New clothing still looks like stiff tubes

Male-M3dia

Daywalker Designs said:

retiretomaui said:

Serene Night said:

I agree. The current male releases are amateurish. We have so little male clothing to begin with. When something looks doughy or painted on people don’t buy it and it contributes to the whole men’s stuff doesn’t sell.

Nicely put. I really want more male clothing items. Right now, I'm searching through older M4 items to tru to find what I need, with little luck. What I have found useful is to use the Genesis/M4/V4 clothing items and figures as background fodder.  I render on a nice laptop, but in the end it is a laptop with more limited system resources than a full-on desktop rig. Those older clothing bits are perfect for reducing system resources but I agree that we need far better modern mens' clothing, especially for Genesis 3 males. There are some nice things out there, but not nearly as much given the number of male Gen 3 characters there are. I have a feeling that whomever releases a modern, up to date and accurate set of  sci-fi starship uniforms (and not the battlemech type, a real uniform set) will be earning a whole ton of cash. That's just one idea. I'm sure there are many others.

 

.Accurate and properly fitting = profit.

 

There is a flaw in thinking here. Just because you and others say you will by something isn't enough to encourage PAs to make what you want, because there have been plenty of times where they do it and the ones asking for it the most do not end up buying the product, and they know it.

Yes. I've seen lots of instances where there is a forum request and when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it" 

Wishlisting isn't a sale and you've just wasted the vendor's time when they could have spent the time making something that would have generated sales.

JOdel

Hunting good M4 Items? Here's a one if you are doing anything 19th Century. 

https://www.daz3d.com/wanted-dead-or-alive

Loads of morphs in that coat.  My own primary figure is Genesis 1, but I've used some fairly extreme morphs and have usually managed to make it work.

Serene Night

Some of the old m4 items have a surprising amount of detail. I got a fair amount of use with the veranil set and hardcore m4 even with the... painted on groin image in that one. =) I remember the first time I rendered that and someone commented about it. I had to pull up the textures and yep... 

xyer0

 

Serene Night said:

One area which seems problematic is men’s collars. I don’t know why but this seems a problem area. So much so I wondered if a different clothing prop needs to be made to address it

Tannenbaum at Renderosity used that solution on his SS Uniform: The collar is a separate prop which can be morphed. The tie loads fitted to the top of the collar (like I like it) and not slightly below (as most of the suit attempts here place it). I used it on this image. The textures are high quality as well.

Finlaena said:

xyer0 said:

... and Uzilite (missing in action except on Facebook).

He's actually selling some things on his own Gumroad account now, instead of brokering through Daz or Rendo, fwiw. He's only got two things up on it so far, but they're still the exceptional quality I've come to expect from him.

I've got them, and they are excellent, but I still don't like the collar shape on his M7 reworking of M601. That coat is the bomb, however.

Daywalker Designs said:

xyer0 said:

And yet that's what the vast majority of people wear in real life; not everyone has the time or financial assets to have clothing custom tailored to fit them. Not everyone cares that the legs on their pants are a bit long, or short, nor do they care about that on shirt sleeves.

Yet we don't know for a fact that "high quality" vendors like the ones named actually have significantly higher sales than vendors that don't seem to put in as much effort. I would think that if this was the case, Daz would establish more strict quality rules for what is submitted.

Most people may wear ill-fitting clothes as you say, but in real life, no one wears clothes like the poorly constructed, cartoonish Daz items with tube sleeves and legs that are not form-fitting, and that is the topic. Evidently, Daz has concluded that the more content they put in the store---regardless of quality---the higher their sales will be. Lacking statistics, I cannot vouchsafe that Luthbel's and IHKang's sales figures exceed those of other digital haberdashers, but this thread is about the overall lack of quality in most clothing products at Daz. And I think, at its root, it is a plea to any enterprising modeller with the talent, vision, and spirit of excellence to make those items (while employing the services of a great texture artist, like Shox-Design or Arien, until their own skills reach maturity).

Serene Night said:

here’s the uzilite outfit fit to gen8 male... I really think it looks pretty nice!

 

Exquisite! Thanks for the render!

Daywalker Designs

xyer0 said:

Most people may wear ill-fitting clothes as you say, but in real life, no one wears clothes like the poorly constructed, cartoonish Daz items with tube sleeves and legs that are not form-fitting, and that is the topic. Evidently, Daz has concluded that the more content they put in the store---regardless of quality---the higher their sales will be. Lacking statistics, I cannot vouchsafe that Luthbel's and IHKang's sales figures exceed those of other digital haberdashers, but this thread is about the overall lack of quality in most clothing products at Daz. And I think, at its root, it is a plea to any enterprising modeller with the talent, vision, and spirit of excellence to make those items (while employing the services of a great texture artist, like Shox-Design or Arien, until their own skills reach maturity).

I'll grant you that some clothing, by its very nature and intended purpose, is going to be form fitting but not everything will be along the entire length of every square centimeter. Pant legs and shirt sleeves are an excellent example of these things, in my opinion. And yes, I agree that outfits that have the back wedged in the guy's crevasse or flat against the groin need work. Heck, I even pull fabric out of or away from those places on content I make for female characters.

agent unawares

Male-M3dia said:

Daywalker Designs said:

retiretomaui said:

Serene Night said:

I agree. The current male releases are amateurish. We have so little male clothing to begin with. When something looks doughy or painted on people don’t buy it and it contributes to the whole men’s stuff doesn’t sell.

Nicely put. I really want more male clothing items. Right now, I'm searching through older M4 items to tru to find what I need, with little luck. What I have found useful is to use the Genesis/M4/V4 clothing items and figures as background fodder.  I render on a nice laptop, but in the end it is a laptop with more limited system resources than a full-on desktop rig. Those older clothing bits are perfect for reducing system resources but I agree that we need far better modern mens' clothing, especially for Genesis 3 males. There are some nice things out there, but not nearly as much given the number of male Gen 3 characters there are. I have a feeling that whomever releases a modern, up to date and accurate set of  sci-fi starship uniforms (and not the battlemech type, a real uniform set) will be earning a whole ton of cash. That's just one idea. I'm sure there are many others.

 

.Accurate and properly fitting = profit.

 

There is a flaw in thinking here. Just because you and others say you will by something isn't enough to encourage PAs to make what you want, because there have been plenty of times where they do it and the ones asking for it the most do not end up buying the product, and they know it.

Yes. I've seen lots of instances where there is a forum request and when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it" 

Wishlisting isn't a sale and you've just wasted the vendor's time when they could have spent the time making something that would have generated sales.

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

Daywalker Designs

agent unawares said:

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

And if twenty or thirty others do it too? What then?

agent unawares

Daywalker Designs said:

agent unawares said:

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

And if twenty or thirty others do it too? What then?

Then the vendor didn't gauge the market for what they produced correctly. M3D addressed single individuals who had the audacity not to purchase an item after asking for a similar item.

There are people who post here that buy content they aren't sure they'll use just to encourage the production of similar content. Is the vendor supposed to feel guilty in this case?

Daywalker Designs

agent unawares said:

Daywalker Designs said:

agent unawares said:

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

And if twenty or thirty others do it too? What then?

Then the vendor didn't gauge the market for what they produced correctly. M3D addressed single individuals who had the audacity not to purchase an item after asking for a similar item.

He's not the only PA that I've talked to that has that complaint. Why do you think so many PAs that sell here have little to nothing to do with the forums?

agent unawares said:

There are people who post here that buy content they aren't sure they'll use just to encourage the production of similar content. Is the vendor supposed to feel guilty in this case?

As I said above, a lot of PAs don't spend time in the forums, so they have no clue if the sale was one from a person that would actually use the item, or if it's a person trying to influence sales to benefit the PAs and DAZ.

agent unawares

Daywalker Designs said:

agent unawares said:

Daywalker Designs said:

agent unawares said:

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

And if twenty or thirty others do it too? What then?

Then the vendor didn't gauge the market for what they produced correctly. M3D addressed single individuals who had the audacity not to purchase an item after asking for a similar item.

He's not the only PA that I've talked to that has that complaint. Why do you think so many PAs that sell here have little to nothing to do with the forums?

agent unawares said:

There are people who post here that buy content they aren't sure they'll use just to encourage the production of similar content. Is the vendor supposed to feel guilty in this case?

As I said above, a lot of PAs don't spend time in the forums, so they have no clue if the sale was one from a person that would actually use the item, or if it's a person trying to influence sales to benefit the PAs and DAZ.

What does this have to do with my or M3D's comments?

One customer having the audacity to wishlist an item similar to one they've expressed interest in is not "wasting the vendor's time." Stating such is wildly inappropriate, bizarrely entitled and insecure guilt-tripping.

Serene Night

I don't presume to know what the majority of pa's who sell here think about the forums and their reasons for participating or not participating in the forums is their business... I think we are diverging into the realm of speculation here...

 

 

Petercat

I can't speak for a vendor's thoughts either, only for my own.
Part of what weighs in my decision to buy is if the artist visits
the forums, interacts with the customers in a positive way, and
is just a genuinely nice person.
And I'll back it up with an example:
I go out of my way to purchase everything that MaClean offers,
even though I might not need it at the moment - sooner or
later, I will, and MaClean is a very nice, positive artist.

Griffin Avid

The simple rule is to be here- and act like you're a business entity. Be polite, helpful and supportive.

That's the simple part.

The factual part is google search results, which is ALWAYS the forum, and not always (I could probably get away with rarely) the official thread.

So threads about your products are the basic review that people use.

I search or start threads about products that are missing an official thread. So, if the vendor is not interested or too busy then 'others' get to decide the spin on your product's value.-->  And can lob things with no one there to dive on the grenade. Peer to peer reviews is still king and an active vendor can help steer them.

Not to mention names, but there certain vendors...I call... stubborn. They do not heed common sense advice about their products. They still make stuff with

- Zero to scant descriptions

- No pdfs or support documentation.

-No Official thread to get feedback and gauge interest.

-Very few and some poorly done promo shots.

In that moment, I act like a business mind too and be polite, but don't buy the stuff. No need to make a scene or argue. I/we always have choices.

I speak with my wallet mostly. But I heap praise where I feel it's warranted and no matter how big a jerk I might think a vendor is, I buy what I need regardless.

My own customers/readers/friends/etc don't care that somebody up stream was rude (or wasn't the MOST POLITE PERSON EVER) on some forum. lol

Butch

"Basic Wear" for G3M and G8M always makes me smile and marvel at the quality of "Daz Original".

Male-M3dia

agent unawares said:

Male-M3dia said:

Daywalker Designs said:

retiretomaui said:

Serene Night said:

I agree. The current male releases are amateurish. We have so little male clothing to begin with. When something looks doughy or painted on people don’t buy it and it contributes to the whole men’s stuff doesn’t sell.

Nicely put. I really want more male clothing items. Right now, I'm searching through older M4 items to tru to find what I need, with little luck. What I have found useful is to use the Genesis/M4/V4 clothing items and figures as background fodder.  I render on a nice laptop, but in the end it is a laptop with more limited system resources than a full-on desktop rig. Those older clothing bits are perfect for reducing system resources but I agree that we need far better modern mens' clothing, especially for Genesis 3 males. There are some nice things out there, but not nearly as much given the number of male Gen 3 characters there are. I have a feeling that whomever releases a modern, up to date and accurate set of  sci-fi starship uniforms (and not the battlemech type, a real uniform set) will be earning a whole ton of cash. That's just one idea. I'm sure there are many others.

 

.Accurate and properly fitting = profit.

 

There is a flaw in thinking here. Just because you and others say you will by something isn't enough to encourage PAs to make what you want, because there have been plenty of times where they do it and the ones asking for it the most do not end up buying the product, and they know it.

Yes. I've seen lots of instances where there is a forum request and when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it" 

Wishlisting isn't a sale and you've just wasted the vendor's time when they could have spent the time making something that would have generated sales.

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

This isn't stated as a guilt trip, only fact and needs to be realized when requesting something. Vendors can not pay bills with wish lists, it is not a sale, and it means nothing to them when people state that they done it. It isn't a sale, nor is it a promise to buy. So vendors will concentrate on things that people will buy upon release and will sell. But if people wonder why things aren't made from only forum requests, this is one of the reasons. Vendors aren't going to take risks on something that won't sell right away to recoup their investment when they have bills to pay. So when you tell a vendor you've put something on a wishlist, knowing that items stay on wish lists for years, it actually means nothing because it has a net value of $0.

Male-M3dia

agent unawares said:

Daywalker Designs said:

agent unawares said:

Where are you going with this guilt trip? Vendors do not make items hoping to sell to one single person.

Sometimes when people who request a type of item "wishlist" it, it's because the produced item did not live up to expectations. Example: I buy the vast majority of male content, eye texture content, and skin shader presets that get produced and I'll always nudge people to produce more. But, morphs copied to G8M from a G3M product I own (that aren't merchant resources), skins that look nearly identical to others from the same vendor down to the same glaring mistakes, characters without separate head and body morphs, "realistic" eyes that look like cartoons, "realistic" skin shaders that look like plastic? All this stuff gets "wishlisted."

And if twenty or thirty others do it too? What then?

Then the vendor didn't gauge the market for what they produced correctly. M3D addressed single individuals who had the audacity not to purchase an item after asking for a similar item.

There are people who post here that buy content they aren't sure they'll use just to encourage the production of similar content. Is the vendor supposed to feel guilty in this case?

I didn't address single individuals, this goes for forum requests that have been requested by multiple people as well. Forum requests aren't a guage of the actual buying population, so generally a new vendor is the one that learns this lesson of taking fourm advice and losing money on an item. But this point has been said repeatly over the years these forums have been in existence. This is why vendors are able to actually see their sales via reports to guage interest and we can ask other vendors what their experience is.

Stating wishlists are not sales isn't an inappropriate thing to say; it is merely fact and it's something that isn't tangible to vendors.

Daywalker Designs

avxp said:

The simple rule is to be here- and act like you're a business entity. Be polite, helpful and supportive.

That's the simple part.

The factual part is google search results, which is ALWAYS the forum, and not always (I could probably get away with rarely) the official thread.

So threads about your products are the basic review that people use.

I search or start threads about products that are missing an official thread. So, if the vendor is not interested or too busy then 'others' get to decide the spin on your product's value.-->  And can lob things with no one there to dive on the grenade. Peer to peer reviews is still king and an active vendor can help steer them.

Not to mention names, but there certain vendors...I call... stubborn. They do not heed common sense advice about their products. They still make stuff with

- Zero to scant descriptions

- No pdfs or support documentation.

-No Official thread to get feedback and gauge interest.

-Very few and some poorly done promo shots.

In that moment, I act like a business mind too and be polite, but don't buy the stuff. No need to make a scene or argue. I/we always have choices.

I speak with my wallet mostly. But I heap praise where I feel it's warranted and no matter how big a jerk I might think a vendor is, I buy what I need regardless.

My own customers/readers/friends/etc don't care that somebody up stream was rude (or wasn't the MOST POLITE PERSON EVER) on some forum. lol

A couple of points to ponder:

1: Not all PAs have English as a first language, so sometimes communication is difficult for them. This may be at least part of the reason some don't interact more here, or provide adequate information on products sold here.

2: Past experiences on forums may have gone pear-shaped and they simply do not want to deal with what amounts to a "toxic fandom" in their opinion.

3: Promo images can be subjective; what one person, including the folks that decide to accept a product for sale, finds acceptable may not be to another person's liking.

frank0314

PA's posting commercial threads does not equate to extra sales so some don't waste their time with it. A lot of PA's do however post threads to get feedback. Opinions and feedback can also be subjective and you can't please everyone. A PA will consider what is being said and determine if it will benefit a particular pack. It's a win lose situation as far as starting a commercial thread.

Serene Night

The original topic is still interesting to me. I’m not entering into the men’s content doesn’t sell Discussion as that frankly goes nowhere.

Will we get dforce-ready men’s outfits sold here and will pro bundles start using this technology? Pro bundles really are the best opportunity for those who want men’s content to get it since pickings have been pretty slim for gen 8 male since the release of Lucas.

I am hoping with the release of Darius that we will see some new clothing.... 

 

 

Daywalker Designs

Serene Night said:

Will we get dforce-ready men’s outfits sold here and will pro bundles start using this technology? Pro bundles really are the best opportunity for those who want men’s content to get it since pickings have been pretty slim for gen 8 male since the release of Lucas.

Honestly, it's going to depend on the PAs, as it always does.

Griffin Avid

Not all PAs have English as a first language

I never considered that. Good point!

But, if your primary store is selling to english-speaking customers, have Daz translate or google translate or ask a friend to write the description..

Promo images can be subjective

I don't mean "How good it looks" or cool a "render is that?!" I mean the technical point of a promo image.

And I think these are universally accepted guidelines for everything in the universe. lol

stuff like Multiple angles.

How about finished renders? And if there's an excuse like - I didn't have time! Before a submission deadline. You can always redo and update the promo art.

Simple rules- like if you're selling an outfit, do NOT include bits of other outfits in your promo.- even if it's listed on the bottom.

Or isolate EXACTLY what is for sale.

I learned this week that I now have to search the other products to see what the vendor made and what they made that's not included.

--------

 

 

Daywalker Designs

avxp said:

 

How about finished renders? And if there's an excuse like - I didn't have time! Before a submission deadline. You can always redo and update the promo art.

Do you mean the grey textureless images include in clothing promo image by any chance? If so, those are required. If not, again, what you consider complete may not be the same as what DAZ does, since they are the ones that actually pick what gets used, and they sometimes do ask for different ones to be done.

agent unawares

Male-M3dia said:

I didn't address single individuals

"when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it"

That's a very clear reference to a single person.

 

Male-M3dia said:

This isn't stated as a guilt trip

"you've just wasted the vendor's time" is a guilt trip. No one has wasted a vendor's time by not buying something. Ever. Period. If anyone creates a product relying on one person to buy it they should be doing it as commission.

 

Male-M3dia said:

So when you tell a vendor you've put something on a wishlist, knowing that items stay on wish lists for years, it actually means nothing because it has a net value of $0.

Yes, it's completely reasonable to say wishlisting means nothing. It's just a compliment. This is not the sentiment I took issue with.

Griffin Avid

Do you mean the grey textureless images include in clothing promo image by any chance? 

Oh no, those are the AWESOME. It let's you know what's what. MORE of those!

I mean a render that needed more iterations.

But who cares? This still the complaint thread? lol

Every so often a B. and Moan fest is needed.

Male-M3dia

agent unawares said:

Male-M3dia said:

I didn't address single individuals

"when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it"

That's a very clear reference to a single peurson.

 

Male-M3dia said:

This isn't stated as a guilt trip

"you've just wasted the vendor's time" is a guilt trip. No one has wasted a vendor's time by not buying something. Ever. Period. If anyone creates a product relying on one person to buy it they should be doing it as commission.

 

Male-M3dia said:

So when you tell a vendor you've put something on a wishlist, knowing that items stay on wish lists for years, it actually means nothing because it has a net value of $0.

Yes, it's completely reasonable to say wishlisting means nothing. It's just a compliment. This is not the sentiment I took issue with.

I'm sure you want to argue the point but when I say something,  I said what I said. Wish listing means nothing; it merely says a person didn't like a product enough to buy it, which can't be considered a compliment. It is what it is..

Now let's move on.

Serene Night

Daywalker Designs said:

Serene Night said:

Honestly, it's going to depend on the PAs, as it always does.

Perhaps, athough I expect it will become the standard eventually for certain types of clothing.

agent unawares

Male-M3dia said:

agent unawares said:

Male-M3dia said:

I didn't address single individuals

"when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it"

That's a very clear reference to a single peurson.

 

Male-M3dia said:

This isn't stated as a guilt trip

"you've just wasted the vendor's time" is a guilt trip. No one has wasted a vendor's time by not buying something. Ever. Period. If anyone creates a product relying on one person to buy it they should be doing it as commission.

 

Male-M3dia said:

So when you tell a vendor you've put something on a wishlist, knowing that items stay on wish lists for years, it actually means nothing because it has a net value of $0.

Yes, it's completely reasonable to say wishlisting means nothing. It's just a compliment. This is not the sentiment I took issue with.

I'm sure you want to argue the point but when I say something,  I said what I said.

You sure did. You told people that not buying something was wasting a vendor's time. That's incorrect guilt-tripping nonsense. I'm not sure what point you think I'm arguing.

Leana

agent unawares said:

Male-M3dia said:

agent unawares said:

Male-M3dia said:

I didn't address single individuals

"when the item is made, the person requesting it posts, "Thanks, I've wishlisted it"

That's a very clear reference to a single peurson.

 

Male-M3dia said:

This isn't stated as a guilt trip

"you've just wasted the vendor's time" is a guilt trip. No one has wasted a vendor's time by not buying something. Ever. Period. If anyone creates a product relying on one person to buy it they should be doing it as commission.

 

Male-M3dia said:

So when you tell a vendor you've put something on a wishlist, knowing that items stay on wish lists for years, it actually means nothing because it has a net value of $0.

Yes, it's completely reasonable to say wishlisting means nothing. It's just a compliment. This is not the sentiment I took issue with.

I'm sure you want to argue the point but when I say something,  I said what I said.

You sure did. You told people that not buying something was wasting a vendor's time. That's incorrect guilt-tripping nonsense. I'm not sure what point you think I'm arguing.

No, he said that when you ask a vendor to create something and then don't buy it when it's done you are wasting a vendor's time, as the vendor did something on your request and got nothing from you in return. Of course the vendor certainly didn't expect to sell it to you only, and hopefully other buyers might make up for the time invested (or not).

That's why a lot of vendors won't create items based on requests.

Griffin Avid

Ya'll don't want to just agree to disagree.

Besides that, I need help. 

BTW, I thought, for sure, G8 could wear old clothes.

WOW!

She cannot.

How can V8 be touted as the most backwards compatible- when poses and clothing from any previous generation doesn't work?

What am I doing wrong?

Serene Night

I was disappointed with autofit which was touted as one of the pluses of Genesis 8. Autofit is pretty awful.

You can use sy’s Tutorial to fit the clothing to gen 8. But it is cumbersome to do those steps over and over. I’d honestly prefer it just work as we were told it would.