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When did you last look at Blender, Dart? You can now do virtually anything using menus - the fact that there are so many keyboard short-cuts is simply that - many short-cuts to be able to work faster, but you certainly don't need to memorize them all.
A lot of folks have been wanting Carrara to have more short-cuts:)
If only folk would look past the e-dolls when writing about Carrara's failings. There are so many more interesting subjects for rendering, which Carrara does exceptionally well for the price. How many other apps, other than Studio and Poser do folk use to render humans?
Most really good renders one sees around the net have nothing to do with humans - time to rediscover Carrara as it used to be before it became an e-doll renderer for Studio:)
When did you last look at Blender, Dart? You can now do virtually anything using menus - the fact that there are so many keyboard short-cuts is simply that - many short-cuts to be able to work faster, but you certainly don't need to memorize them all.
A lot of folks have been wanting Carrara to have more short-cuts:)
If only folk would look past the e-dolls when writing about Carrara's failings. There are so many more interesting subjects for rendering, which Carrara does exceptionally well for the price. How many other apps, other than Studio and Poser do folk use to render humans?
Most really good renders one sees around the net have nothing to do with humans - time to rediscover Carrara as it used to be before it became an e-doll renderer for Studio:)
Where is my like button? Well put, Roygee.
I would add that I don't think there is anything wrong with edolls. Plenty of people appreciate humans in art. Dustrider, PhilW, and many others do an amazing job of using Carrara in a workflow that includes humans. But everyone need not use the same workflow nor cover the same subjects. If Blender works for something, go for it. If Carrara works for something, use it. Etc. No disagreement there.
- BTW, I have almost finished an introduction to Carrara. I will start a thread for it soon. Part 1 is focused on a background terrain object with a preset then custom shader, then the realistic sky editor (also a preset and a custom), then using a grid from the vertex modeler to make a foreground terrain, a couple of simple objects (for other modeling funcitons), and finally the plant editor. Part 2 is also mostly done. It adds a human (Genesis - yes, Genesis can work in Carrara) along with edoll compatible content. I hope to do a Part 3 focusing on making other custom content that I would steal from some of my other threads. The idea would be to have a thread to point people to who are new to Carrara and just want to know what some of the common functions are and where the tools are in the interface. Then point them to PhilW, Cripeman, Mark Bremmer, MMoir, etc.
Sorry, rambling again.
How many other apps, other than Studio and Poser do folk use to render humans?
As the wise owl once said, One, Two crunch... THREE!
Actually there are now dozens. Vue, Poser, Carrara, DS, IClone, Bryce,Blender, Messiah, are free or very affordable and well suited for hobby artists. Pro's will use tools like 3DMax, Maya and Houdini. Look for 3d animation and rendering apps in this large, yet incomplete list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_3D_computer_graphics_software
Absolutely, I totally agree!
Carrara is well powered and laid out to do so many things that have nothing to do with "figures". I just constantly make that a point because no other modelers capable of doing such things can work with Poser dolls in such a Poser way. To me, this totally sold me on which 3D animation app to save up for, and continues to make me very happy!
But you're absolutely right. Carrara does have a lot more going for it that, for me, set is apart from the rest of the market. It has built-in animation assistance everywhere throughout the workflow, which is so perfect for what I'm doing.
I do recall seeing some new features in Blender that easy the point-and-click user on the interface. I also recall there still being things that are not like that, which still require a key command, which I'm certainly not against - and I certainly do not intend to bad-mouth Blender in the slightest! If I even sound like that... I used words that came out wrongly according to my beliefs! I haven't even tried the latest few versions of Blender, but already know that I love it... though I'm not sure I'll ever use it, since I'm so "At home" now in Carrara - it fulfills all of my needs for my project - especially now that I have the amazing assistance of Howler.
Rock on, Roygee!
I still do plan to mess around with Blender... I just need... t i m e ;)
Roygee - you make a good point about using Carrara for non-figure stuff, and I am constantly surprised that some Carrara users have never even tried to use some of it's great features like replication - it is like having Vue and never using Ecosystems! Carrara is such a wide program that you can spend years and not have covered everything. But one of its big strengths is that it can load and manipulate Poser and DS content AS WELL AS all the other 3D stuff (which I think makes it unique). We are humans and we love to look at pictures which include humans, even if they are not the main focus of an image. I am just delighted to have a tool like Carrara to turn my imagination into great images.
Oh and you can add Zbrush to the list of 3D programs which can do humans (and many other creatures!).
Don't get me wrong - I have nothing against using human figures in art. I'm just wondering aloud what users of other applications are so besotted with churning out perfect human renders, other than the Poser/Daz crowd? Pixar don't even do humans!
What amazes is the constant refrain of "Oh dear, G2 doesn't work perfectly, therefore Carrara is doomed".
Except for a few cosmetic changes, what development other than almost Genesis compatibility has Carrara undergone in the past few years? If anything will consign Carrara to the scrapheap of history, it is the lack of development in areas that have become standard in other applications, not whether or not Genesis is perfectly compatible.
Look how many of the regular posters are no longer around - are they suddenly working in isolation, or have they moved on to other apps which don't concentrate on producing perfect humans, but give them the tools to produce more efficiently in other areas?
Have any of you looked at the latest RC of Studio? Huge improvements in many departments - look out big brother, little brother is catching up fast!
Good point. If they don't need/want DS/Poser content integration, they may have moved on to another application. Although it could also be that they just don't have the time or inclination to post anymore. Many of the old regulars in the Commons here, and even the Poser forums I frequent, seldom post anymore, so this may just be a "sign of the times" so to speak.
I checked the DAZ3D shop last night, and Carrara 8.5 was #2 in the "Most Popular" category, and #2 in the "Trending Now" category (it's down to #8 in that category now). Obviously there are a lot of very new Carrara users right now, yet a quick look at the forum here and you would say there aren't many (any?) new users. Maybe forum activity can't be used as a proxy for how much Carrara (or any software/product) gets used? Looking at the DAZ Studio forum, you would get the impression that DS isn't used hardly at all.
This brings up another thought. What is the first thing most of those new Carrara users are going to want to do? My guess is just like what I often do, render their favorite "edoll" in Carrara. Unfortunately many will find that getting a good render with their favorite figure isn't as easy in Carrara as it is in DS or Poser. Then they will find that getting forum help with using their Genesis content in Carrara isn't as easy as in DS, because it seems there are only a handful of us here that actually use Genesis/Genesis2 in Carrara. So if they aren't really committed to learning/using Carrara from the start, then they are discouraged right from the start. Carrara is much more complex than DS, so for many DS users learning Carrara would be similar to Carrara users learning Blender. It is a totally foreign interface, with a completely different work flow. (Yes, Blender has gotten "better", but it's still far from user friendly, I recently got the educational version of Maya, and I can do a lot more with it by just poking around than I can with Blender.)
IMHO, that is why it really is important to the future of Carrara that "edolls" work in Carrara almost as well as they do in DS. Many, or more probably most of the new users of Carrara have only used DS, and to a lesser extent Poser. If their initial experience with Carrara is extremely negative compared to what they are used to, then they typically won't hang around long enough to learn about all the other awesome stuff you can do with Carrara. For long time users of Carrara, fixing mats/shaders on DAZ/Poser content isn't a big deal, but for new users that come from DS (or Poser) where everything is pretty much load/pose/render, it can be a huge deal (well, it's usually really not that easy - but it is getting close).
DS is the center piece for DAZ 3D's version of the "Gillette Razor Marketing Plan", so it should be expected that it will get the most attention, as it is free and much easier to learn than Carrara, and therefore it encourages more people to purchase/use DAZ 3D content. Since we don't know what content sales are for Carrara users/owners, it's hard to even guess how Carrara fits into DAZ 3D's marketing/business plan. But I would guess if it was clear that Carrara users were also huge content purchasers/users then Caarrara would get more attention. Obviously I don't have any idea as to the Carrara users habits with regards to purchasing/using DAZ 3D content. From many of the posts in this forum, I get the impression that many Carrara users here don't use/purchase a lot of content (or as much as many of the DS users). So it is very possible that Carrara isn't viewed as a great revenue generator for DAZ ..... or not ;-) ....... because I really don't know.
Sorry for the loooooooog post - but you got me to thinking, and that is always dangerous!
Come to think of it, does DAZ even know how much of their content sales can be attributed to Carrara users? Sure, they know which of their customers have purchased Carrara, but I would bet that most of those customers have also downloaded DAZ Studio (I have). So if most Carrara owners are also Studio owners, how could DAZ possibly determine how much content is sold purely for use in Carrara?
I suspect that the only real indication of content use in Carrara would be found here in the DAZ forums and Gallery. If this is true, and if DAZ is actually watching for this kind of usage, then I guess it would behoove us to post lots of images using content, even if we don't like content.
Come to think of it, does DAZ even know how much of their content sales can be attributed to Carrara users? Sure, they know which of their customers have purchased Carrara, but I would bet that most of those customers have also downloaded DAZ Studio (I have). So if most Carrara owners are also Studio owners, how could DAZ possibly determine how much content is sold purely for use in Carrara?
I suspect that the only real indication of content use in Carrara would be found here in the DAZ forums and Gallery. If this is true, and if DAZ is actually watching for this kind of usage, then I guess it would behoove us to post lots of images using content, even if we don't like content.
I wonder if a survery sent to Platinum Club members might help... if you have PC, I'd guess you are a serious purchaser of content. And they'd be able to more easily manage contacting them and then analysing the responses as to how they use their purchases.
Just thinking....... :roll: Silene
I bought Carrara Pro 8.5 in November one year ago. I had downloaded and tried Daz3D Studio the month before as an evaluation I was doing while looking for a program to make a movie I had in my head. At the time, I had spent about a month evaluating a number of different programs (source Filmmaker, Iclone, Daz3D Studio and a few I don't remember the names of). All had some issue that was a show stopper for me. I then found Carrara by following the "professional" link on the Daz home page. Over the last year I have spent $1601.46 on contet from Daz. Had Carrara not been listed on the home page I doupt I would have discovered it and would most likely have supported some other company this last year. I do not use Daz3D Studio and If my copy of Carrara vanished today I would still not. Not that there is anything wrong with it... it's just not the right tool for my needs. In the grand scheme of things I can't know how valuable a $1600 a year customer is to Daz but I do know that if I was running my own 3D company I certainly would prefer them to be one of my customers rather than someone else's.
DAZ 3D does intense sales comparisons and such and, yes... little brother (DS) has actually surpassed Carrara in a number of areas - but those areas are not where I, nor many other Carrara users, feel to be the most important in an all-around 3D package. I've yet to try Vue, but since I've found that I can achieve my goals in Carrara, I guess I may never have to. Kind of a shame, because it does look cool. One day, perhaps I'll install Bryce and Vue just to try them out for the fun of it.
It is already known that many Carrara users are also content buyers. The thing is, DAZ Studio is a very 'focused' application.They have always known where they wanted to go next with it, simply by pushing forward with what they've wanted the last time. Carrara is so vast in scope, that a good portion of developmental progress must happen very much behind the scenes. What are users asking for? Where are the trends going, and how feasible is it to add/tweak such trends into the software? etc., etc.,
So I can imagine that development for Carrara requires several meetings gathered from those whom are constantly busy pushing forward in their daily toils, so that there is that lengthy process between product assessment, prioritizing fixes and tweaks, new implementations and features discussions, and then finally allocating resources for development.
True, in comparison to dedicated software development companies, Carrara is truly on a slow moving path. Since DAZ makes so much more revenue from content than anything else, and DS already has tools to help artists turn assets into content - no matter the 3d software, it only makes sense to keep pushing that to the hilt. Carrara, while a much better product for many of us, is still more of a novelty item, and we are truly a minority.
I really do think that it's cool that DAZ 3D has at least kept Carrara, Bryce and Hexagon alive, by keeping them in the market for those of us, in that minority, really want or need those tools to remain available. I'd love to see Bryce and Hex get some lovin' too, and feel bad for those who have been begging for it, yet haven't seen anything in many years now. At least Carrara has been selling well enough to maitain at least some development. And if the majority of Carrara users all stood up and said: "Down with DAZ content - we just want Carrara", then DAZ 3D, as a company, would have much less value for delivering developmental strategies towards Carrara. Development is expensive stuff!
I agree. It is one reason that I still use Carrara (admittedly less frequently these days). It does make volumetric clouds, terrain and oceans pretty damn fast -- faster than LightWave (still have much to learn there though).
Its not well, stuff still is broke and unfixed and we are almost 2 years overdue being charged for.. Carrara 8.75
I meant from a store standpoint it is well, or at least it was when I replied. Given the new site update after a week, if Carrara isn't important enough to put on a home page of the store that sells it, then I don't see how it can be well or improved. Agree, in a development/bug fix sense it was not well.
I agree. It is one reason that I still use Carrara (admittedly less frequently these days). It does make volumetric clouds, terrain and oceans pretty damn fast -- faster than LightWave (still have much to learn there though).DAZ 3D sure does make some great e-dolls though! LOL
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I like how I can go into Carrara and do just about anything I want - make any kind of picture I feel like making. I really is the only software I know of that has all of these cool tools in one workshop. So freaking cool!
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I like how I can go into Carrara and do just about anything I want - make any kind of picture I feel like making. I really is the only software I know of that has all of these cool tools in one workshop. So freaking cool!
Well said!
Carrara is the only toolbox out there that truly lets my imagination come alive, and to be able to translate whats in my imagination into a tangible form that can be shared with others. Since Carrara 6, i've never looked back.
And yeah I very much hope Carrara stays alive and continues to see development and updates.
I'll play the part of the cranky, old b*stard then. I'll use Carrara to quickly setup some props and render them. But being creative from-scratch and doing all the modeling in Carrara? Not a snowball's chance in Hades.
Sure, Carrara modeling/shading is vastly easier than writing out the Scene Description Language in POV-Ray (where I started). Go check that out if you are curious -- it is educational...but painful...
But the Carrara modeling tools are so far behind the times now... Don't get me started on the annoying "little" bugs in the rest of the program. All of that builds up into a monster that saps my creativity away. I end up being angry at Carrara rather than creating what's in my head.
It's been said by me and others repeatedly. DAZ does not appear to give a tinker's dam about Carrara. I fully expect it to die a quiet death, save for the hardcore hangers-on (Hi Dart! ;-) ).
If you enjoy Carrara, knock yourself out. Have fun and enjoy it. For me, it is a tool of ever-decreasing usefulness.
Funnily enough, I am almost the opposite of how Garstor feels! I do create stuff from scratch all the time in Carrara, and don't really feel limited by the toolset. Yes there are bugs in the program - show me an application of any complexity that does not - but they tend to be minor annoyances for me rather than getting in the way too much. And the availability of alternative render engines - first Luxus and then Octane - has breathed new life into it (not to mention my discoveries related to gamma correction which has really enhanced my output from the native Carrara renderer). I am so used to it now and feel so comfortable using it, I can be more productive than using anything else. As to the future, I have confidence that DAZ has not finished with it just yet. If they made just a few changes, it would make a wonderful content creation tool for Daz Studio (as an example). I am currently working on a significant commercial animation project and it will all be done in Carrara.
Oh oh, I'm doing battle with the illustrious Phil! (No hard feelings chummer, drinks on me when I get around to visiting England!) :lol:
I am planning on buying Octane when I build my new server (in the very near future). Admittedly, it will be for LightWave at first. But I won't rule out Octane for Carrara. In fact, I wanted to open a discussion with you on your server specs and what kind of performance you typically see in Octane.
Maybe you are privy to some internal information then. If not, what public evidence do you see that inspires this confidence? I can make one concession on that -- the monthly Carrara contests. DAZ (and the other PA sponsors) get a thumbs up from me there. But that is fairly recent and remains tightly limited to the "in-crowd."
Carrara would make an excellent D|S content creation tool. DAZ sure doesn't market it that way.
I really try not to engage in this negativity. I know the forums were plagued in the past with it. Those days should stay in the past. Truthfully, I'd love to see Carrara become more than it is -- it doesn't have to knock Maya off its top perch to do that. I like that there is a 3D tool on the lower-end of the price spectrum that can do all that Carrara does. I just want to see it get a shiny polish and fix up those annoyances.
Cheers mate! </ clink glasses of appropriate libations>
Has anyone seen this thread .... It's hiding http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/48629/
BOOM! No I have not. Reading now. Thanks!
Why wasn't this posted on the date it's dated? Shows only a few mins ago, not the 11th of November.
Going to check it out..thanks¬
:gulp: Silene
Installed already WoHoo
New version of Daz Studio as well
The fix for duplicate with symmetry is a big deal to me.
Good to see that there is some motion!
Is there a 9 in the future? heh heh
Good news on the Carrara Beta!
Garstor - you made me laugh when you referred to my "server spec" - I use a laptop, have done for years! I got this one last year so it is fairly up to date and pretty powerful, including a NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M graphics card. I think when I got it, Octane for Carrara had been announced but not yet even private Beta, but I made sure it had a card suitable for using Octane as and when it came along, as you can't really retro-fit anything to a laptop.
Sorry to dredge up an old thread, but I was searching for some real information on the future of Carrara.
I, and I'm sure most people in this forum, agree that Carrara has some nice qualities, as does most software out there. Or else nobody would buy them. :)
But I'm wondering if anyone has any real, official information from DAZ on the future of Carrara. Looks like this latest beta, over a year since 8.5 was released I believe, has only a couple improvements to, you guessed it, content management. And a handful of bug fixes, which IMO don't really inspire much confidence. :)
In the last year or so, has DAZ Studio received a lot more development efforts than Carrara, like in the past?
Again, we all agree Carrara is a nice program. But that doesn't mean it will be developed in the future. I was hoping at least they would clean up the dynamic cloth so it will collide with moving objects and stuff like that. That's a pretty big feature to have almost useless for so long. And the list of features that are decades behind the times is pretty long.
Sorry to those who think I'm being negative.
Carrara is fine for my needs. Daz has added over the years things like dynamic hair, bullet physics, 3D paint, multi-pass rendering, etc, etc... , all with wonderful access to Daz content. I haven't even inventoried all. The list is pretty long.
I don't think you're going to get answers. They were always rarely given, and have been increasingly so.
I think that DAZ are clearly working on a new version is a good sign, even if the developments are mainly targeted at content compatibility. If they considered it a dead program, they would not be doing this. It would be great to have further functional developments - and I agree that fixing the dynamic soft body so that it worked fully as a dynamic cloth simulation would be high on my list. But DAZ tend to keep such things close to their chests until they are ready, so you are unlikely to get any sort of official response - even if it would be welcomed.
I am posting late in this topic but I just wanted to put in my 2 cents. I don't know the future of Carrara but I hope it is a bright one. I don't know how many pros are using Carrara but I use it to make a living daily. It would be nice to hear from other Carrara pros. I realize I have said all this before but when I hear some asking if Carrara is worth the investment of time and money admitting I use it as a primary 3D tool professionally is a pretty convincing statement. I have used the big industry standards but I prefer Carrara over them. Carrara is certainly not dead.
This is a book trailer. I modeled the character and shoe in Carrara as well as many of the other props. I also used a lot of Daz stuff and other models. Animating in Carrara is very Intuitive.
http://youtu.be/-goQr5ZQDe4
Another trailer ( I really enjoy doing trailers and teasers). I use video as texture maps a lot.
http://youtu.be/oLxOGq2_6nM
I create a lot of animated videos. These have become our bread and butter.
http://youtu.be/GvywDXNUoPw