Show Daz that Carrara users are a market worth supporting! How many Product Pages do you have?
Headwax
Posts: 10,004
Hya,
With the recent addition of Genesis 3, which by all reports, will not work in Carrara, it seems like Daz has lost even more interest in Carrara users. This is reflected in the last two polls they have sent out which I believe did not have Carrara listed as a choice in 'the 'what software do you use' question.
Could that be because they feel we don't buy enough content.?
Yet I am a Carrara user and have 56 pages in my product library!
So my questions to you:
1) How many pages do you have in your product library?
2) What is the primary software that you use with these products?
3) Would you buy Genesis 3 products if they worked in your primary software?.
Hopefully some one intelligent from Daz will sit up and listen.
my answers:
1) 56
2) Carrara
3) Yes
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Comments
1) 50
2) Carrara
3) Yes
I stopped buying most things for awhile now.... I am afraid to really get any more content, DS while being now powerful just is painful to use. And it has been obvious that Daz has left us off most polls and lists. This way they (whoever they are) can say, see not even showing up on the Radar.
1) 30
2) Carrara
3) Yes
I went and looked at my first product ...
1) 69
2) Carrara
3) yes
1: 101
2: Daz 4.8
3: Yes
I've been buying content since V2/M2 (Remember them?) I have Cararra 8.5 but I rarely use it. It seems pretty much abandoned.
1: 77
2: Carrara
3: Yes
ncamp
1: 25
2: Only Carrara
3: Yes (I actually did but I've got to send her back home now)
1) 12 (*sniff*, *sniff*)
2) Carrara
3) Maybe (if I eventually see the justification for it, but given that I've only just started digging into G2 and I still love my V4 and M4, yet to understand what the fuss is all about)
*Random musing.....wondering if Daz would consider selling Carrara to Reallusion, and if Reallusion would be interested, whether they would be able to create a Carrara-iClone singularity in which Daz would still get to sell content.
How about they just open source Carrara. That way they still get to sell us stuff but we can at least have some hope for some forward movement. I didn't really understand the business logic behind the resent disappearance of Carrara on the Daz site, but then when all the iClone products started appearing it made perfect sense. Since the model is content sales it makes perfect sense to drop Carrara in exchange for a cozier relationship with Reallusion. Gen3 will work in iClone long before it ever works in Carrara (if ever).
How about they just open source Carrara. That way they still get to sell us stuff but we can at least have some hope for some forward movement. I didn't really understand the business logic behind the resent disappearance of Carrara on the Daz site, but then when all the iClone products started appearing it made perfect sense. Since the model is content sales it makes perfect sense to drop Carrara in exchange for a cozier relationship with Reallusion. Gen3 will work in iClone long before it ever works in Carrara (if ever).
Open source would have been good, but they probably won't because their model favours a walled garden approach. One other thing I have suggested in the past is for them to create a proper bridge between Carrara and Daz Studio, taking that further, they really should offer incentives to developers for making plugins for Carrara, beyond the chance to sell the plugins on the content store, Carrara core base can still go strong for a while, it would go even futher with a rich tool kit of plugins
1. 33
2. Carrara
3. Yes.
1. 16
2. Carrara
3. Yes.
1. 68
2. Carrara
3. Yes
1. 62
2. Carrara
3. Yes
who cares
iClone 6 pro
NO
35 pages with products
I do all my renders in Carrara
And I would probably use Gen3 , if it was working.
DAZ Marketing cares, but not enough to read this thread or do anything about it. Probably. Wouldn't mind being proven wrong, despite...
My Content Library is 22 pages of mostly free stuff.
But it does get used primarily in Cowrarra (with a bit of Bryce, which by default adds an equal bit of DAZ Studio).
But I can't say I'd ever use Genocide in any of it's incarnations since I had a trial of 8.5 and never felt inclined to render a human for anything.
Here is my ONLY attempt to use Genocide for anything, ever. It's an old one, probably Genocide The First - but not sure. Who can keep those human figures straight anyhow??
1) 15
2) Carrara and iClone (the future of Carrara)
3) yes
Pages, I don't know, but I have a lot of stuff I bought from Daz to use in Carrara
Carrara, only
Maybe in the future if it works with Carrara, otherwise not interested
i'd buy more back catalog stuff if it comes with carrara shaders.
1. 16 pages of content and growing
2. Carrara is the only 3d application I use.
3. Yes I would buy Genesis 3 and related content if it worked in Carrara.
1) 135 pages ( don't tell my husband, lol)
2) Carrara (I won't be switching to DS if that becomes the only choice)
3) yes
Here is my list.
Note: I have lots of Genesis 2 items.
1) 17 Pages
2) Carrara
3) YES
OMG! We won't... we promise!
I'm with you. I'll save my pennies and move on to something else...
This has been an interesting progression. For one of the articles I wrote for 3D Artist magazine, I researched popularity/installed 3D software that had been gathered by an independent industry 3rd party.
At that time in 2009, Carrara was the second most installed software right behind Blender. This is because DAZ distributed Carrara freely, as they currently do with Studio. This was on an international level. Carrara was a loss-leader to sell content.
Maybe you don't sell as much content with a 3D authoring software as you do with a 3D manipulation software?
This trend for isolationism is unfortunate because my other, um, pro level CG software will import Poser, and legacy DAZ files that were created to the Poser standard, natively or with a plugin. I suspect that new Genesis figures will not be functional in those programs either.
No editorial comments from me on this but, wow. (I guess that was an editorial comment)
Based on past conversations I've had with the devs/programmers, we are not alone in our frustration.
Hi.
1) 28
2) Carrara
3) Yes
plus lots of other content from Renderosity and RuntimeDNA.
Keep adding to this list everyone,
I have sent the list to this thread to DAZ Marketing.
1. 39 pages of content
2. used in Carrara
3. Yes. Maybe.
1. 36 pages
2. Carrara
3. YES!!
Unfortunately I don't think DAZ 3D truley understands Carrara's unique niche in the 3D market. It is the only general 3D application that has native support of their content. For people who want to go beyond the capabilities of DAZ Studio (or Poser), yet easily consume (use) the modern 3D content provided by DAZ 3D (Genesis/Genesis 2), Carrara is by far the best option available (and in all practicality, the only option available without a lot of extra work).
I have tested Genesis, Genesis 2 and now Genesis 3 in Maya, and while you can pose the figures, you lose all of the morphs and pose controls that make using them in Carrara (and DS) so great. As it stands now, even though you can pose Genesis 3 in Maya and have quite good bends using Collada, the new facial bone structure would make any serious use of Genesis 3 prohibitive without building a customized control rig in Maya (using FBX really isn't a good option, joints like the shoulders have much worse ballooning effects than V4 did). I'm sure that 3DS Max would have the same issues, but just to make sure I will test it latter today.
Are there other applications that are better than Carrara for landscapes? Yes
Are there other applications that are better than Carrara for modeling? Yes
Are there other applications that are better than Carrara for animation? Yes
Are there other applications that are better than Carrara for rendering? Possibly, but the Octane Render plugin for Carrara has made it very competitive again.
Are there other general purpose applications that are better than Carrara? Yes
But here is the one question that keeps me using Carrara ....... and DAZ 3D figures/content!
Are there other applications that can do all of the above, and easily consume DAZ 3d content including everything from the original Vicky and Mike figures to Genesis 2 like Carrara can? NO!
The list of applcations that can't do what Carrara can do with DAZ 3D content includes Maya, 3DS Max, Cinema 4d (though it can use Generation 4 and older via Interposer Pro), Blender, Shade 3D, and even iClone (though it is making great strides forward, it still can't do what Carrara can). Carrara is the only "full featured" general purpose 3D application that can easily consume (use) DAZ 3D content. This makes it a very unique product in the market place, and one the could be the go-to application for individuals or very small independent/freelance GFX firms. All it would take is for DAZ 3D to actually give it some real attention.
DAZ 3D has this fantastic software application (Carrara) that can help push more of there content into the professional market, have a tool that will allow hobby users an affordable path to grow their 3D skills while using the Content they have already purchased (and will continue to purchase) and increase revenue from software sales at the same time. Yet they refuse to put the effort into marketing Carrara and making it easier to use their content in Carrara. How many new Carrara users have we seen in the forums over the years that have given up and gone back to DS or Poser because they had to go in and manually edit the shaders to get them to look good in Carrara. DAZ 3D gets it with DAZ Studio - they understand that everything really needs to be easy to use to get the new user "hooked" on 3D art, and to keep them coming back for more. Yet they don't seen to understand those same basic principles with Carrara. Their attitude with Carrara seems to be more along the lines of "well if they are going to actually pay money for the software, then they better be prepared to spend a lot of time learning it, no more hand holding from us".
I realize that DAZ 3D makes very little of their own content, and relies on PA's to provide the bulk of the content. But the PA's won't provide Content for something that won't pay the bill's. To make Carrara a success DAZ needs to take the initiative to help build a customer base that will support the PA's. As Ringo noted, some of his products simply don't sell enough to make it worth the effort (I'm guessing it's some of his shader sets for Genesis 2 figures). Honestly, that's really no surprise, because many of the long time Carrara users create their own shaders, and all the mis-information about Genesis 2 not working in Carrara makes their purchase even less attractive (a lot of this is also thanks to DAZ 3D with their official stance that Genesis 2 is not supported in Carrara 8.5 - talk about purposely shooting yourself in the foot and then wondering why it hurts!!!).
I'm actually in a position now that if I knew there was a future for Carrara, and that DAZ 3D actually wanted to promote Carrara (and not hide it in their store), I would be more than willing to put serious effort into making Carrara specific shader sets for the store (or partnering with anyone who would like to). In fact I've even thought very seriously about making Characters for Genesis 2 (or 3 if it was supported in Carrara) with shaders for 3Delight, Iray, Carrara, and Octane for Carrara. But unfortunately, it looks like DAZ 3D has decided Carrara is another one of their dead end software purchases. How sad a thought that is :-/
Sorry for the long post - I can't say I feel better now, but at least I've said my peace.
PS: I've added a few render below to show that I do use DAZ 3D Content in Carrara (most are Genesis or Genesis 2)
1 - only 5 pages in my account library. Sorry, not a major player.
2 - Carrara
3 - Maybe. Mostly interested in toon and anime style characters.