The Official aweSurface Test Track

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Comments

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    kyoto kid said:

    ..very nice, did you use Terragen for the setting?

    Tks! No it's https://www.daz3d.com/nature-canyon. I like this set very much, and it's excellent for kitbashing;)

     

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040

    ..that's a pretty impressive environment set for Daz.

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    ...my sequential non-art continues...can already picture the next onelaugh

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    At the Town Hall Entrance awe.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    Yeah, here it iscool

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    Running for president awe.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    a little cutie

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    A Worm awe.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    another little cutie

    image

    Sidenote: Had some problems againg with black areas, there's still one in the lower left corner of the window, converted to SubD(bilinear) and tried changing the smoothing angle, enabled use face forward, but couldn't completely get rid of it:( Guess I'll have to do some postwork.

    HARPSICHORD AWEpp.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    ...jammin...

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    Amos awe.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    Re-rendered after dForcing the shirt and some minor tweaks to his shape and the lighting:

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    Amos jammin awe.png
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    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
  • ChoholeChohole Posts: 33,604

    Looks very awkward they way he is holding the bugle.

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    Chohole said:

    Looks very awkward they way he is holding the bugle.

    Tks, Chohole, for pointing that out:) Yeah I guess he would be holding it with one hand, did a quick google researchblush. I was mainly focusing on the skin and that shirt that blows up like a balloon when you pose him. M4 clothing...some stuff is great, some not so much. Will have a go at it.

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    Hmm testing another pose...don't know, maybe I'll skip M4 and try a Genesis character...still looks awkwardindecision

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    Amos bugle awe.png
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    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040

    ...actually better as that is much closer to the way a bugle is held.

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    kyoto kid said:

    ...actually better as that is much closer to the way a bugle is held.

    Tks for your comment, but his hand looks totally weird IMO:) Have made a Genesis character with the same skin, new render when ready;)

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040

    ...here are a couple photos with different stances and and arm positions.

      

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621

    Much appreciated, kk! Yeah I think I have the pose sorted out, now working on the Genesis character, and had to get rid of that painted on beard and replace it with some fiber mesh stuff, so need to rework the skin...

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    Ok so here is a WIP of a Genesis version, still need to fix a number of things, this simple scene turned out to be a tough one to get right, but learning a lot about aweSurface in the process:) The final goal is to put a band together with a harpsichord, a viola de gamba, a baroque flute, the bugle and maybe some other stuff...

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    David bugle awe.png
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    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,040
    edited April 2019

    ...the hand position is much better.

    Is there a "puffy cheeks" morph?  Also maybe use a lips pucker morph to create the "embouchure" required to make the instrument sound.

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    kyoto kid said:

    ...the hand position is much better.

    Is there a "puffy cheeks" morph?  Also maybe use a lips pucker morph to create the "embouchure" required to make the instrument sound.

     

    LOL, I struggled with the lips for several hours, yup I have the balloon pucker, pucker, hold breath, cheeks flex + a large number of other lips morphs, still no cigar, thinking I have to use dFormers or some magic to make it look good...I've been playing the trombone in younger days so I have a basic understanding of the technique, just wasn't able to nail it yet. Tks that's a good pic, very helpfulyes

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

    angry

    Suddenly having big problems with emitters. Was about to make a render of a dude playing the flute when I noticed a bright spot on his neck inside the shirt that should have been in the shadow. Stripped down the scene to one emitter plane, no other lights:

    image

    Turned off the emitter and placed a DS standard spotlight where the emitter was:

    image

    Thought maybe it's the shirt, so tried another one with the emitter:

    image

    And with the spotlight:

    image

    I set the emitter to diffuse only:

    image

    And here is with specular light only:

    image

    Don't know what to make of it or what to do, never noticed anything similar...helpcrying

    emitter.png
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    spotlight.png
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    spotlight2.png
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    emittert2 diffuse only.png
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    emittert2 specular only.png
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    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
  • GoneGone Posts: 833

    So --- it's not just me.

    About a week or so ago, I noticed fireflies showing up in my renders. Yes, it is fireflies and not render noise.

    I've tried increasing light, changing irradiance and shadow samples, changing light direction, type of light and everyting else I can think of. No joy - the fireflies just won't go away.

    If anything, they're getting worse.

  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019
    Gone said:

    So --- it's not just me.

    About a week or so ago, I noticed fireflies showing up in my renders. Yes, it is fireflies and not render noise.

    I've tried increasing light, changing irradiance and shadow samples, changing light direction, type of light and everyting else I can think of. No joy - the fireflies just won't go away.

    If anything, they're getting worse.

    Is that on skin or something else? Progressive rendering? The PT arealights? I don't recall having any issues with fireflies really, at some stage I experimented with transmission with different amounts of refraction index and the other transmission channels, and managed to get some, but that was more due to perfectly sharp edges on the models I used, I think.

    It was the shirt after all, it seems. M4 with M4 clothing. I fitted it on the bugle dude (G1) and it caused the same artefacts. Then I tried with a shirt for G1 and it worked fine. So...must be a modelling thing...it's a real pity though, would have wanted to use it, and put a lot of time dForcing it until it looked really good, went through a number of spectacular explosions too, LOL. So I have to re think the whole project. I really love aweSurface, but it's extremely sensitive to bad topology, it seems. Or maybe it's the area light shader, I don't know. Weird stuff, anyway:)

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    David bugle 2 awe.png
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019

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    David bugle 3 awe.png
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    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited April 2019

    angry

    Suddenly having big problems with emitters. Was about to make a render of a dude playing the flute when I noticed a bright spot on his neck inside the shirt that should have been in the shadow. Stripped down the scene to one emitter plane, no other lights:

    Don't know what to make of it or what to do, never noticed anything similar...helpcrying

    That looks like a raytracing bias issue. I think I've set it way too high in the release build, mostly to (wrongly) account for displacement. I've revised the code and it should be tighter now. Just to be on the safe side, I'll add a dial for raytracing bias (which is different from transmission bias).

    Gone said:

    So --- it's not just me.

    About a week or so ago, I noticed fireflies showing up in my renders. Yes, it is fireflies and not render noise.

    I've tried increasing light, changing irradiance and shadow samples, changing light direction, type of light and everyting else I can think of. No joy - the fireflies just won't go away.

    If anything, they're getting worse.

    Care to send me the scene or your settings? On my end, fireflies tend to happen with subsurface and displacement. They also crop up when used with point/spot/distant light.

    Post edited by wowie on
  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    wowie said:

    angry

    Suddenly having big problems with emitters. Was about to make a render of a dude playing the flute when I noticed a bright spot on his neck inside the shirt that should have been in the shadow. Stripped down the scene to one emitter plane, no other lights:

    Don't know what to make of it or what to do, never noticed anything similar...helpcrying

    That looks like a raytracing bias issue. I think I've set it way too high in the release build, mostly to (wrongly) account for displacement. I've revised the code and it should be tighter now. Just to be on the safe side, I'll add a dial for raytracing bias (which is different from transmission bias).

    Aah ok, I thought I was going insane, good to knowlaugh. A dial sounds like a cool idea...tks!

  • GoneGone Posts: 833

    This is an example of what is happening.

    The scene uses aweEnvironment with an aweDistant light. The figure uses aweSurface. There are tweeks to subsurface and displacement as well. In this case, the figure is using Garibaldi hair but it doesn't matter if it uses prop hair - even if the hair is converted to AWE.

    I've tried using spot and PT lights in various combos and even used IBLM and I still get fireflies to some extent or other. It doesn't matter what generation figure I use or what type of skin texture/shading setup that was converted to AWE.

    While not exclusive, the fireflies seem to congregate primarily around the shadow areas of the face and neck of the figures. There are rarely fireflies anywhere else on the figure or in the scene.

    The thing is, a couple of weeks ago similar lighting/tweeks rendered clean.

    AWEG8Fireflies.jpg
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    Gone said:

    This is an example of what is happening.

    The scene uses aweEnvironment with an aweDistant light. The figure uses aweSurface. There are tweeks to subsurface and displacement as well. In this case, the figure is using Garibaldi hair but it doesn't matter if it uses prop hair - even if the hair is converted to AWE.

    I've tried using spot and PT lights in various combos and even used IBLM and I still get fireflies to some extent or other. It doesn't matter what generation figure I use or what type of skin texture/shading setup that was converted to AWE.

    While not exclusive, the fireflies seem to congregate primarily around the shadow areas of the face and neck of the figures. There are rarely fireflies anywhere else on the figure or in the scene.

    The thing is, a couple of weeks ago similar lighting/tweeks rendered clean.

    I feel your pain, Gone, that's some serious firefliesfrown. Do they go away if you turn off displacement and/or SS? You're on Windows, right? Did something change in your setup, updates etc? Does DoF on/off make any difference? Just thinking out loud here...

    Gorgeous GB hair, by the waysmiley

     

  • GoneGone Posts: 833

    I think I'm zeroing in on the problem.

    Here is the same render with the hair turned off. No fireflies!

    I went back through the scenes with  fireflies and it looks like they are all using hair (Garibaldi as well as prop) that wasn't converted to AWE.

    I recall Wowie saying that nonAWE surfaces (like Garibaldi with the default shader) need to have a distant or spotlight in the scene so that the nonAWE surfaces would not render black.

    It seems that unconverted hair is what is causing the fireflies.

    AWEG8NoFireflies.jpg
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    Gone said:

    I think I'm zeroing in on the problem.

    Here is the same render with the hair turned off. No fireflies!

    I went back through the scenes with  fireflies and it looks like they are all using hair (Garibaldi as well as prop) that wasn't converted to AWE.

    I recall Wowie saying that nonAWE surfaces (like Garibaldi with the default shader) need to have a distant or spotlight in the scene so that the nonAWE surfaces would not render black.

    It seems that unconverted hair is what is causing the fireflies.

    Hey that's good news! So converting the GB hair to awe takes care of the problem?

  • GoneGone Posts: 833

    Apparently so.

    Here is the render with the hair converted - it took a little more than twice as long to render and - in my opinion anyway - dosen't look near as good.

    But , hey! no fireflies. laugh

    AWEG8GaribaldiConverted.jpg
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  • Sven DullahSven Dullah Posts: 7,621
    edited April 2019
    Gone said:

    Apparently so.

    Here is the render with the hair converted - it took a little more than twice as long to render and - in my opinion anyway - dosen't look near as good.

    But , hey! no fireflies. laugh

    I have very little experience with GB hair and awe, but looks like it could use a little more specular roughness and -strength, maybe. Did you use both specular lobes? You could try setting spec 1 to specular only and play with roughness and anisotropy, if you didn't try that already. Translucency to 75-100%. SS probably increases rendertimes but could be worth trying. Hmm, I should do some testing at some point;) Maybe wowie has a few tricks up his sleaves...I wonder if setting the IoR to something like 1.7 or 1.8 would help with the glossiness...

    ETA: wowie didn't recommend using any other specular BRDFs, but it could be worth trying the ashikhmin shirley classic, for more distinct highlights?

    Post edited by Sven Dullah on
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