why isn't anybody talking about Daz 4.22?

BlueFingers

MelissaGT said:

And because I'm a complete and total moron, I didn't save a copy of 4.21 because I thought...how diffeent can it be? *sigh*

 

You are not the only moron,...another one,...right here.

Richard Haseltine

Hylas said:

As always, I'll wait a month or two and then probably take the plunge.

The eternal question: Does GenX still work? Any other assets that may stop working?

 

"Official" Ghost Lights, yay! But correct me if I'm wrong, the old Ghost Lights (from before the IRAY update) not only were invisible but they also behaved differently regarding specular reflections? I wonder if these new Ghost Lights also behave that way? It doesn't look like it in the youtube video, but I can't be sure.

The reflection of the Ghost Lights is controlled by the other new proeprty - we now get to add them via the create Advanced iray node proerpties script rather than having to add them manually, but see Creating a "Ghost Light" - Daz Studio 4.21.1.26+ - Daz 3D Forums

PerttiA

richardandtracy said:

columbine said:

Haruchai, no offense meant, but videos are not documentation (and I get really fed up when people say "Oh, there's a video for that!") I can not only read text much faster than the rate at which videos normally present information, but as a verbally-oriented person I absorb it much better.

If I put out an update to any of the software I maintain and did not provide my users with written patch notes, I would get a fair bit of backlash for it, and I would deserve it.

Exactly what I bolded above applies to me. The fact I learn nothing from videos has meant Blender is a complete waste of time for me.

Me too.

Whenever I'm forced to search for information in youtube, there better be nobody with a shouting distance.

Richard Haseltine

Taoz said:

Omniflux said:

@Taoz

DIM shows the name associated with the SKU (updated when you login) not with the package that was installed. The name associated with the SKU changed which is why you are seeing that.

OK, thanks.  I would call that a reporting bug then.

DIM shows only the one name. It is how it is meant to work, so not a bug - the tool tip should give more information, including install date where appropriate.

Richard Haseltine

Taoz said:

NorthOf45 said:

windli3356 said:

PerttiA said:

windli3356 said:

How is it? any major bugs? 

The "fast asset loading" is very tempting, but since almost all Daz past updates had catastrophic bugs and errors, making the trade off not worth it, I'm really afraid history will repeat itself with this new update. 

And not having a roll back option certainly isn’t helping, I can only hope to find out from someone who downloaded and tried

Usually it is better to wait a few weeks until the impatient ones have tested it first 

Usually that's my approach, but that "fast asset loading" is too tempting, 

But then I remember the horror experience I had with 4.21 update by the time it first released, it destroyed all my metadata, I ended up re-download all my contents and reset my working environment which took me almost a week just to get things back the way it was.  

really hope roll back to last version is an option, don't know why it never materialized

 

There is no rollback option, or support. Keep a copy of your program downloads, and any dependent plugins. You can install older versions with DIM offline by copying the relevant packages into the download folder. Uninstall the current version and the older one will become Ready To Install.

I've written a DS version manager (Windows) which makes it simple to backup as well as restore (to the DIM Downloads folder) any version including plugins.  Just need to do the annoying part, writing the documention.  

DIM will now create backups, see the change log - though i keep forgetting to set this up. Edit http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/install_manager/change_log_1_4_0_94#1_4_0_86

Richard Haseltine

Gordig said:

I just installed 4.22, loaded a G8.1F dev load, and it was substantially faster than in previous versions, and that's even with duplicate formulas that I haven't bothered resolving.

Almost all of the overhead from Duplicate Formulas has been eliminated (for me, at least) - the gain on a well-behaved installation is less pronounced, but still very noticeable (for me, at least).

Richard Haseltine

LynnInDenver said:

Unfortunately, it's like a lot of stuff that's "free"... we have become the product, so to speak. Not putting ads into something has always been considered "leaving money on the table", even for stuff that we pay for (I remember when cable television channels had no ads).

Well, here the product is clear - selling store content funds DS.

Richard Haseltine

richardandtracy said:

I think in a couple of months I may try adding DS4.22 to my list of installed varieties (I manually install and have 4.10, 4.11, 4.12, 4.14, 4.16 and 4.21 installed in parallel), but will only test new models with it if the ads are still in use at that point.

I am NOT going to waste any of my limited screen area on something I would never feel anything towards except total hatred. One of the reasons I LIKE the DAZ forum and rarely use the Rendo forum is the lack of ads at DAZ and plethora at Rendo. Why would I then want them inside my working environment? Answer: I wouldn't & I don't.

Regards,

Richard

The ads (notifications) appear only in the New dialogue, theya re not taking up space in the working enironment.

Richard Haseltine

mtl1 said:

Can anyone confirm whether the new Connect functionality also fixes the corruption issues? In particular, the Order Date and other similar metadata? The inclusion of the checkbox is a rather.. curious workaround but I wonder if the actual issue was fixed too?

Not in the Beta, certainly - as far as I am aware this is an issue on the store side, the break happened with the stoe update when there was no change in DS. Not that that is any comfort, trying to find new items to install is a pain (I use Install date, which does work, to find newly installed stuff).

richardandtracy

After a month or two I'll load it & see if I can live with it. Time to get bugs out and see if DAZ changes its mind about them too...

Regards,

Richard

Richard Haseltine

columbine said:

I wish Daz would put out systematic patch notes. I see today's feature page is saying something about ghost lights. So, for example, I'd kind of like to know exactly what they did (broke) about ghost lights before installing this. (I don't blame them for the ghost light changes in 4.20--that was Nvidia saying "Iray was not supposed to work like that, you were exploiting a bug whether you knew it or not, and we're not going to make it work the wrong way just for you." But now they've messed with them again?)

The updated Create Advanced Iray Node Properties script incorporates Creating a "Ghost Light" - Daz Studio 4.21.1.26+ - Daz 3D Forums

Eh. My policy on Studio updates is to wait at least a month for everyone else to find the bugs. Sorry, y'all, but I don't have the time to be a beta tester for this product (and, with thirty-plus years in software, I don't beta-test for free anyway), and Daz has shown they cannot be trusted to release software in a relatively bug-free condition. Mind you, that's not just Daz; that seems to be the case with almost all software these days. I am currently putting off buying that new Bethesda game because I have an ironclad rule "Never buy a Bethesda game until it's been out long enough for the Unofficial Patch to come out," which usually is about four months. I can wait.

Matt_Castle

columbine said:

So, for example, I'd kind of like to know exactly what they did (broke) about ghost lights before installing this. (I don't blame them for the ghost light changes in 4.20--that was Nvidia saying "Iray was not supposed to work like that, you were exploiting a bug whether you knew it or not, and we're not going to make it work the wrong way just for you." But now they've messed with them again?)

A little less cynicism! No messing, no breaking. This is Daz working with Nvidia to add new functionality to Iray to replace the previously unintended behaviour.

https://raytracing-docs.nvidia.com/iray/manual/index.html#iray_photoreal_render_mode#ghost-lights

The new function allows you to take direct control of a light source's specular reflections. Note that it can now be used on any light source (not just emissive objects - it can now be spotlights, so you can now control the angle of ghost lights), and can be further adjusted per object, so you can make it show up less or more in specific objects.

If you don't use the new function, it will work as it did in DS 4.21 (allowing for the normal differences in how optimisations and tweaks to Iray can affect rendering).

I've not yet really tinkered with it, but on paper this is a significant upgrade, potentially even over the old unintended functionality.

Bobvan

Failure to properly on my 3070 laptop. Restarts as the installation concludes causes saved scene to not load. Does not show up in uninstall programs. Cannot be re installed I just did a system restore.

Hylas

Richard Haseltine said:

Hylas said:

"Official" Ghost Lights, yay! But correct me if I'm wrong, the old Ghost Lights (from before the IRAY update) not only were invisible but they also behaved differently regarding specular reflections? I wonder if these new Ghost Lights also behave that way? It doesn't look like it in the youtube video, but I can't be sure.

The reflection of the Ghost Lights is controlled by the other new proeprty - we now get to add them via the create Advanced iray node proerpties script rather than having to add them manually, but see Creating a "Ghost Light" - Daz Studio 4.21.1.26+ - Daz 3D Forums

Matt_Castle said:

A little less cynicism! No messing, no breaking. This is Daz working with Nvidia to add new functionality to Iray to replace the previously unintended behaviour.

https://raytracing-docs.nvidia.com/iray/manual/index.html#iray_photoreal_render_mode#ghost-lights

The new function allows you to take direct control of a light source's specular reflections. Note that it can now be used on any light source (not just emissive objects - it can now be spotlights, so you can now control the angle of ghost lights), and can be further adjusted per object, so you can make it show up less or more in specific objects.

If you don't use the new function, it will work as it did in DS 4.21 (allowing for the normal differences in how optimisations and tweaks to Iray can affect rendering).

I've not yet really tinkered with it, but on paper this is a significant upgrade, potentially even over the old unintended functionality.

This sounds very exciting!

Bobvan

BlueFingers said:

MelissaGT said:

And because I'm a complete and total moron, I didn't save a copy of 4.21 because I thought...how diffeent can it be? *sigh*

 

You are not the only moron,...another one,...right here.

System restore is your friend..

WendyLuvsCatz

BTW I haven't seen the ad or new template 

probably because I don't log in

ignorance is bliss 

MelissaGT

Bobvan said:

BlueFingers said:

MelissaGT said:

And because I'm a complete and total moron, I didn't save a copy of 4.21 because I thought...how diffeent can it be? *sigh*

 

You are not the only moron,...another one,...right here.

System restore is your friend..

I only keep restore points on my OS drive. I don't have Daz installed on my OS drive. Tho I might be able to recover it from a backup. I'll have to check.  

*edit* Nope, I normally don't back up executables...I just have my library backed up. 

Richard Haseltine

Bobvan said:

Failure to properly on my 3070 laptop. Restarts as the installation concludes causes saved scene to not load. Does not show up in uninstall programs. Cannot be re installed I just did a system restore.

Was this via DIM or a stand-alone install? DIM installs arte managed by DIM, so they will not appear in Add/remove applications.

wsterdan

Would I be wrong to assume that this release suggests that DAZ Studio 5 won't arrive until sometime in 2024?

-- Walt Sterdan

PerttiA

wsterdan said:

Would I be wrong to assume that this release suggests that DAZ Studio 5 won't arrive until sometime in 2024?

-- Walt Sterdan

Or they took their time to make sure the last DS 4 had it's bugs ironed out before releasing the next major version.

The "Omniverse soon to DS5" strongly suggests that the date is near.

Richard Haseltine

wsterdan said:

Would I be wrong to assume that this release suggests that DAZ Studio 5 won't arrive until sometime in 2024?

-- Walt Sterdan

Maybe, if they have been working in parallel, but it does seem rathe tight to get anything out this year - dpending on how much new stuff there is in 5 (or whatever it is called).

JOdel

Nvidia, Nvidia, Nvidia...

How does it run on a Mac? *Does* it run on a Mac? What *version* of a Mac?

I'm on an Intel iMac from 2018, running Mojave, and not going to upgrade my OS on this computer, period. How far behind the curve will this new version of Studio run? More important, what in DAZ cntent is most likely to be dependant on the new version of Studio in order to be operable?

Elor

PerttiA said:

The "Omniverse soon to DS5" strongly suggests that the date is near.

Not if Daz licensed Soon from Blizzard

Soon™: Copyright 2004-2023 Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. All rights reserved. "Soon" does not imply any particular date, time, decade, century, or millennia in the past, present, and certainly not the future. "Soon" shall make no contract or warranty between Blizzard Entertainment and the end user. "Soon" will arrive some day, Blizzard does guarantee that "soon" will be here before the end of time. Maybe. Do not make plans based on "soon" as Blizzard will not be liable for any misuse, use, or even casual glancing at "soon."

JOdel said:

Nvidia, Nvidia, Nvidia...

How does it run on a Mac? *Does* it run on a Mac? What *version* of a Mac?

It does run on a Mac but if your mac doesn't have an Nvidia GPU, simulation will be slow, render will be even slower. I don't know what version of MacOS is currently supported.

Nath

PerttiA said:

WendyLuvsCatz said:

you could possibly block the URL for the ads in Windows Firewall 

Or not log in to DS in the first place. 

Makes no difference whether or not you're logged in. I still get an ad when I start a new scene, and I've never logged in to DAZ on this computer.

So, as suggested in a thread somewhere, I've made a blank scene, created a custom action for it, and now start new scenes from the scripts menu (or you could define a shortcut key for it).

daveso

only thing I need to know, does it render faster in iray than before? I was a bit disappointed with the increase in rendering speed when I bought my new system and hoping DAZ has implemented some of the newer Nvidia features.

Leana

Elor said:

PerttiA said:

The "Omniverse soon to DS5" strongly suggests that the date is near.

Not if Daz licensed Soon from Blizzard

Soon™: Copyright 2004-2023 Blizzard Entertainment, Inc. All rights reserved. "Soon" does not imply any particular date, time, decade, century, or millennia in the past, present, and certainly not the future. "Soon" shall make no contract or warranty between Blizzard Entertainment and the end user. "Soon" will arrive some day, Blizzard does guarantee that "soon" will be here before the end of time. Maybe. Do not make plans based on "soon" as Blizzard will not be liable for any misuse, use, or even casual glancing at "soon."

"Daz Soon" has been a thing for at least as long as "Blizzard Soon". Generally accepted definition used to be "At some point between now and the end of the universe, if you're lucky" 

mtl1

Richard Haseltine said:

mtl1 said:

Can anyone confirm whether the new Connect functionality also fixes the corruption issues? In particular, the Order Date and other similar metadata? The inclusion of the checkbox is a rather.. curious workaround but I wonder if the actual issue was fixed too?

Not in the Beta, certainly - as far as I am aware this is an issue on the store side, the break happened with the stoe update when there was no change in DS. Not that that is any comfort, trying to find new items to install is a pain (I use Install date, which does work, to find newly installed stuff).

Yeah, this occured with the store update a number of years ago. It's strange because I would've figured that Connect would pull the same metadata as DIM, which *does* have the correct information.

Install Date does work as a workaround, but I'd rather they fixed this bug after years of this persisting.

outrider42

Taoz said:

NorthOf45 said:

windli3356 said:

PerttiA said:

windli3356 said:

How is it? any major bugs? 

The "fast asset loading" is very tempting, but since almost all Daz past updates had catastrophic bugs and errors, making the trade off not worth it, I'm really afraid history will repeat itself with this new update. 

And not having a roll back option certainly isn’t helping, I can only hope to find out from someone who downloaded and tried

Usually it is better to wait a few weeks until the impatient ones have tested it first 

Usually that's my approach, but that "fast asset loading" is too tempting, 

But then I remember the horror experience I had with 4.21 update by the time it first released, it destroyed all my metadata, I ended up re-download all my contents and reset my working environment which took me almost a week just to get things back the way it was.  

really hope roll back to last version is an option, don't know why it never materialized

 

There is no rollback option, or support. Keep a copy of your program downloads, and any dependent plugins. You can install older versions with DIM offline by copying the relevant packages into the download folder. Uninstall the current version and the older one will become Ready To Install.

I've written a DS version manager (Windows) which makes it simple to backup as well as restore (to the DIM Downloads folder) any version including plugins.  Just need to do the annoying part, writing the documention.  

This sounds awesome. Is this a planned product for sale? However I would be stunned if Daz approves this to their store. 

wsterdan

PerttiA said:

wsterdan said:

Would I be wrong to assume that this release suggests that DAZ Studio 5 won't arrive until sometime in 2024?

-- Walt Sterdan

Or they took their time to make sure the last DS 4 had it's bugs ironed out before releasing the next major version.

The "Omniverse soon to DS5" strongly suggests that the date is near.

I try not to be overly negative, but while "Omniverse coming soon to DS5" may sound like DS5 itself is "near", it was posted that Filament was working on the Mac in DS5 back in August, 2021 and yet here we are.

As to getting DS 4's bugs ironed out, I whole-heartedly agree, but at the same time they're introducing new features which will no doubt introduce new bugs that will need to be ironed out. On the one hand it allows the new features to get their bugs ironed out before DAZ Studio 5 ("or whatever it is called"?) is released but by that very nature, it means DAZ Studio 5 will be pushed back until those bugs are ironed out. In the long run it will no doubt mean a more stable D|S 5 release, but it will also mean a delay. I've been waiting for Filament on the Mac for over three years, I was just hoping it really was almost here.

-- Walt Sterdan

 

MelissaGT

daveso said:

only thing I need to know, does it render faster in iray than before? I was a bit disappointed with the increase in rendering speed when I bought my new system and hoping DAZ has implemented some of the newer Nvidia features.

The one test I did took longer.