AQ Barbarian for Genesis 3 Male(s) - ears on hood
mmitchell_houston
Posts: 2,484
I really like the hood (and a few other items of the clothing) in this product: AQ Barbarian for Genesis 3 Male(s).
If the hood did not have ears I would grab this up today. There's nothing wrong with the ears (and I think they are a nice touch for many projects), but they wouldn't work with what I have in mind. If there were a "Hide Ears" option, I would nab this in a second.
I'm only mentioning this as food for thought for people developing future products: You should always create the best looking product you can that matches your vision. But then, step back for a second and think about ways you can make it more versatile so others can mix-n-match it with other pieces.
Anyway, as I said, I do like it. It's very cool.
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Comments
Looks like it is supposed to be inspired by Frazetta's Jaguar God...hence the ears
Rawn
Very well put. While many customers will use the item as-is, a great many of us buy products specifically to mix-and-match pieces with others.
If you know how to use the Geometry Editor tool, that could probably remove the ears nicely.
A better suggestion is to learn how to incorporate tools to edit and add morphs to items to give you that versatility. You can use blender or hexagon to remove the ears yourself or not wear the hood and use other items in conjunction. Kitbashing means you're modifying items as well to suit your needs as sometimes putting things together will require a quick trip to the modelling tool for changes.
Not all of us can model. I've experimented for years and have never really gotten the hang of it. There's just something about the process that doesn't click with me.
Now I would just paint the ears out in postwork, but what we're saying is that PAs benefit too from including these sorts of small options in products. Things like midriff cutouts on dresses - having one severely limits how it can be used. Including a transparency map instead of cutting a hole in the mesh would allow both a 'sexy' look and a 'normal' one, thus increasing it's usefulness and making it more appealing to buy.
Again, this is where learning how to make those edits that you want come in. If this is how the PA envisions it, then that's how it's created. If you want to change that, then it is really up to you to roll your sleeves up and do those changes. If an item can't be used in a manner you want, there are simply other choices. Sometimes items just aren't made with being generic or interchangeable in mind.
I will get this item, but most likely I will not use the hood and find some hair to pair it with instead, as items more G3M that have more of loincloth make to it are hard to autofit from previous generations and I normally keep the face visible for promos.
No. My point stands on its own. Yours does not.
I'm not trying to be harsh, but my point is designed to get PAs more sales. Your point is... well... true, but kind off point. Yes, we can all learn new tools and start editing meshes and more. But that's not really the point here, is it? The point, as I state below, is that PAs should make a great product, then step back and ask a simple question: How usable is this? Could I make a small change that would make it more versatile? If so, then might that not help sales?
That may be true, but I'm just saying that it's also in the best interest of the PA to make an item that has the most appeal. There's nothing wrong with this item having ears, but would it sell a little better if there were a no-ears option? Who knows.
There are often not. Perhaps for floor-length dresses and white female textures, but I am constantly waiting for items that no one has gotten around to make yet.
I get where you're coming from of course, but I think if when PAs think like artists and envision what might be done with their product, everyone benefits.
Exactly my point. This is a neat item. And I love the reference to the Frazetta piece. But I was just saying that, specifically, I would buy this piece today if there was a "No Ears" option. Could I edit it myself? Probably. I could probably put a transmap on the ears, too. And if this were essential to a project I was working on, then I would. Right now, though, as an item that makes me think, "Hey, that's kinda cool... I could probably use that someday in the future... But it would take some work to make it usable off the shelf." Then that's about $15 I'll keep and spend on something else.
And the point about crop tops is spot on. I see a lot of outfits that are too specific and limited because of reasons like that.
Anyway, the PAs can do whatever they want. I'm sure this item will sell as is (I hope so). I just wanted to plant an idea in a few heads, which is probably something they already know, but could stand to be reminded of every now and then.
Being a PA, how exactly does doing more work that only a few will use make more sales? I think that's where your argument fall flat, because it doesn't. So I don't really need someone that doesn't sell a thing to tell me what will sell. So if I as a PA can't cover every single thing customers need, then once again it falls to customers to make any changes to make it work for specific needs.
Bells and whistles on a gadget don't always make it more attractive. However, if given the choice over a paper bag and a cloth bag with optional textures and zipper for a little more, I'd buy it. But please don't tell me to buy the paper bag, make a texture and add a zipper myself, you've lost the sale of the paper bag.
Sure you can claim artistic license to make or not make whatever you want but don't discourage the original suggestion of the OP that might be practical information for other artists willing to try it.
I should bite my tongue here...
Those who don't sell things are also the ones buying your products, lol. I've talked to plenty of PAs who were surprised that their product didn't sell, which shows that they don't always know best. Now granted, customers ask for all kinds of insane things as well, but I'm talking about pretty simple, almost "duhh" common sense options. "Would this dress appeal to more potential customers if they could choose to hide the giant hole in the abdomen and not have her butt crack be visible? Hmm..."
We're not expecting a PA to cover every single thing any customer might need, we're only asking the creator to step back and think like a potential customer for a minute. I tried to cram that idea into all of your heads when I was a PA, but everyone was more interested in hearing Kevin talk about food and Nintendo. ;)
if we could do it all ourselves, we wouldnt need to buy anything.
There do seem to be a lot of assumeptions floating around in this thread - about how many people are or aren't going to be persuaded to buy by this or that "minor" tweak to a product. The basic ideas, that some people find quirky features a reason not to buy and that a PA can't hope to cover every possible twist of taste in a reasonable tiem frame - have been made.
With luck perhaps someone reading this thread who owns the product can make a morph to remove the ears as a freebie.
Sure we can kitbash but options in the original are always better
Calla Gown I had to kitbash just to use it, was lovely enough to warrant buying it but no way was that plunging below navel neckline feasable for anything.
I used a second skin made using LIE to fix it giving a lace inlay but not everyone going to bother, they would just not buy it.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/74679/my-calla-gown-neckline-or-is-that-naveline-fix#latest
That wasn't even the point of starting this discussion. The point was to remind the PAs to step back, take a look at their products, and think about usability and versatility. I still think the original hood is a nice design. But, for a casual purchase, taking the time to edit their removal is something I'm not going to undertake. I'll just move on to another item.
Which is very subjective and varies from person to person, so Richard already touched on that. If the PA was going for a certain look, what you're asking for won't even come into play, especially if that change is going to spend extra time going through QA due to trying to find a place to put all those polys and still end up with something that looks good and will pass testing.
I still think Arki could have grabbed a few more sales on that Calla gown though with a transmapped cutout instead of a modelled one.
I have to disagree, as a modeler and someone that makes some of my own content, thinking like the artist and what "my" use is and what "I" envision is what keeps me from using transmaps or making more options for what others might need in a addon. Thinking like a vendor is what would make me spend the extra time and effort to add options outside of what "my" use would be for the addon. many times the vendor is an artist also and creating is their form of art and the final product is what they envision. While it might be more useful to more users to change the style or how it is created, it might not be part of their creative vision, something most here should be able to identifiy with.
I can probably count on one hand the amount of assets I have never had to alter in any way to use them, most items go thru some sort of change for me to be happy with them in a project. Personally I hate using transmaps, I want to see visable seams, depth and details.
Or not ...
They do. ;) Forum population are such a small part of the buying population, this is why most time suggestions that really aren't feasible should be taken with a grain of salt. ;)
Apparently my last appeal for respecting others' views fell on deaf eyes, so I will make it more explicit - please keep the discussion civil, and address the topic not the poster.
Actually the character resembles Frazetta's Darkwolf character which currently belongs to Sony Pictues and, it's "Fire and Ice" animated film character has been under posible lvie action development since 2012.
Exactly. We can't cater to only 1 group of people, and the smallest population at that. We have to also think about the thousands of people who aren't in the forums. We have a good idea of what sells so we make our stuff to fit.
Well, I have nothing invested in this particular product so I am totally speaking in general, and not directed at any product in particular. Speaking only for myself the more options a product has the more likely I am to buy it. Now, this does not mean that I won't buy a product because it has less or no options, obviously if I think it suits what I need I will purchase it. BUT if looks like it will be more versatile then that does weigh into the consideration of wether to purchase or not. and if I am teetering on the edge that very well may push me over. I can, pretty easily, modify some things via postwork but I am not anywhere near skilled enough to be able to take something into a modeller and make changes then bring it back to studio. And its not even that I don't want to learn to do that, I actually do but I have such a long way to go just learning Daz Studio that it will be a long time before I am able to really learn that side of things well enough to use it.
Again, just a look at how I think when I shop, you can use the information any way you would like. But from a relative newcomer who has zero experience with 3d and any type of modelling program this is what influences my shopping habits.
We're not saying you need to cater to every forumite who asks for a beekeeper outfit for Ichiro. We're asking that while you're sitting on the toilet during a bathroom break while modeling, you ask yourself "would it be very hard to hide the horns on that helmet?", "could I separate the walls of that temple so it would be easier to get a camera in there?", or "hm, maybe I could make the heel a separate surface so it could be hidden because high heels don't work in every situtation that a 3D female can be in?"
That stuff MATTERS. It may not to you, but it does to potential customers, and the whole point of you making products is to get us to buy them.
The only reason I'd buy that set is for the hood with ears. Without the ears it'd look like an executioners hood which I'd never use. I had no clue about the Frazetta Darkwold character either. Add some actual 'furry' texture on it and you'd get a real animal feel... with no bump hood it looks odd. I'd know how to do displaced fur in Poser in a snap... in DAZ I'll have to play around for some hours - ha ha. To be honest I'd probably export it as an obj to Poser... make a transmap to make it more of a 'Cat Man' mask and plop on a heroes head :)
One artist's trash is another's gold. The vendor can't please everyone. If someone wanted the vendor to create a morph to get rid of the ears they'd do better contacting the vendor in person, telling them they loved the set and wished for a 'no ears' morph version the vendor could offer as a freebie to their devoted fans which would be a win-win for both customer and vendor... instead of shaming them in a public forum making it a lose-lose. The marketplace trade is a two way street.
Editing to say... almost every vendor has a deviantart account... so yes! you can contact these vendors if you really want to find a way and are civil.
+1
I got the outfit yesterday and looking it over, I need to make a fit for my promos and could have easily made this edit, however when threads take the lecture not an asking tone, I won't bother seeing if I can make this morph while I'm at it.
There's no lecturing going on. I can only speak for myself, but what I am asking is for PAs to just think about how their product might be used by customers and consider additional options that might make their product more useful to a wider audience.
This wasn't meant to be an attack on the Barbarian outfit's creator either. The original poster just said that if it didn't have the ears, he would have bought it. That's what PAs should know; that even tiny things can make or break a potential purchase and that those options I ask you to consider may be more important than you think.
SnowSultan speaks truth! While I can appreciate how the vendors want to create something with a specific look, added appeal might be accomplished with a smidgen of extra work.