Daz Studio 4.9 Beta Now Available..
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Yes Havos. And it's also very interesting that the question of DIM and Zip content has still not been answered. Let's stop beating around the bush and get a direct answer regarding whether or not manual installation will no longer be an option.
Exactly, that is what I would like to know too . With a quote like the below, I just need a clear answer : What about new content ????
Upgrading to 4.9 should work without a hiccup on an offline system. You won't get the per-file updates and the quick metadata refreshes that come with a connected system but you are able to use all current content without logging in.
Tage
These new developments are a bit confusing all right. Like Acanthis said, worlds will be destroyed if people like he and I - myself having manually organized my content for 15 years - either have our folder structures altered or are forced to use Smart Content from here on out. I like using DIM, but I move everything that it installs into logically named folders because it is IMPOSSIBLE to find anything manually otherwise.
Not going to panic or badmouth these new cloud advancements, but I'll definitely hold off on upgrading for a bit.
They have said we can continue to download the zips, but if that is the case, what is the point in encrypting the files if there is a downloadable unencrypted version available aswell? It only makes sense if this now optional DAZ Connect becomes mandatory at some point in the future, and that is very worrying (to me at least).
Presumably, the downloadable zips will include the encrypted files.
So long as I can unzip the files to a folder on my desktop and manually install each component to where I want it to go, like I have for the past 15 years, then I'll have no problem with that.
Greetings,
@Havos - Picture it like this. You can download the content from DAZ in a packaged (pre-encrypted) form. You then point your Daz Connect Local Edition (making up names is fun!) to the downloaded content. It then extracts and installs it in data/cloud (with key content encrypted at rest) like it apparently already is doing. You have those packaged forms, you can save them, burn them to blu-ray, store them in a nuclear-safe vault, and take them out every so often to drool over. When your hard drive explodes in a fiery conflagration, you hook up your brand new 2TB thumb drive (because It's The Future!), pull that sweet, sweet backup out, and put it in, launch Daz Connect Local Edition again, point it to the (still encrypted) packaged forms, and say, 'Abracadabra!' When you finally feel silly saying that, you click the 'Install' button, and it extracts and installs it in data/cloud again...just like it did before.
Now...
The problem...
4.9 is in beta right now. That's a planned feature, but it hasn't been implemented yet. I'm fairly sure they want to get to it before they go gold, because...yeah.
But it's really hard to tell folks, 'It's going to work precisely like *THIS*...' when *THIS* hasn't been coded yet.
...
Similarly the 'You've already got 750GB of Daz Install Manager content installed, and its SHA2 matches, so I'm just going to ask if it's okay to move it to the data/cloud directory, without re-downloading it, so your hard drive doesn't go apoplectic, as well as your ISP'. It's a 'We want to implement this feature. We KNOW we need to implement this feature. We haven't implemented it yet, so we can't tell you exactly how it's going to look yet.'
...
Honestly, though, and I'm sad about this... I don't think I can start using the 4.9 betas until you get the 'Let's not double their storage usage...' feature implemented. I...ah...don't think I have the disk space for it. :(
-- Morgan
connect feature: I don't like this kinda big brother policy in my software. unfortunately, it seems that the whole market is migrating this way. See the adobe, mycrosoft, autodesk etc... you don't buy products anymore, you rent them and they are connected ...
I've read the whole 4.9 page but I can't find info: What are the other new feature of this 4.9 release? (except bug fix)
I believe Rawb's answer here should cover your question: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/comment/933725/#Comment_933725
I believe there are new versions of iRay and 3Delight. iRay has some bug fixes which look as though they relate to some of the problems that I have encountered with Stop-Start rendering leading to a critical system crash.
[EDIT: Unfortunately, as the situation stands, I am not prepared to have 4.9 on my machine - beta or stable - until DAZ Connect has been explained a whole lot better - especially what appears to be the deployment of DRM!]
Steam has been mentioned a few times; here's one of my primary issues with them:
What you get from a system like Steam is like an indefinite rental. You do not own anything. Steam may at any time deny you access to the things you have paid for. You might say this is unlikely to happen -- I honestly don't know how often it does -- but the possibility makes these products very nearly worthless as far as I'm concerned.
I will never "rent" software because such a concept is nonsensical when there is no continued service being provided. (One might argue that these systems are providing services like online storage and such, but those could and should be optional.)
These things only exist because people are ignorant and/or there is no competition. There is absolutely no benefit to the customer in these arrangements. Convenience is often used as an excuse, but there you're just bamboozling the technically challenged customer. Convenience can be implemented without DRM.
Well, there's another good point that you've raised, because along with DRM comes perhaps the greatest evil of all: Remote Expiry! The ability to expire a digital asset remotely and prevent any further access to it. This goes hand in hand with the second evil of DRM: Periodic License Renewal (already a big issue for Poser Pro 2014 GameDev) - where the license to continue using a digital asset has to be periodically renewed or it will become inaccesible.
I suppose with Microsoft and Windows 10 you can possibly argue that they are issuing constant updates and feature enhancements for what will become the monthly operating system rental charge, but a static item of digital content - like a prop?
I have never been tempted by Steam. The whole way in which DRM has been implemented by huge corporations who have no interest in copyright protection, only in obtaining perpetual incomes for nothing (effectively a ransom), is something everybody should be worried about. Now, it hasn't been said that this is coming to DAZ, but now that I think it through, it makes me wonder if the only reason for implementing DAZ Connect is to lay the groundwork for DRM and its many evils (Pay per Use, Remote Expiry, Periodic Renewal, Behavioural Data Scooping etc).
Hopefully, I am wrong.
And one more thing about steam: when there is no net as it happens from time to time here, you can't even use your tools :-( grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
So is it confirmed that new content will still be available for manual download, in zip form?
If so, will that content also be encrypted?
If so, does that mean that the content will no longer be usable in non-Daz apps like Poser?
These are some serious questions that needs answering. Not everyone here use Studio for the content they buy here.
It has been said in this thread by the Daz folks that you will be able to download a zip version of the products you buy so you can have them stored away safely (Now not so sure this will be the case)..
From what I have been reading what Daz Connect will allow is the automatic updating of products as they are released so there is no need for running DIM every time to see if there is an update at least that is what I have come to understand..
But the main thing with 4.9 is the update to version 12+ of 3Delight and a big bug fix and upgrade to Iray and both needed to happen..
Its all a huge disappointment, the 4.8 release introducing iRay was one of my favourites, and most people were cheering when it arrived. 4.9 just comes with a huge disadvantage (imho), the only good things are some render fixes etc, which could have been placed in a 4.8 point release.
Likewise. Although I don't like what else is happening.
Forgive, me this is what Google said, Microsoft said, oh and our governments say in one way or another; Snowdon revelations? I certainly hope its true, and Daz's customer service shows a keen regard for the customer, but I'm dubious.
Finally a reason for me to consider learing Poser - I hate the interface.
I jumped on beta 4.8; I'm going to be beating off 4.9 with a stick.
I've spent a lot (those with access to the data can check) this year; good luck on it being the same - or within sight - next.
How will 4.9 connect deal with manually moved files?
I routinely move all my iray lighting and shader packs out of their default install folders into iray specific folders so that they are not lost among the millions of 3DL packages I have acquired over the years.
I like the idea of an IRay upgrade. :-) One question though, so I won't worry. Can those of us who can't (because we have rural Internet) use constant and unlimited streaming use 4.9? I surely hope so! I'm getting the impression that we can, but I want to ask straight out.
Edit: Just read through some more posts, and I'm getting the idea that the new "connect" features are totally optional? Is that right?
It is optional for now, but "New products will begin to migrate toward a Daz Connect-only delivery."
I ditched Poser to go with Studio, not because it was free but because is seemed like they were heading in a more forward direction. This - to me - seems unessassary. I see DRM in the very near future and as a video game player I'm not a fan of it. I wanted more features - basically bringing what Carrara has to offer in a more updated package. Such as:
1. Render Passes
2. Built in Key frameing (without needing a 3rd party plugin)
3. Particle effects
4. Terrain/cloud generation
But no, we get 'Daz connect' something that people here seem against. I was fine with content managment the way it was - I don't think it needed an update, at least not right now. Give us features that make Studio even more valuable and you will get more customers to by your models, props, ect. Studio has been free for a while, bring in the big guns for rendering like the above mentioned and start charging for it. Keep a free base version for those dabblers with out said updates (like it is now) so it still a good entry level product.
I will monitor this discussion to see where this is going but I might have to go back to Poser if its heading in the direction I fear.
+1
We really need a voteing system.
The way I see it: is that DRM systems are a great way of inconveniencing customers, but much less effective at inconveniencing thieves.
So in other words. It is NOT optional. You WILL use DAZ Connect and DAZ will be in control of everything you do to ensure that their revenue stream continues to grow.
Well, I've got news for DAZ. It IS optional for me. No more DS updates on any of my machines, thank you - and it goes without saying that as all future content will be DRM'd and locked to Studio 4.9's DAZ CONnect engine - no more purchases.
After reading some more and then realizing what I had written in my post I am no longer sure what the hell is happening..
As it seems that any and all Daz Connect content will only be useable in Daz Studio 4.9 and on..
So if you are a Poser user the doors to Daz content will be shut and locked forever by the looks of it.. And with that I forsee a huge backlash coming soon from Daz's customers as they go else where for their 3D content..
And by the looks of it if you are a Poser user your access to Daz content will be forever cut off as Daz Connect content system will not be compatable with Poser..
If you are not just talking amongst yourselves, and you really would like Daz 3D to see your feedback, then you should post in the Official Thread, which is being monitored by Daz 3D
Honestly, I'm not worried about constantly being monitored or invasions of privacy or whatever. Lord knows, with Windows upgrades and having to connect to the Net to use other programs, I've already faced that hurdle and it's not been the demon that it was predicted to be. The only thing I want to make sure of is -- I have to be able to control what's downloaded, or my downloads will excede my allowance. And not all ISPs will allow unlimited downloads.
OK, thanks, Cho. :-) I just ran across this topic this morning, and got a wee bit concerned. I will go post in the official thread.
Do you really think DAZ are at all interested in what their customers have to say? Honestly? If they were then they would have consulted about this evil plan first. No, their mind is made up. It's a familiar story: the dollar is king. The customer is just a pawn trapped on the middle of the board - or in this case trapped at the edges of a very dark rain CLOUD!
"Right now I can click on the product in DIM, hit uninstall, and then hit install, and it all takes a few seconds."
So I tested. I would guess that the servers are as stressed now as they will ever be so times should be fiairly high compared to any other day. I only downloaded because that was what I am doing currently. Summer for v7 too 30 seconds in all. Layton hair took 31 seconds. Arrabella took 8 seconds. Streets of Asia 2 took 22 seconds. I have good internet but not the fastest that ATT offers because our lines in the area are to old for faster so my internet speed is not a major plus compared to much of the rest of the world.
But it is important to remember that DIM is an application dedicated to downloading. DAZ CONnect will be a part of DAZ Studio, hooking into your current scene, looking at what assets you've got, presenting all manner of thumbnails and banners, making suggestions, enforcing DRM licenses and decrypting content. It's not a like for like comparison. Fortunately it is a comparison that I will never have to make.
[EDIT: PLUS there's probably going to be a lot of 256 bit (or better) AES encryption/decryption going on.]
So what you're suggesting is that instead you taking a few seconds to merge this thread with the official one, we all should instead spend quite a lot longer copying our comments from one thread to another.
Goes to show how much you value the opinions of your customers I guess.
Edit: This post of mine was too snippy, I admit. Apologies. I see that merging threads can be problematic.