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Does anyone animate on a MSI laptop?

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  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    ebergerly said:

    Thanks wolf. Yeah, I think it's pretty much a myth that laptops can't be used in continuous rendering, especially considering the responses in this thread.

    Yeah, especially since noone in this thread said laptops can't do continuous rendering.

    ebergerly said:

    For some reason people seem to think that its okay to run a continuous render for, say, 2 hours, and temperatures will be reasonable, but if you run it for 10 hours then for some reason the temperatures will magically go thru the roof and shut down your computer. I really don't think that's the case unless there's something else going on (overclocking, cooling system broken or blocked, etc.). 

    There's always something else going on.  CPU's don't operate in a vacuum.  There are dozens of other processes going on that affect CPU operation.  By your faulty reasoning, a manufacturer need not test a system for more than 2 hours (or any other arbitrary number you choose) because after that, nothing else can happen.

    ebergerly said:

    I'm sure for some really low end laptops the cooling might not handle continuously doing graphics and CPU stuff all together or something like that. But generally hardware can operate continuously at its continuous ratings, and low end laptops have low end hardware so that temperature limits aren't generally an issue. Do engineers say "okay, I'll use a 3GHz CPU in this laptop, but I can't really cool it when it's operating flat out, so I'll put some low thermal limits on so nobody can use the 3GHz"? Or use a 65 watt TDP device in a laptop with a cooling system that can only handle 50 watts TDP? I kinda doubt it. And even if they did, you can still do continuous rendering, but maybe it will take longer because it throttles to a slower speed.  

    I hope the OP uses more wisdom in her decision.  As with in any high performance application, she should choose her laptop carefully, ensuring that it is built to be durable enough to handle her tasks.  Assuming any laptop with fat gpu will do, well that's just not sound advice.  If she listens to people who actually do 3D work seriously with a laptop, she'll be ok.

    ebergerly said:

    And to say that laptops are inferior to desktops is just, well, misguided. Heck, ASUS just came out with a laptop with a quad core i7 CPU (2.8 - 3.8 GHz), 16 GB of RAM, a GTX 1080, and an M.2 SSD. It even has a Thunderbolt 3 connector for connecting stuff like a separate external desktop GPU. I'd hate to hear the complaints if people bought something like that and couldn't use it at its rated numbers because it was thermally limited. 

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited November 2017
    JamesJAB said:

    With a modern (within the last 3 or so years) laptop, the CPU and GPU have built in "boost" modes.  This means that if the laptop gets too close to it's thermal limit, the clock speed will be reduced enough to hold an acceptable temperature for the entire duration of te render job.  If the machine has a completely inadequate cooling setup (like some budget bin laptops) this thermal throttling may start happening a couple of minutes into a render and a speed well bellow the rated base clock will be held for the duration.

    Yes!  I've seen this happen often in Chinese notebooks.   Even Dell and HP machines are sometimes inadequately cooled.  http://en.community.dell.com/support-forums/laptop/f/3518/t/19523265

    I have never seen a mobile workstation with this problem, though.  They cost more for a reason.  They are well engineered to handle any load.  My Z1 is technically a laptop, even though its in a desktop form.  It has been on continuously for 5 years.  I don't think I have turned it off for more than 2 hours since I bought it.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • JamesJABJamesJAB Posts: 1,760
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255
    edited November 2017
    drzap said:

     

    ebergerly said:

    For some reason people seem to think that its okay to run a continuous render for, say, 2 hours, and temperatures will be reasonable, but if you run it for 10 hours then for some reason the temperatures will magically go thru the roof and shut down your computer. I really don't think that's the case unless there's something else going on (overclocking, cooling system broken or blocked, etc.). 

    There's always something else going on.  CPU's don't operate in a vacuum.  There are dozens of other processes going on that affect CPU operation.  By your faulty reasoning, a manufacturer need not test a system for more than 2 hours (or any other arbitrary number you choose) because after that, nothing else can happen.

    It's easy to say "something else is going on" without any real information to prove your point. What else is going on? Why do you think that operating for 24 hours is different than for 2 hours? Have your read something? I'm happy to change my mind if someone who has some actual technical data presents it.

     

    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

    I'm sure for some really low end laptops the cooling might not handle continuously doing graphics and CPU stuff all together or something like that. But generally hardware can operate continuously at its continuous ratings, and low end laptops have low end hardware so that temperature limits aren't generally an issue. Do engineers say "okay, I'll use a 3GHz CPU in this laptop, but I can't really cool it when it's operating flat out, so I'll put some low thermal limits on so nobody can use the 3GHz"? Or use a 65 watt TDP device in a laptop with a cooling system that can only handle 50 watts TDP? I kinda doubt it. And even if they did, you can still do continuous rendering, but maybe it will take longer because it throttles to a slower speed.  

    I hope the OP uses more wisdom in her decision.  As with in any high performance application, she should choose her laptop carefully, ensuring that it is built to be durable enough to handle her tasks.  Assuming any laptop with fat gpu will do, well that's just not sound advice.  If she listens to people who actually do 3D work seriously with a laptop, she'll be ok.

    I've been listening to the people in this thread who have said they do serious 3D rendering with their laptops without problem. Have you done "serious" work with a laptop? Why don't you believe them? 

     

    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

    And to say that laptops are inferior to desktops is just, well, misguided. Heck, ASUS just came out with a laptop with a quad core i7 CPU (2.8 - 3.8 GHz), 16 GB of RAM, a GTX 1080, and an M.2 SSD. It even has a Thunderbolt 3 connector for connecting stuff like a separate external desktop GPU. I'd hate to hear the complaints if people bought something like that and couldn't use it at its rated numbers because it was thermally limited. 

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    Just because you say "a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way" doesn't make it true. Yes, there are obivious ways it can be considered inferior by some, depending on their needs. But for others, what you might consider weaknesses are strengths (mobiliity, lower price, space requirements, etc.). I've given examples of very high end laptops, but you just dismiss them without any reasoning. 

    You present one case of a Dell laptop with "inadequate cooling", which actually appears to be (if you look at the last post, and if you believe the manufacturer said) was a BIOS issue, not a design issue. Have you seen actual cases where DESIGNERS have intentionally built laptops with cooling that can't handle the devices it's cooling? I think making a blanket statement that all laptops are inferior is just misguided.  

    Again, I don't care about laptops. I rarely use one, I don't particularly like them, so I'm certainly not a "fan boy" or anything close. I'm just trying to get thru the baseless opinion to the facts. If you have actually used laptops in what you consider to be "serious rendering" and have seen cases of the inferior performance you're referencing, I'm sure we'd love to hear the facts. But so far what I've seen in this thread are actual users who seem to think their laptops handle serious rendering just fine, and some for many years. Which seems to support the belief that laptop designers design their cooling systems to handle continuous use of the particular components they use in the laptop. 

    Post edited by ebergerly on
  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255

    By the way, if drzap or others have laptops and would like to put some actual numbers to this, there are a number of free stress test applications for CPU's and GPU's (Furmark, AIDA64, Prime95, etc.) that can be run to make your hardware operate flat out. Someone could run these tests overnight for example and monitor temperatures to see if continuous use really means that laptop temperatures will skyrocket and throttle or even damage your computer.  

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795

    It's easy to say "something else is going on" without any real information to prove your point. What else is going on? Why do you think that operating for 24 hours is different than for 2 hours? Have your read something? I'm happy to change my mind if someone who has some actual technical data presents it.

    https://www.bestgamingpc.com/alienware-aw17r4-7352slv-pus-gaming-laptop-review/   Here is an example of a highly rated gaming laptop from a mainstream manufacturer but has insufficient cooling.  Take note of what the reviewer says, " As a result, the amount of heat produced is more than the cooling rate."   This means , sooner or later, this laptop will overheat.   Maybe not in 2 hours.  Maybe it will take 20 hours.  But it will overheat. Now, according to your wisdom, all high-end laptops are able to run continuously without cooling problems.   Is this not a laptop?  Is it not a high-end model aimed at gamers?  So something else is going on that is making this cpu fry.  What is it?  I don't know, and I don't care.  I know it's isn't sufficient for 3d rendering and that knowledge is good enough for me.  I don't need any more data.  I don't mean to pick on Dell.  There are laptops from most manufacturers that don't cut it in the cooling department, but rarely a mobile workstation model.

    Just because you say "a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way" doesn't make it true. Yes, there are obivious ways it can be considered inferior by some, depending on their needs. But for others, what you might consider weaknesses are strengths (mobiliity, lower price, space requirements, etc.). I've given examples of very high end laptops, but you just dismiss them without any reasoning. 

    "Depending on their needs?"  Are you not reading my comments and did you not read the title of the thread?  Her need is to render animation!  For rendering animation, a laptop is inferior to a desktop.  When you compare cost, performance, reliabilty and everything except portability, a desktop comes out on top.  Of course there are many who use laptops for rendering.  It's because they need mobility.  It wasn't their first choice, not when you can get a higher performing, vastly more expandable and cheaper PC in a desktop configuration.  This is a no brainer.  So I stand by my words.;  In every way except portability, a comparable desktop owns a laptop for 3d rendering.

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited November 2017
    ebergerly said:
    drzap said:

     

    Again, I don't care about laptops. I rarely use one, I don't particularly like them, so I'm certainly not a "fan boy" or anything close...

    For this reason alone, you should be listening to people who do have laptops and are doing serious work on them instead of insisting on the wrong point of view and not giving advice to people about something you know little about.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited November 2017
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

    But can you put 2 or 3 gtx1080's in that notebook?   Can you expand your memory to 128GB?   How many hard drives can fit in that small laptop case?  Would you have bought your Dell mobile workstation if you didn't need to be mobile or would you have spent your money on an even beefier desktop?  Right.   A laptop is great for moving around but it is not so great as a 3d workstation.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255
    edited November 2017

    Well, if you aren't going to believe the people in this thread who said they've used laptops for rendering for years, I don't know what to tell you. Sounds like you believe what you want to believe and facts don't really apply.

    On the other hand, I do have a complete piece of junk laptop that I rarely use. I recall it has only 2GB of RAM, and I run Linux on it solely because there's not enough RAM for Windows. So I'm thinking that since it's pretty much a throwaway computer what I'll do is run one of those stress tests for a real long time and see whether it melts into a puddle of plastic and semiconductor. 

    But it sounds like the standard stress tests I mentioned don't run on Linux. So I'll have to find one that runs the CPU flat out while monitoring temperature over a long period. Not sure if this will work, but I'll give it a shot. Heck, I don't know if the laptop even has accessible thermal sensors on the guts.  

    Post edited by ebergerly on
  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    edited November 2017

    Well, if you aren't going to believe the people in this thread who said they've used laptops for rendering for years, I don't know what to tell you. Sounds like you believe what you want to believe and facts don't really apply.   

    I don't need to believe them, I use a laptop for serious 3D work!  But I'm not foolish enough to think I can choose any high end laptop for the job.   I know the difference between a laptop that can handle 3d rendering full time and one that can't.  So I won't foolishly say that as long as it is a high-end model, it should be able to handle 3d animation rendering.

    As I have always advised,  choose your laptop carefully because they are not all built the same.   And only if you really need to be mobile. because they are not the best bang for the buck.

    Post edited by drzap on
  • JamesJABJamesJAB Posts: 1,760
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

    But can you put 2 or 3 gtx1080's in that notebook?   Can you expand your memory to 128GB?   How many hard drives can fit in that small laptop case?  Would you have bought your Dell mobile workstation if you didn't need to be mobile or would you have spent your money on an even beefier desktop?  Right.   A laptop is great for moving around but it is not so great as a 3d workstation.

    The Laptop the OP is looking at supports the following:
    64GB DDR4 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x16GB)
    2x m.2 NVMe solid state drives
    1x 2.5" Hard drive
    Alternate variants of this machine are equipped with 1 or 2 GTX 1070 cards.
    The GTX 1080 versions of this machine come with a 330W power brick.

    My Dell Precision M6700 Mobile Workstation (that enterd the market 5 years ago) supports the following:
    32GB DDR3 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x8GB)
    1x MSATA drive
    2x 2.5" Hard Drives
    Optional slim 2.5" drive bay as a replacement for the optical drive
    1x MXM GPU port up to 100W (officially supports Quadro K3000M, K4000M and K5000M cards but with modified drivers can support newer cards from Dell and Alienware)

     

    I personaly have owned various gaming laptops and mobile workstations over the years and have never had any cooling issues.  (granted at least once poer year I clean the dust bunnies out of the space between the fan and heatsinks)
    ASUS GTX 460M 
    Ibuypower GTX 560M 
    CyberpowerPC GTX 965M (wife's current laptop) 
    Dell Precision M6600 Quadro 4000M
    Dell Precision M6700 Quadro K5000M 

    One of my friends (crazy cat lady) tortured an MSI equipped with a GTX 570M and it lasted a good five years.

  • ebergerlyebergerly Posts: 3,255
    drzap said:

    I know the difference between a laptop that can handle 3d rendering full time and one that can't. 

    I'd be interested to know what exactly you think the difference is. What type of laptop "can't handle 3d rendering full time"? What specs tell you it can't do 3d rendering "full time"?

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

    But can you put 2 or 3 gtx1080's in that notebook?   Can you expand your memory to 128GB?   How many hard drives can fit in that small laptop case?  Would you have bought your Dell mobile workstation if you didn't need to be mobile or would you have spent your money on an even beefier desktop?  Right.   A laptop is great for moving around but it is not so great as a 3d workstation.

    The Laptop the OP is looking at supports the following:
    64GB DDR4 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x16GB)
    2x m.2 NVMe solid state drives
    1x 2.5" Hard drive
    Alternate variants of this machine are equipped with 1 or 2 GTX 1070 cards.
    The GTX 1080 versions of this machine come with a 330W power brick.

    My Dell Precision M6700 Mobile Workstation (that enterd the market 5 years ago) supports the following:
    32GB DDR3 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x8GB)
    1x MSATA drive
    2x 2.5" Hard Drives
    Optional slim 2.5" drive bay as a replacement for the optical drive
    1x MXM GPU port up to 100W (officially supports Quadro K3000M, K4000M and K5000M cards but with modified drivers can support newer cards from Dell and Alienware)

     

    I personaly have owned various gaming laptops and mobile workstations over the years and have never had any cooling issues.  (granted at least once poer year I clean the dust bunnies out of the space between the fan and heatsinks)
    ASUS GTX 460M 
    Ibuypower GTX 560M 
    CyberpowerPC GTX 965M (wife's current laptop) 
    Dell Precision M6600 Quadro 4000M
    Dell Precision M6700 Quadro K5000M 

    One of my friends (crazy cat lady) tortured an MSI equipped with a GTX 570M and it lasted a good five years.

    That just proves that the laptop they and you chose (you have a mobile workstation) is built to handle the job you needed it to handle.

    I bet they never used this highly rated gaming laptop -->https://www.bestgamingpc.com/alienware-aw17r4-7352slv-pus-gaming-laptop-review/  for animation rendering, did they?
    And you did you answer my question?  Would you buy a laptop for 3d animation rendering if you didn't need mobility or to conserve desk space or would you buy a desktop?

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    ebergerly said:
    drzap said:

    I know the difference between a laptop that can handle 3d rendering full time and one that can't. 

    I'd be interested to know what exactly you think the difference is. What type of laptop "can't handle 3d rendering full time"? What specs tell you it can't do 3d rendering "full time"?

    I am not your research bot, I'm just here to give advice to the OP.  I already showed you two laptops that clearly wouldn't be suitable for 3D animation rendering.  Do you think they are the only two?  A 3d workstation needs to have enough cooling so as not to overheat.  Not all laptops fit the bill.  If you buy a mobile workstation, you can be fairly sure it will be a competent machine.  If you buy a gaming machine, this is not necessarily so, no matter what the specs.

  • JamesJABJamesJAB Posts: 1,760
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

    But can you put 2 or 3 gtx1080's in that notebook?   Can you expand your memory to 128GB?   How many hard drives can fit in that small laptop case?  Would you have bought your Dell mobile workstation if you didn't need to be mobile or would you have spent your money on an even beefier desktop?  Right.   A laptop is great for moving around but it is not so great as a 3d workstation.

    The Laptop the OP is looking at supports the following:
    64GB DDR4 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x16GB)
    2x m.2 NVMe solid state drives
    1x 2.5" Hard drive
    Alternate variants of this machine are equipped with 1 or 2 GTX 1070 cards.
    The GTX 1080 versions of this machine come with a 330W power brick.

    My Dell Precision M6700 Mobile Workstation (that enterd the market 5 years ago) supports the following:
    32GB DDR3 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x8GB)
    1x MSATA drive
    2x 2.5" Hard Drives
    Optional slim 2.5" drive bay as a replacement for the optical drive
    1x MXM GPU port up to 100W (officially supports Quadro K3000M, K4000M and K5000M cards but with modified drivers can support newer cards from Dell and Alienware)

     

    I personaly have owned various gaming laptops and mobile workstations over the years and have never had any cooling issues.  (granted at least once poer year I clean the dust bunnies out of the space between the fan and heatsinks)
    ASUS GTX 460M 
    Ibuypower GTX 560M 
    CyberpowerPC GTX 965M (wife's current laptop) 
    Dell Precision M6600 Quadro 4000M
    Dell Precision M6700 Quadro K5000M 

    One of my friends (crazy cat lady) tortured an MSI equipped with a GTX 570M and it lasted a good five years.

    That just proves that the laptop they and you chose (you have a mobile workstation) is built to handle the job you needed it to handle.

    I bet they never used this highly rated gaming laptop -->https://www.bestgamingpc.com/alienware-aw17r4-7352slv-pus-gaming-laptop-review/  for animation rendering, did they?
    And you did you answer my question?  Would you buy a laptop for 3d animation rendering if you didn't need mobility or to conserve desk space or would you buy a desktop?

    As someone who is serving in the US Army, I own both a capable desktop and a capable notebook computer because there are times where I am stuck away from my desk for weeks at a time.  In my case, If I had budget issues and had to choose between a low end laptop + low end desktop , or a good laptop.  I would pick the laptop.

    On a side note... Alienware lost it's soul after being aquired by Dell years ago.  You are much better off looking at the boutique gaming laptop comapnies that use Sager/Clevo barebones laptops as their base.

  • drzapdrzap Posts: 795
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    JamesJAB said:
    drzap said:
    ebergerly said:

     

    For 3D rendering, a laptop is inferior to a desktop in every way.  People buy laptops because they need to be mobile.  You are misguided if you think anyone will buy a laptop for any other reason.  Of course, you can get 3D done on a laptop.  But they don't buy them because they are the best performance choice. You are not a 3D renderer, so you might know anything about that.

    You may be able to make this argument on older and lower end hardware.  With the current Pascal chips from Nvidia the notebook chips do not have a "M" designator on the title for a reason.
    GTX 980 Desktop = GTX 980 Notebook (Not the same as the GTX 980M)
    GTX 1050 ti Deasktop = GTX 1050 ti Notebook
    GTX 1070 Desktop = GTX 1070 Notebook
    GTX 1080 Desktop = GTX 1080 Notebook
    A well designed Laptop like the MSI that the OP is looking at will run that GTX 1080 at the same clock as it's desktop counterpart under full load.  The notebook version may actually have a long haul advantage over the desktop card.
    Nvidia Optimus.  This feature completely shuts off the Nvidia card when not needed, so all of your basic windows functions are handled by the integrated Intel GPU.

    But can you put 2 or 3 gtx1080's in that notebook?   Can you expand your memory to 128GB?   How many hard drives can fit in that small laptop case?  Would you have bought your Dell mobile workstation if you didn't need to be mobile or would you have spent your money on an even beefier desktop?  Right.   A laptop is great for moving around but it is not so great as a 3d workstation.

    The Laptop the OP is looking at supports the following:
    64GB DDR4 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x16GB)
    2x m.2 NVMe solid state drives
    1x 2.5" Hard drive
    Alternate variants of this machine are equipped with 1 or 2 GTX 1070 cards.
    The GTX 1080 versions of this machine come with a 330W power brick.

    My Dell Precision M6700 Mobile Workstation (that enterd the market 5 years ago) supports the following:
    32GB DDR3 RAM across 4 SODIM slots (up to 4x8GB)
    1x MSATA drive
    2x 2.5" Hard Drives
    Optional slim 2.5" drive bay as a replacement for the optical drive
    1x MXM GPU port up to 100W (officially supports Quadro K3000M, K4000M and K5000M cards but with modified drivers can support newer cards from Dell and Alienware)

     

    I personaly have owned various gaming laptops and mobile workstations over the years and have never had any cooling issues.  (granted at least once poer year I clean the dust bunnies out of the space between the fan and heatsinks)
    ASUS GTX 460M 
    Ibuypower GTX 560M 
    CyberpowerPC GTX 965M (wife's current laptop) 
    Dell Precision M6600 Quadro 4000M
    Dell Precision M6700 Quadro K5000M 

    One of my friends (crazy cat lady) tortured an MSI equipped with a GTX 570M and it lasted a good five years.

    That just proves that the laptop they and you chose (you have a mobile workstation) is built to handle the job you needed it to handle.

    I bet they never used this highly rated gaming laptop -->https://www.bestgamingpc.com/alienware-aw17r4-7352slv-pus-gaming-laptop-review/  for animation rendering, did they?
    And you did you answer my question?  Would you buy a laptop for 3d animation rendering if you didn't need mobility or to conserve desk space or would you buy a desktop?

    As someone who is serving in the US Army, I own both a capable desktop and a capable notebook computer because there are times where I am stuck away from my desk for weeks at a time.  In my case, If I had budget issues and had to choose between a low end laptop + low end desktop , or a good laptop.  I would pick the laptop.

    On a side note... Alienware lost it's soul after being aquired by Dell years ago.  You are much better off looking at the boutique gaming laptop comapnies that use Sager/Clevo barebones laptops as their base.

    Thank you.  You have made my case and we are in agreement.  A laptop is needed if you have mobile issues.  Noone without needing to go mobile would choose a laptop over a desktop.  Because a desktop is superior in non-mobile situations.   And as you said, some laptops are more capable than others.  Some are utterly unsuitable.  The OP should choose wisely.

  • Richard HaseltineRichard Haseltine Posts: 100,784

    This thread has more than run its course. While there are legitimate issues to be discussed around this topic, the tone of the exchanges needs to remain civil.

This discussion has been closed.