New clothing still looks like stiff tubes
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I was disappointed with autofit which was touted as one of the pluses of Genesis 8. Autofit is pretty awful.
Yes, very shocked to buy my first figure and ONLY have the new clothes available. I guess she won't be on my Christmas card afterall. Shucks.
I saw that thread and thanks, but I'm not jumping through hoops. That's why (yep I'm saying oit for the 30th time) I can't believe a new generation was released with Zero legacy support morphs or products available.
Major mistep and it should have been a HUGE BUNDLE.
I can make her big toe bigger, but she can't wear shoes.
Shoes, outfits, legacy poses- conversions- all of that together in a massive spending spree.
I shouldn't even feel a bump when a new generation arrives. It should just feel like a wrinke of improved renders. lol
Thank you, Leana. No vendor just sells to one person. That would be called a **commission** or a **freebie** and done a different way. Not sure why this was even argued like this.
What do you mean she cannot? G8 includes autofit clones for all previous versions of Genesis, so you can convert clothes. Of course as usual autofit results vary depending on the clothes.
Probably because they don't want to believe that PAs may have access to tools that can tell them who bought something and who just wishlisted the item to buy at some future time.
Autofit contains one very important syllable: fit. if it doesn't fit without major work, that's not autofit at all. It's just an inferior substitute. Nothing which gains my approval in the form of buying.
We don't have wishlisting reports. As I said, wishlisting means nothing to a vendor.
Another thing about announcing wishlisting is that it's unnecessary.
If you say it to compliment someone... skip it. Just say 'good job this looks awesome!' and leave it at that.
Because if you start launching into your money woes and so on, you've made a compliment about someone into a conversation about yourself.
And I've totally been there. I've had lots of dry months where something I've been hotly anticipated got released and been going .... aaarrgh! I used to say 'into my wishlist!'
But after a lot of reflection.... yeah, I've stopped. Just keep to 'this is awesome'
Really? we're not allowed to say something is going onto the wishlist now for fear of sounding self-interested? That's getting a bit much and making a broad generalization about the motives of others don't you think?
I wouldn't go that far; but telling a PA that you've wishlisting something is not something that we can use for sales information or data. That's information only a customer can use to keep track of something they may want to buy at a later date.
Well saying wishlists means nothing is nonsense. I am sure I am not the only one that shops off a wishlish that I create as new items I notice either are released as new items or are made visible through a sale or a search of mine.
I don't see any harm in announcing you've wishlished a vendor's item or like their item even if you have no intention of buying the item. We can't buy most things that are beautiful at DAZ or in the real world but where are we when all our social interactions are strictly business?
In 2 years time I have added almost 3000 items (although because I download Poser and DAZ legacy items and get most freebies I guess I have only bought about 1500 items) from a 'wishlist that means nothing' and so apparently must earn PAs nothing too.
All these catalogue sales a few PAs say they depend on to make a living do you reckon people just go through the DAZ Store search function everytime they buy something? I sure as heck don't.
About 90% or more of what I buy comes off a wishlist and that percentage will grow; however I don't choose items to support a PA or DAZ, I simply buy what I want.
Anyway, on to the thread topic - autofit is awful on Gernesis 8. Even the NYPD police uniform for Genesis 3 doesn't fit G8M. And clothing from V4 and M4 on G3 or G8? Awful. The arms don't fit worst of all as they don't even follow the arms good enough to cover any of the forearms or wrists. I've got all the 'Wear Them All' products but maybe that is part of the problem.
I bought lots of outfits and autofit doesn't work on G3F/G3M and G8F/G8M that well at all. I guess the only reasonable solution will be to make a chain of fits to G8F/G8M manually from V3/M3 - V4/M4 - Genesis - G2F/G2M - G3F/G3M - G8F/G8M and save as clothing presets or save as an asset once I get the fits correct. Or do that SickleYield tutorial and use the transfer tool. I am hoping that the above gets improved and combined with dForce will make usable the sizeable and growing inventory of clothing I have bought from my wishlist although the amount of modeling work needed to get old clothing to work with dForce means the 'price was right' for most of the old clothing on sale or in the PC. It seems to me that if the transfer tool works correctly shouldn't autofit fit just take the previously rigged item chosen and use the same transfer tool logic to autofit the item? Anyway...I need to do the SY tutorial to see if that method will be better than 'autofit'...or autofitting a chain of generations to reach the current generation.
I am actually kind of surprised at how bad autofit is, especially with how similar g8 and gen 3 are. Particularly clothing I’ve noted made in marvelous designer. Even with sickleyields tutorial some of those outfits don’t work. I think they should stop advertising gen 8 as being especially backwards compatible.
I didn't say wishlists doesn't mean anything. I said it means nothing to a PA. It's good that you find value in it; a PA simply can't use it to pay a light bill. If you can tell us how it can, I'm sure PAs would change their minds on it.
Until then, let's move on.
I said nothing about motive. I'm saying I've been there and I understand the good intentions of saying you wishlisted something.
And in the interests of helping people convey their good will, I'm saying talking about wishlists doesn't do a good job conveying that.
Thanks for that info on the Sickleyield tutorial. Seems some clothing will work, and it does always seem to be a clothing I want to use, then only if it is modeified via manual modeling and rigging somehow then.
I will be glad when dForce clothing is mature and has a big and varied catalogue. There is already a quite nice backlog of female dForce compatible clothing I have wishlisted and can't afford yet.
I find it frustrating that autofit by its nature is not very smart especially with the bad selection of content for men.
@Oso3d actually you did when you stated people made wishlisting comments and launched into explanations made it about them.
I actually really want to avoid the customer shaming subtext in this thread though and get back to the subject at hand.
To be honest, I find it interesting that people are upset over the thought of customer shaming in a thread made to shame vendors. I mean the title "New clothing still looks like stiff tubes" is nothing near flattering. Just stating the obvious.
Customer Shaming? Lol
Where's Rich? This thread needs to be closed already.
We got the point. Lots of new clothing items are not keeping pace with the figure detail- or hoped-for-standard- or whatever.
Okay. Fisty and Darc and SWAM and FSWNBA - all those vendors are probably hunched over their work benches making some terrific V8 items.
Possible --> V8's weird launch schedule (as I've mentioned numerous times) seems to have pushed some vendors past their limits in regard to getting their proudtcs to their stellar level.
See, we're playing nice now.
This is business and this forum is Dasz's business so they keep it civil and polite.
You are both right. Wishlisting is not a sale.
It's not even a promise of a sale.
I think it means you have loose plans to buy it in the future.
That future could be next paycheck, this Friday, the next time the vendor goes on sale, a tax return, a settlement from the insurance company, x-mas, stash of coins in the couch/whatever.
Meaningless? No, it's a sentiment like "have a good day".
Meaningful?- depends on the reality behind and after the gesture.
---------------- Minus a true rating system and a way to contact vendors (DIRECTLY FROM THEIR STORE PAGES
- these forums are the FEEDBACK.
This is peer to peer reviews at its best.
You can't mention names or post pictures so you/me/us is left with Vague Opinions about a general curve.
And so EVERY vendor that makes clothes *should read this and ask themselves "They mean me?"
If so, step it up, if not giggle and keep cranking out your wonderful creations.
All this does is serve notice that the small details do matter to some, to many to a portion of the customer base.
There's even a possibility Daz is letting it go because it does serve a purpose.
Well the truth of the matter is a vendor is a business. They shouldn't take requests to improve their products as an insult but as a natural human instinct to search for more pleasant ways to do things that benefit everybody, customers and non-customers alike. The nature of a business is to listen to complaints and try and improve their products upon investigating the complaints.
I am satisfied DAZ 3D is doing that but that doesn't mean they are perfect and should expect customers to request more improvements. DAZ 3D has made a major marketing shift almost unnoticed by most graphic novel and fashion renderer hobbyists and that is to sell game licenses and those game license have now become with their new individual games license model more in tune with the rest of the game market for 3D models, not that there is that much competition, and in fact are expensive for what is the truth of the 'gold rush' that is 'indie game development' that is almost 100% speculation. Why gold prospectors in Alaska had better chance of riches in days of yore but that is not reason that DAZ 3D can't ask what the market will bear. With the additional customer expense of the game market licenses comes the expectation of improved quality and usability. For those that say but it's still a bargain even if it's broken. Well how often do you go to the store and buy a discounted box of broken light bulbs? That's essentially the same as this autofit not autofitting clothing as advertised.
Now I know Male-Media makes high quality model morphs, at least for the one model I bought, but I haven't used all the morphs in that model so can't speak to the totality of the that model's morph quality with surety (G3M Jesse) but as a business Male-Media should expect complaints for others that possibly have encountered quality issues. It's not an insult to speak to lack of quality in a product and you better believe that's how I found and fixed some mistakes I have made as a programmer.
It's pretty easy when somebody is giving an honest appraisal of the products vs just insulting for some sort of weird jealous schadenfreude motive. I or SereneNight aren't doing a directed at Bill Gates/Microsoft type insult fest.
This was a nice way of putting it @avxp , in my opinion from a customer's point of view - well said. And I just want to point out that wishlisting [for me personally] is a large indicator of a sale - I usually buy what I wishlist, and wishlisting might just mean I don't have the funds that day but will buy it next time I do. Like someone else pointed out, it equates differently for different people, but in my case - in does actually mean a sale. Anyways, sorry for adding another post to this thread... :) Ultimately like avxp said, this thread was about customer feedback - and doesn't bash any vendors or products in particular, but a view about a trend in several recent releases (at least from some people's perspective).
I agree that autofit is not the one-click solution it was touted to be. Myself and some others have gotten varying degrees of success creating V4/M4 clones using this tutorial in the Freebies section to fit those clothes to G8. @nonesuch00, you might want to look at it if you haven't already.
I guess here's the thing: at the end of the day, the market will decide these things, not forum posts. Also realize, and I've touched on this long ago, when it comes to some items, especially men's clothing there is a learning curve on making them and there are new vendors coming into the market probably just 2 or 3 steps beyond a power user on making items. I've said it takes a while for these vendors to learn how to do it and to try to support them as there are benefits to keeping them motivated and learning to make items better. However, to be honest, threads like these are ultimately not productive, especially when people proclaim they're not going to buy items.. all you're going to do is make them move on.. (or back to making familiar items) and then there will be the threads asking "why don't we have certain types of content".
And I'm sure some think they're being productive, but then this is why a lot of vendors don't even bother visiting the forums. Negativity ultimately doesn't motivate and life is too short to bemoan the state of something that you may not be able to change. I look at content as a starting point to get where i need to go, and that's why I have tools to get the mesh where I want it to. If i had such feelings about the state of how content is, I would simply move on to something else that will make me happy and content with what I do with my time. That's sound advice for anyone that finds themselves in that position.
Time to be productive and find a good lunch.
Thanks!
This is my exact point. You weren't talking about commissions or freebies, you were talking about store items pitched to everyone not made for one individual customer, hence no individual customer has "wasted your time" by not buying something.
If a person commissions you to make an item, you create it to their specifications, and then they don't pay you, they've wasted your time (and breached contract).
If a person mentions they like a specific type of item, you create a similar type of item based on your own personal specifications, and they wishlist it, they have not wasted your time. You are not entitled to sales.
Simple.
The percentage of people buying once wishlisted is quite low over time if not bought within xx amount of time.
This is truth. That's how I wound up with MD, so much more relaxing than fighting with conforming clothes and ultimately cheaper.
the Store could use the wishlist a bit better. Such as reminding people when items go on sale that are in people’s wishlist. Yes I know there are apps but many don’t use those. Stagnancy of the wishlist might improve then but who knows
my present wishlist is small. It is mostly limited to items which I may buy on sale because I want perhaps something in the set... for example fins in the scuba set. Since the current sets are all mostly female or older I am going to wait until the clothing is offered on sale. Since I really don’t want anything else from the set.
I don’t see the equivalency. Clothing props aren’t people. They are items vended for sale.
So we had confirmation that the wishlist is often the 1st stop for a product before it is bought. That's very significant to a marketing strategy and marketing analysis.
It's only after a sufficient time does the probability of purchase decrease significantly and that has more to do with antiquated technology or nearly identical new versions of wishlisted models that use newer technology.
My DAZ 3D wishlist gets used as well as my Amazon wishlist and other wishlists. When something falls off or is ignored in a wishlist it's because of improved tech usually and often because a competitor offered a better product at a cheaper price or it was available at another store. I have hardly any faddish sort of products on my wishlists and I have learned to shop around although I'm not the shopping type. And let's face it, there are other hobbies besides DAZ 3D that can compete for discretionary income of potential customers. I often spend money on those too.
Again, all we have is confirmation that a couple of people use it that way. Daz 3D would know whether that's common -- from what I hear, it appears that in aggregate, wishlisting seldom leads to sales, at least in a time period/quantity/price that contributes significantly to a product's success.
That's not what was said earlier. A more general statement was made that only regarded a low percentage of people now buying a wishlisted item is low after passage of delta time which implies if the time delta is a short enough time span then quite a bit of what gets wishlisted gets bought. If only a couple of people buys a wishlisted item after a X days and only a couple of people buy the same wishlisted item after X+1+infinity days then that statement Frank made makes no sense.