DAZ with Garibaldi to Carrara 8 Pro?
shokan
Posts: 0
Is it possible to get a figure you apply Garibaldi Hair to in DAZ Studio 4.6 to export well to a Carrara Pro scene?
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You would need to export the Garibaldi hair as .obj, as RiCurves only work in Renderman-compliant renderers.
Will the Carrara rendered result look the same as it renders in DAZ Studio?
Will the Carrara rendered result look the same as it renders in DAZ Studio?
The hair shader is 3delight specific, so you would need to tweak the materials in Carrara.
I haven't used the Garibaldi system, but I have read the documentation and seen the results. They look fine, but the biggest difference is that the hair needs to be converted to either the curves or .obj. which at the time seemed to preclude it from animation. That may have changed with updates.
You may not want to go through the hassle of trying to get it into Carrara. You can also buy Carrara hair hairstyles in the DAZ store.
Carrara has had dynamic hair for quite some time, and it remains dynamic. If you have a powerful system and the patience to set up the hair, it can be animated. It's basically a physics based animation so it can take some time to find the ideal settings for animation.
My system is older, so I don't bother animating with it, I use it for still shots. You can also use it on tons of stuff for different effects. Not just as hair. It remains editable throughout the process of setting up your scene.
Some examples of Carrara's hair (including using it to create moss and fuzz on cattails):
What would needed to be done and how difficult is it? A person above says 'tweak materials'. I don't know how involved that is and if that means the results wouldn't look too good in Carrara. I definitely want Garibaldi hair in Carrara.
Tweaking materials probably means a simple edit to the shader. Like adjusting highlight/shine. Maybe a bit of work in the alpha. Really nothing major or difficult.
Hi Shokan
Why , when Garibald is a "Plugin" developed tor use in Daz studio,. (not any other software)
plus the fact that carrara has it's own dynamic simulated hair,.
why the insistence on using Garibaldi hair in Carrara ?
Why are you wanting to use Carrara,. and Garibaldi hair together,..
If it's because you're working on a paid project for a client and need to maintain the hair and appearance ? then the answer is, do all the work in Daz Studio. don't use carrara.
The Garibaldi hair plugin was created to be used in Daz Studio, and use the hair shaders, which are designed for Daz Studio's render engine.
So,. it was never intended to be used in Carrara. ...it;'s a plugin for Daz Studio only.
Carrara has it's own dynamic hair creation system,. which can be simulated to follow the figures motion.
It's hair shaders are built to work with Carrara's render engine,. it cannot be used in other software.
You should at least look at carrara hair,. and try it as an alternative,. if you want to use Carrara
Tweaking the shaders,. means making some slight adjustments to the colours or values used on the object,, like the "surfaces" tab in DS. changing how the values for highlight or shininess or colours work with the lighting and render engine you're using.
You do that tweaking so that it looks "Better" in the application you're using,. and you would adjust the shaders until you're happy with the look.
As all 3D programs have different Render engines,. Shader engines,. and lighting types,. adjusting shaders is a normal thing to do if you're transferring scenes, or files between different applications.
Any more info about why you need this hair, in Carrara may help,.
If the hair can be exported as OBJ, then it's do-able,. although it'll be a static "prop" rather than simulated hair.
As already noted, Garibaldi hair is designed for DS - period. Unless he's changed his mind, the author has already said that he has no interest in porting the hair for other systems.
While Garibaldi can export an .obj, all you get is the geometry. That means you won't be tweaking a shader - you will be building it from scratch. The export is not even a supported feature. If you use the export, it pops up a big dialog box telling you there is no support for the feature. In other words, you're on your own trying to make it work.
If you try to create an .obj that comes anywhere close to looking like the generated hair, then the file is going to be HUGE. Upwards of 100 MB and you can expect to take 5 minutes or more for the file to generate. You can create smaller files but that means you will need to create texture and transparency maps - just like you have for standard prop hair - to try and make it look good. And it will never look as good in a close up as the original Garibadi hair.
You will get better results and far less headaches just using Carrara's dynamic hair.
I have imported LAMH generated obj mesh to Carrara but it is indeed very high poly
(you can either rig it to Genesis using the transfer utility in studio and import the saved .duf asset to C8.5 beta or use attach skeleton in Carrara but weight painting it if it conforms odd is an utter nightmare!)
I imagine Garibaldi is similar.
Based on these last 3 helpful posts, I'm going to scrap the Studio to Carrara idea. I'm steering the topic off a little here by saying: I want Garibaldi hair but I want it in an app that's for complex scene assembly and full-featured modeling/texuring and from what I know about Studio, it is not that kind of software. Unless someone can enlighten me about that, such as about Studio importing a whole Carrara scene (which I am not clear about). Even if it is possible, tweaking the scene after it's in Studio wouldn't be fun.I would imagine.
I don't use Studio, so I am curious why you need the Garabaldi Hair for your project. Sorry to say the obvious "biased" reply but why not learn Carrara's hair system and work in Carrara?
Because the Garibaldi hair looks completely awesome, basically. I need closeup photo-realism and it seems to my eye to surpass or equal solutions I've seen in other softwares. I will check out Carrara gallery examples right now though, but I've been mainly seeing 3rd party pre-made styles, which I'm not interested in probably. If Carrara built-in hair system can allow me real control of styling, length, stray hairs etc and have it render consequently photo-realistically, then that'd be great.
You should be cautious about making any decision based on "product demos". I highly doubt too many working artists waste their time trying to sell stuff at DAZ's store.... Hardly the pinnacle of what is possible. In fact DAZ's constantly changing store policies and fickle buyers is the antithisis of what is possible with this software.
Look around for gallery images by PhilW (found one for you - https://market.renderosity.com/homepage.php?page=3&userid=380840&fav_image_page=5&fav_artist_page=4)
I have a tutorial on my website that will get you started with Carrara's hair
Yes, duly noted about what I'm seeing for Carrara hair examples. However, I'm seeing an "illustrative" look and feel for all examples so far, not totally real looking for any of them. I've seen very detailed vector portrait illustrations (such as done with Xara, for example) that have that same drawn, illustrative look. While very nice, it's not the thing I'm striving for.
Hi Shokan
Different programs have different functions or features,. so for example,. Carrara has Plants, and Particle systems, Terrains, Dynamic hair, and a bunch of other Features, none of those things can be transferred to an application which doesn't have those same abilities.
Carrara can load, and work with, the same figures, clothing, and props (3D models) which can be used in Daz Studio. so you can create the same scene,. in the same way,, by loading the items from your library. ...in either program.
but, specific program features will only work in each program,.
whether that's Daz Studio, Carrara, or any other 3D program is your choice.
Transferring a scene from Daz Studio 4.5 (in DUF format) is possible when using the Carrara 8.5 beta version, but if you're using any Daz Studio specific Plugins, or features,. which carrara doesn't have,. then those will not transfer.
Transferring a scene from Carrara to Daz studio isn't possible, because Daz Studio doesn't read .Car format files.
You could export individual objects, such as a terrain, or a tree,. but that will convert that item into an OBJ (3D model) and in the example of a tree, with hundreds of leaves,. the file size would be massive,. which would slow your application down.
Carrara can create forests of thousands of tree's, on massive landscapes, with little impact on the programs usability.
Use Carrara,. and use Carrara's dynamic hair,. if you want hair on a figure in an application which is feature rich and has full modelling and texturing capabilities.
Use Daz Studio, if you need to use Garibaldi hair.
If you have an Image editor which uses "layers" like Photoshop, Paintshop Pro, or GIMP,. then you can composite a figure rendered from Daz Studio (with Garibaldi hair) into a Background image from Carrara (or any other application)
You can do the same things with a Video editor,. to composite renders from different programs into a final shot or sequence.
Daz Studio doesn't have any modelling tools built into it, but you can use Daz3D's Hexagon, as a modeller, and there is a "bridge" between Hexagon and Daz studio, which allows you to send a model to Hexagon from Studio,. adjust some parts of the model, and send it back to studio.
Daz Studio has a "Surfaces" panel,. where you can adjust or change the colours / textures / values, used in the shaders for the model.
Carrara has Full modelling capabilities, with three different modellers, (vertex, spline, and Meta-ball)
Carrara has a shader system (similar to the surfaces panel in DS) to adjust the settings,..
but it also has a 3D paint system, which allows you to paint directly onto a model in your scene, to create textures.
hope it helps
No idea what you are talking about. Good luck with whatever you are trying to do.
I get what you're going for. I've seen a handful of nice Garibaldi Hair examples, but IMHO, these products from 3D Celebrity, Naomi and PhilW rival them. You could make them even better by adding hair, tweaking shaders, etc. Both work similarly and Carrara's hair can be animated with some patience where Garibaldi can't be animated yet. Take a look at all the different promo pics in these links... some times the one main picture doesn't show you what can be done... different styles, shades, etc.
http://www.daz3d.com/dynamic-dolce-hair-for-v4
http://www.daz3d.com/dynamic-desire-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/dynamic-romance-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/dynamic-edge-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/addison-hair-for-carrara
http://www.daz3d.com/paige-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/crista-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/everyman-hair
http://www.daz3d.com/casual-chic
http://www.daz3d.com/swept-away
Carrara's built-in hair system can allow you control of styling, length, stray hairs etc. From what I've seen from James' videos, the way to create hair in Carrara is not that much different.
Thanks for collecting those and, yeah, a couple of them are very good. My interest is still piqued then. What videos by "James" were you referring to?
Carrara hair allows you to define areas on a model (by painting a selection of the mesh with a brush)
you can then create Guide hairs,. which can be manipulated, brushed, cut and shaped.
The hair shaders in carrara, also allow you to add styling functions to add to the shaping of the guide hairs. such as Clump, Frizz, Kink, Wave, as well as adding density and length variations.
That's on top of the styling you create for the guide hairs by brushing and cutting.
You can adjust the placement,. length, style, and colours of the hair to create the look you want.
The final render qualities depend on the lighting, and rendering settings you choose.
if you have carrara installed,. then I'd suggest looking at the dynamic hair,. playing with it, and experimenting with the styling tools, and shaders,. before you make any assumptions about what final look you can create, or the limitations of it.
If you conclude that Garibaldi hair is the only way to go,. then use compositing to add a carrara rendered background, and your DS rendered figure with hair.
if it's for a single image then the dynamic aspect of the hair doesn't matter.
Thanks for collecting those and, yeah, a couple of them are very good. My interest is still piqued then. What videos by "James" were you referring to?
James' Garibaldi Vids
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lSbBIDQeqs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vCsV0hmJi9I
Carrara Hair Tutes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKBl-E4tQZU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N8Mvc7wnWjM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLn1DQmsR6U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thumLc4aPU4
There were some other hair tutes but I can't seem to get them to show at the moment.
Yikes, hadn't thought of that compositing route, and it's do-able, just match the lighting. Cool. There's the matter of shadows cast by the hair though, if I'm not using the same figure as was used in Studio. There's also the issue of precise cut-out masking of the hair in Studio.I'll have to think about this. Photoshop may be the answer for the shadows (painting it in, post). It may be a problematic though.
So, there's some hope for using Carrara (with Garibaldi) yet. I used a couple Kai Krause softwares years ago and like the room concept. And, I've seen some stunning render examples done in Carrara.
Btw, just found "Learning Carrara 8" by Phil Wilkes at Toronto Public Library, of all places. Online / on-demand which uses something called "Safari Books Online - Pro Quest Tech". I can watch it any time. Very unexpected find, and I wasn't even looking for it.
Just saw more samples posted in the thread as I wrote this, so I will look at those, though I want to create from scratch for my stills.
By the way, no dynamics or animation, just static sitting poses, interiors, the figure lit by window light. Stills.
Photo-realism isn't something I strive for very often. Here's a couple examples of the hair that are more photo-real than I normally go for. They're both the same image, but one I converted to black and white as that is what I was going for in the final image. It's been awhile for this image, so I don't recall what postwork I did. I think I may have added a light bloom, but that would be about it.
The hair is a sample that came with Carrara's native content and is "grown" on a hair cap.
Yikes, hadn't thought of that compositing route, and it's do-able, just match the lighting. Cool. There's the matter of shadows cast by the hair though, if I'm not using the same figure as was used in Studio. There's also the issue of precise cut-out masking of the hair in Studio.I'll have to think about this. Photoshop may be the answer for the shadows (painting it in, post). It may be a problematic though.
So, there's some hope for using Carrara (with Garibaldi) yet. I used a couple Kai Krause softwares years ago and like the room concept. And, I've seen some stunning render examples done in Carrara.
Btw, just found "Learning Carrara 8" by Phil Wilkes at Toronto Public Library, of all places. Online / on-demand which uses something called "Safari Books Online - Pro Quest Tech". I can watch it any time. Very unexpected find, and I wasn't even looking for it.
Just saw more samples posted in the thread as I wrote this, so I will look at those, though I want to create from scratch for my stills.
By the way, no dynamics or animation, just static sitting poses, interiors, the figure lit by window light. Stills.
Some of those hair products I posted are by Phil. He has a very good tute series. Here are a couple on YouTube for his Long Drape hair.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4C90KA0_-9U
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0I8NX5Nc5k
You might consider purchasing one of the hair products just to reverse engineer to help see how it's done.
I'm going to correct myself. I didn't do any post work aside from converting to black and white. I found the original file. That and if you click for the larger images you'll notice the individual strands of the back lit hair aren't blurred, which is what would happen if a light-bloom was introduced.
Some of those hair products I posted are by Phil. He has a very good tute series.
By the tute series, you mean Infiniteskills, the one I just found, or has he done others?
Some of those hair products I posted are by Phil. He has a very good tute series.
By the tute series, you mean Infiniteskills, the one I just found, or has he done others?
He's done two series for InfiniteSkills ... and the two I linked from YouTube in the previous post while you responded. :)
Yikes, hadn't thought of that compositing route, and it's do-able, just match the lighting. Cool. There's the matter of shadows cast by the hair though, if I'm not using the same figure as was used in Studio. There's also the issue of precise cut-out masking of the hair in Studio.I'll have to think about this. Photoshop may be the answer for the shadows (painting it in, post). It may be a problematic though.
So, there's some hope for using Carrara (with Garibaldi) yet. I used a couple Kai Krause softwares years ago and like the room concept. And, I've seen some stunning render examples done in Carrara.
Btw, just found "Learning Carrara 8" by Phil Wilkes at Toronto Public Library, of all places. Online / on-demand which uses something called "Safari Books Online - Pro Quest Tech". I can watch it any time. Very unexpected find, and I wasn't even looking for it.
Just saw more samples posted in the thread as I wrote this, so I will look at those, though I want to create from scratch for my stills.
By the way, no dynamics or animation, just static sitting poses, interiors, the figure lit by window light. Stills.
I'm not sure how this is easier than using Carrara's hair system. Most people would at least look at it before deciding.
If you look at the documentation for the Garibaldi plugin, it's set-up is very similar to Carrara's, in that there are hair guides, styling tools, etc. etc. The real difference is that in D/S it has to be converted to curves, whereas in Carrara it remains editable throughout. Maybe the Garibaldi system allows you to do that as well, but the manual I read for it was a bit vague on that. Granted, that was right after it was released.
Another advantage that the Carrara system has is that not only do the guide hairs help define shape the hair, but there are shader functions that can be enabled to help define the hair shape as well, such as kink, frizz, wave, length, etc.
A side note:
Some of my problem with warming up to what I've seen so far are the figures the hair is on. I have a bias against Poser DAZ figures. They just have a certain unmistakable "look" that I can't really explain. This should not be a problem, though, if I really apply myself with what Genesis has to offer, creative skin texturing, etc..And, the hair. I'm really wondering if Carrara at the upper limits of its capabilities is sufficient to equal some works I've seen done with Mental Ray, pro painting software and the like.
I'm not sure how this is easier than using Carrara's hair system. Most people would at least look at it before deciding.
If you look at the documentation for the Garibaldi plugin, it's set-up is very similar to Carrara's, in that there are hair guides, styling tools, etc. etc. The real difference is that in D/S it has to be converted to curves, whereas in Carrara it remains editable throughout. Maybe the Garibaldi system allows you to do that as well, but the manual I read for it was a bit vague on that. Granted, that was right after it was released.
Another advantage that the Carrara system has is that not only do the guide hairs help define shape the hair, but there are shader functions that can be enabled to help define the hair shape as well, such as kink, frizz, wave, length, etc.
Yes, bottom line is that I need to learn Carrara and try it. As for the really big boy softwares (referring to my previous post), there's the little matter of $300 (Carrara)vs. $3500+. for C4D Houdini or Softimage. LOL
I'm not sure how this is easier than using Carrara's hair system. Most people would at least look at it before deciding.
If you look at the documentation for the Garibaldi plugin, it's set-up is very similar to Carrara's, in that there are hair guides, styling tools, etc. etc. The real difference is that in D/S it has to be converted to curves, whereas in Carrara it remains editable throughout. Maybe the Garibaldi system allows you to do that as well, but the manual I read for it was a bit vague on that. Granted, that was right after it was released.
Another advantage that the Carrara system has is that not only do the guide hairs help define shape the hair, but there are shader functions that can be enabled to help define the hair shape as well, such as kink, frizz, wave, length, etc.
Yes, bottom line is that I need to learn Carrara and try it. As for the really big boy softwares (referring to my previous post), there's the little matter of $300 (Carrara)vs. $3500+. for C4D Houdini or Softimage. LOL
Actually $285 right now or $171 if you're a Platinum Club member. ;)