Where should I discuss PBR options for dynamic hair in Studio? The Carrara forum? No. Maybe the Studio forum. Sure OK. Maybe the Commons. Sure, OK. Maybe the Art Studio forum. Yup. But not the carrara forum. That is why I have a separate thread linked above. If you have suggestions along these lines, please visit me there.
I agree with you.
Daz Studio is truly amazing, and is headed to a bright future of just getting better and better and better forever. Which is very cool. I'm immensely proud of my friends at Daz3d for what they've come up with, and continue to push forward. It truly is amazing!
I guess it really depends on what you want from the software.
As much as I want to love Daz Studio, I still just haven't got to grips with it yet.
Carrara Pro seems (to me) like it was custom made for me and what I want to do - even though it does a LOT more than what I ever ask it to.
But I would never claim to be able to produce that render in Carrara. That's a beautiful render! Wow!
I really wish that we had Genesis 3 support in Carrara - mostly because I have friends here that really want it. But Misty has fixed that now... so that's cool! Kudos to Misty!!! But I've been building a library of content for years now and am aimed in a different direction than having hyper-realistic humans. Digital actors, yes. But not necessarily 'real'. So even though I dabble in Genesis 1 (which I really Love) and Genesis 2 M&F (which I also really Love), my earlier generation figure are still dear to me and very fulfilling for what I ask of them.
Since about my third year with Carrara, once I got better at working shaders on my own, I started caring less and less about how the promo pics of a product looked, knowing that I could make it better in Carrara. But that statement goes for any 3d render software. In this case, however, I find Carrara's Texture Room to be an amazing gift to the multiverse! I've just added an older creature figure to my cart - one that I had my eye on a l o n g time ago. I still love perusing the older depths of the catalog... there's a lot of really cool stuff still to be had.
I think that Daz3d is really doing it right with Daz Studio... I really do. I will still continue to slowly try and immerse myself into it when I can. But I'm really in no hurry.
I have a feeling that they have been messing around with Carrara behind the scenes when they can spare someone to toil with it. I once read that "All 3d software is good in its own way - it has to be because it takes genius to make it in the first place" or something to that effect. So with that in the back of my head, I also have my own understanding that, to try and persist development that another genius began must be a real challenge - especially if such a place is already excelling at making the software that already fits their dream.
So, to me... I understand and, in a small way, am somewhat thankful. I don't really need an update or upgrade right now. That's selfish to say, but it's true. Carrara is really quite perfect for what I want. It's that Dream Game that a gamer endeavors to find. It's the only reason why I truly need a computer... that and what I'm doing now - hanging out with my Carrara friends.
But it's also true that, if I couldn't have Carrara, I would be using Poser or Daz Studio right now. I would be in a different mindset - I know this because I came to Carrara from Poser. Carrara was something else for me to get used to. It was everything I had hoped it to be, and yet it was also so much more, that I almost had that roller coaster inertia feeling in my gut when I'd get inside to work on a scene. So vast. So limitless. But yet those wonderful, familiar controls on the left margin of the screen (yet tiny, like I like them to be!) gave me more than enough familiarity that I somehow always knew what to think about next.
The first hurdle to conquer, however, from a content-user's point of view, was that all Poser (or DS) content will require custom shader work before it will work properly. Daz3d has a fine little tutorial called something like "Victoria 4 got you feeling blue?" that gave my the initial tricks to master getting around that in its basic form. But it was after I started buying Carrara-specific content, and looking at pro-class shaders when I really started to understand a lot more about what needed to be done.
I'm in the middle of writing an article about this sort of stuff, so I should probably stop babbling now.
But I want you to know that there are many people on your side. Use what makes you feel good... what you enjoy. When we can shoot a render like this and say that it was just a simple thing, and that we liked it... I'd say we're feeling pretty good... enjoying ourselves!
Bravo and congrats on finding a comfort zone!
This had nothing to do with DS being bad or good, or the idea that it is good to use different tools, at least from my view. I have used DS for years, with a lot of success.
Rather, it had everything to do with a new member here, with 24 posts, who seems continually compelled to accompany his enthusiam for DS with a dismissal of Carrara.
Not cool.
why is the red thing coming out of the lady's chin?
I wish I could do that in Carrara.
it's an egyptian thing...
cool I was wrapping m4 in rags the other day and just then I just realised I had a few coptic jars and a mummy (no daddy) c/ mortemus venus wrapped up all ready.
pity I only had Carrara to use it in....
I use Carrara, iClone, DAZ studio and occasionally Poser, I even retried Bryce last month and Blender!
All software has its weaknesses and strengths a phillips head screwdriver is not inferior to a claw hammer, it is just a tool.
I think most people in this forum are aware other softwares exist and many use them, but thanks anyway.
yes, since my content directory went ballistic I have been using studio as a Carrara plugin, it works fine
I find it interesting because it (studio) is very powerful but (on the surface at least) dumbed down so they can sell more stuff to the punters.. err customer base
if you have used carrara/poser for any length of time you have a major advantage because you know that things can be done so you go looking for them
a good example is save out part of a rigged object only but still keep the morphs (can do in poser so that makes you go looking for a workflow in studio)
of course 3delight is painfully slow to render compared to carrara. The slower your renders the slower you learn because it takes you a lot longer to make your mistakes.
I have to agree that it is very easy to get great looking renders in Daz Studio - load a preset character, load some clothes, load a hair, load a preset pose, load some environment or props, load a preset lighting setup and press render - and with iRay particularly, you will probably get a great looking render. After all, the characters etc are all set up to render in DS, so no fiddly adjustments needed.
But if you want to go beyond that kind of preset mentality - and I know that many people are very happy with just that thank you - Carrara offers so much more and without having to buy extra plugins to do some pretty basic things that Carrara users take for granted. So horses for courses, it all depends on how deep your aspirations are.
iray for rendering powdered donuts
if could turn the powder greem, could render wasabi chickpeas
I had wasabi on my sushi the other day.....
stroooooth... it was hot
To me DAZ Studio renders are much alike no matter who does the render.. very few unique ones which give their own twists.. but that's ok.. but doesn't interest me in using that software.
too true, look at this thread, I was under the impression that they were all done by the same artist at first (except for one or two) until I realised it was a challenge
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/149886/rrrr-it-could-be-true-entries-only-thread
no offence to any of the individual artists intended - i like the work in the main
Wow. Yeah... I'm glad that I'm stuck on Carrara!
I see what you mean... DS is capable of great rendering quality, but not sure that the majority of those really show that off.
The RRRR challenge is never going to be a show case for great artworks. You have to understand the challenge. It's called Random Runtime Roulette Renders for a reason. You try adding your complete store content to a randomiser and pulling out a certain number of item (required) and then try turning the result into art. Add to that the rules which say that the more times you get a place in the prize list the more items you have to draw randomly. I love wathcing to see what they all come up with, sometimes sponsor, but have never tried it myself,
OK, I didn't understand all of that, it's not a thread that I follow, I just looked at the images due to the above link. Is the Randomizer something that runs in DS?
No those taking part have to do quite a bit of work before they even start, getting all their content listed into one of the free randomisers that are floating around on the interweb,
Another reason not to use RRRR to judge Studio is that artists don't have to explain which programs they use or how they do it I enjoy participating in RRRR from time to time and thus far have used Carrara. It is just a fun event, with some of the experienced folks like Lucy producing great stuff on the fly and people like me using it as a learning exercise. By learning exercise, I mean that if I was trying to learn a function in Carrara, and I want a practice project, RRRR is a fun and convenient way to get started.
For those interested, you can use DIM to create a numbered list of your content in a text file, then use a free online random number generator to choose your RRRR items. Then try to use them in a scene. Usually humorous, but not always.
Anyway, we shouldn't assume that RRRR images were done in Studio.
I
a w.i.p. to show off what carrara is capable to do (and it's very versatile too) with G3F skin maps (P3D Cordia)
no postwork, some adjustments to make on maps though as the maps are being prepared for DS Iray
Looking great!
thanks Phil,
here is the final result showing how can be satisfying (and funny too) working with carrara
a bit of normalization in post
Even better!
Hey Phil
I'm kind of in a strange place these days. I'm really having a hard time and things are well...
I guess, what I'm trying to say is I agree with you on one level (the artist in me).
The me that worries about paying the rent and getting things done in short fashion, timidly disagrees.
Yes, Carrara is a POWERFUL technology that many of us (me included) have not fully mastered.
Right now, I'm beginning to look for ways to get my renders FAST, without fuss because clients really don't even want to pay for THAT, much less something that takes time and care.
Don't worry - at the end of the day these programs are just tools to produce the images or animations that you want, or that you need for a client. Use whatever suits the project best and you feel most comfortable using.
I have not read all the posts here, so maybe I missed it, but ... I saw a reference to DAZ Studio as a way of exporting products to Carrara. I've mentioned (more than once, I know) that I don't care for DAZ Studio and have had trouble with DUF format products in Carrara, so I've been purchasing only Carrara and Poser format products. Not very many new items in that category here at DAZ, but there are a few DUF format products that look interesing, if only ... So, is the DAZ Studio export to Carrara a simple thing to do? What format is exported? Do I have to do much in DS, or just load and export?
A second question - I recall reading some time back that DS did not do animation very well. Is that still true? Does it support Poser figures, mocaps, etc.?
RE: Poser formats in Studio
- very similar to Carrara. The rigging of poser figures that are V4/M4, and P7 Sydney / P7 Simon, and earlier are fully supported in Studio. The Poser rigging for Poser 9+ that has the confusing label of "Poser weightmapped" have problems. In Carrara, these problems can be addressed in a limited way wih Fenric's plugin.
- shaders - often, you may prefer to tweak shaders if you are going to render in Iray.
RE: Studio products to Carrara
Can't address animation
I load duf files directly in Carrara. Just drag and drop from the content browser. As per above, shaders typically need to be tweaked. In general, limited to Genesis 2 and earlier, but can use Genesis 3 with Misty's characters. HD morphs do not work. Geografts do not work. A few extraneus props and figures may not work if they have the same rigging approach as Genesis 3, but I personally have not had much of a problem yet.
Yes, DUF files are generally OK, there are some which need a quick UV fix and shaders will need adjusting, but you get used to that as a Carrara user!
As for animation, DS can animate as it is but it is very limited if you want to create your own animations. It only displays one item at a time (so for example you can't see where there are keys for the thigh when you have the shin selected) and you can't even drag a key to a different time. There are plugins which improve matters, such as KeyMate and GraphMate, which pull up the animation ability to closer to what you get out of the box with Carrara. There is a form of IK, but it doesn't track objects so it can be difficult to create say a walk cycle while keeping the feet fixed to a point. I still much prefer animating in Carrara where that is an option.