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First of all I appreciate the PA's that have tried to explain what they know and can tell without getting in trouble with DAZ. I am now more confident that Genesis 2 is not going to replace Genesis and that this is another case of bad name choice by DAZ. I will continue to purchase Genesis ( I refuse to call it Genesis 1, I am a cranky old fart after all) and have nearly $400 worth in my wishlist. I hope there will be an update to G2F to fix one major oversight and one minor. Major oversight is that there still isn't separate left and right eye surface which is odd as the head morph pack has several asymmetrical left right morphs (as does the body pack). Minor oversight is the new toes only have one joint instead of two, if you are going to the trouble to rig the toes do it right not half right.
Is it just me, or does anyone else think that G2 should have come with the ability to accept V4 Textures and the ability to auto-fit V4 items. And to keep the Gens in the Pro package once again is insulting. I have no interest in the other Pro package items. A complete figure is all I care about. I should note that I do appreciate that we at least get the base free. Limited as it is.
Is it just me or is there a touch of the Mikis to Victoria 6?:-)
You could just use one of the G4 models there's no rule that you have to use Genesis.
My main hope is that this won't be the end of Genesis 1 support. We may have to rely on Rendo to keep providing the good stuff from that point of view.
No it is not just you. As I think about it more clearly, I think I understand what is happening here. Genesis came with the ability to accept V4 textures and auto-fit, one generation back. G2F comes with the ability to accept V5 textures and auto-fit, one generation back. From DAZ marketing's perceptive they are equivalent. From our perspective they are not, for several reasons:
When Genesis first came out, there was no V5 UV. V4 was the UV of Genesis for a long time. Most of the Genesis textures were based on the V4 UV. Brand new Genesis characters are made based on the V4 UV. The fact that G2F does not accept V4 textures out of the box stinks.
Also, I look at G2F as a sideways step, rather than a forward step. I think others do too. If that is our perception, then we would expect G2F to be compatible with all that Genesis is.
There is also the short amount of time between the release Genesis and G2F and the fact that many of us did not on board with Genesis until DAZ Studio 4.0 Pro was offered free.
So, DAZ and many of their customers have got a very different view of what is fair and consistent with past practices.
This customer's perception is that G2F was ill conceived from a marketing standpoint and it's release was unnecessarily rushed. I do not mean to say that G2F is flawed, just the way that it has been packaged and released. I do not believe that DAZ understood their customer's point of view, nor do I think they understand it now.
Keep in mind that DAZ has made no comments since releasing G2F. All comments on the DAZ side have been by moderators and PAs. So don't blame DAZ for anything that has been said.
On the other hand, it would be good for DAZ to come out and say something, because, "you don't have to use G2F and buy V6," or, "you still have Genesis," has not been helpful.
So far as I have been able to gather, the reason for G2F and the "gender split" is because PA's can have an easier time creating "Gender Specific Content". While I understand that and can sympathize, I also think it was completely unnecessary. Genesis IS a revolutionary design that's still a bit too young to be replaced so soon. Plus, it can do a whole lot of stuff G2F/V6 can't do and regardless of how much more G2F/V6 and the 6th generation advance, they won't ever match the versatility of Genesis and it's usefulness. One sideways step and two steps backwards IMO.
I don't think DAZ or most of the PA's thought of the broader community here. They just did what they wanted to do when they should have asked us what WE wanted for Genesis 2/Generation 6.
While it's not impossible to use 4th Generation textures on G2F, it's considerably harder (and unnecessarily so). Plus we do have the V4 shape in the store. With Dimension Theory's GenX (he's gonna update it) we'll be able to transfer our favorite morphs. And hopefully, we'll be able to transfer more textures as time goes on. That remains to be seen. Because if we can't, G2F/V6 has already lost a LOT of it's appeal to me and I likely won't upgrade for a LONG time. At least until I'm forced to.
Poser users finally got Genesis, but even that has come with some problems. Fact is, they wanted Genesis in Poser and they got it. I hope that the community is disgruntled enough so that DAZ will realize their new "strategy" is not working and they merge G2F with G2M into one and TRULY make a Genesis 2.
Sorry PA's. I want my Genesis, not a gender split.
But if we buy an add on, it can.
I'm not fond of the reversal of format, but I bought V6 and the morph bundle. anyway. G2 , the new morphs and V6 are nice to have as new characters, but I'm not particularly interested in getting other version 6s of characters I just bought version 5s any time soon.
As I was checking out the new figure, I was very happy to see a feature that I always WISHED Genesis had. When you move a character slider, it only changes the body. To change the head, you move the head slider. Finally. Thank you!
The PAs don't make these choices. Feedback from customers and PAs, both, do but in the end DAZ3D ultimately decides which way to go or what is working or what isn't or what could be improved. Some changes in this case will help in content creation which means more/better content for the customers but the PAs don't design the figures. Lots of information etc is gathered by DAZ3D from complaints, support tickets, issues that arise in the forums, and THAT is what dictates the changes for the next generation figure what it is. The customers aren't directly asked as it usually doesn't go well since everyone's needs will be different but what they say, the issues they find, etc are very much a factor.
OOOOH now that is something I didn't even know and am with you on being VERY happy about! :)
Yes, I just noticed there is a slider for just the body OR the whole character. Nice
Well I've read through this and other threads on the Genesis2,I downloaded the Starter Essentials ,and played a bit with just the Genesis base female ,my budget is too tight to purchase anything yet .....
I really like the way expressions work on G2 ,they definitely look better then G1,I like the jaw bone the ability to move the jaw side to side or up and down ,I am confused however about the shapes under mouth ........cause none of them actually move the mesh to follow the jaw so while I can move the lower jaw forward ,if I'm not careful it just comes through the skin .......so I don't understand that .......
But anyway this is G1 and g2 with the same expression ....and they are both confused about the mouth thing tooo
Been gone a while due to business, and now we have a new Genesis and Victoria. However, from what I've seen so far, I am not convinced this product is necessary or attractive enough to buy into (not just yet at least). G1 (I feel like I'm referring to Transformers... but appropos, given the subject) had tons of versatility evident by not having to have so many independent figures in runtimes to represent wide varieties of sculpts. G2 is a step backwards from this versatility in favor of a more dedicated base for clothing. Yet, the improvements are too subtle to buy into. Looking at G2F vs. GF and V6 vs. V5 morphs and renders, the improvements are not overwhelmingly different than with Gen 4 figs vs. Genesis. Given enough toys like the Evo morphs, the divide only becomes even less apparent, which I believe will just make the majority of us stick with Genesis 1 (especially those who have already heavily invested into products that support it).
V6/G2F is going to be relegated into a smaller niche (in an already niche market) of those wanting the little differences that make the figure more aesthetically pleasing. But for practical use/casual users, Genesis is still going to be the go-to fig. I just hope continued support for G1 is in the foreseeable and distant future.
The PAs don't make these choices. Feedback from customers and PAs, both, do but in the end DAZ3D ultimately decides which way to go or what is working or what isn't or what could be improved. Some changes in this case will help in content creation which means more/better content for the customers but the PAs don't design the figures. Lots of information etc is gathered by DAZ3D from complaints, support tickets, issues that arise in the forums, and THAT is what dictates the changes for the next generation figure what it is. The customers aren't directly asked as it usually doesn't go well since everyone's needs will be different but what they say, the issues they find, etc are very much a factor.
Sorry, but your answer just proved that the PAs are the primary reason DAZ chose the split gender Genesis. Since "the customers aren't directly asked," and I can't imagine that one of the issues the customers had is "we need separate male & female meshes." More likely is customers wanted better bends and clothing fits, the PAs said go back to separate meshes if that's what you want, so that's what DAZ did. To me that makes PAs the primary reason we have separate meshes, because that is not the only way to accomplish those goals, but if you take those as your only goals it may be the easiest way. The problem is, DAZ (and the PAs) seriously underestimated how much many people liked the benefits of the unisex Genesis. Combine that with the PAs saying "we're not taking away anything, you still have your old Genesis", "you don't have to use G2F", and basically telling the complainers that they don't understand how great this is going to be and just quit complaining and go back to using V4; what are we supposed to think? Yes, ultimately DAZ made the decision, but it has been the PAs defending it.
I feel the same way. I don't want a gender split, I don't want to spend money on a new generation when I still have utilities on my wishlist for Genesis 1, some of which just came out last week! I don't want to purchase the same stuff for Genesis 2 that took me a year to get for Genesis.
So why don't we just shut up and play with Genesis 1? Did your parents ever buy one of your siblings something new and not you right at the same time? Did you just say, look at all I have. It's all right. : )
As someone who prefers the single figure, I hope my reasons are a bit more mature than that.
I was looking at the V6 texture and a I am wondering about a few things
1. Why did the creator of the texture have to mirror so much of the texture? The same moles, veins etc on both sides in mirrored locations detracts from the "realism" in my opinoin.
2. Why are the nipples placed crookedly? Other than because they are mirrored.
3. Why the blurred gens area again?
Otherwise a nice looking texture shader-wise in renders.
The conversion process converting gen4 skins even with the Vicky 4 model to duf is rather time consuming. I do not have a lot of Vicky's but I have at least 24 gen4 skins which don't apply. Each one has many options and features. Surely there is a better way than opening, applying to gen 1 and saving as preset?
Any plans to update some of these skins? Especially the V5's with V4 uv's which should auto-apply to v6 but do not.
I have a suggestion. Just do them as you need them. At least for now. I bet that of the 24 that aren't in DUF format you won't use 20 of them this week. and you might not use a dozen of them in the next 2 months...
But maybe you do need 24 textures ASAP. I know I don't. Takes the stress out when you pace it though, if you can. And you never know someone may come up with a script. Maybe. But not in the next 5 minutes.
I see it a lot in the forum, folks want to convert everything they have at once, sometimes it's just not possible.
BTW is anyone else noticing seems at the thighs when they convert from V4 to genesis 2? Or is it just me.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/24152/P120/#358518
SereneNight- help me out here- I'm lost. I buy that product that does the V4 skins for the Genesis 2 figure, I know it said the skins had to be dufs, so that would be materials preset? And why are we putting them on Genesis- how does that get to Genesis 2? Oh brother I am confused.
SereneNight- help me out here- I'm lost. I buy that product that does the V4 skins for the Genesis 2 figure, I know it said the skins had to be dufs, so that would be materials preset? And why are we putting them on Genesis- how does that get to Genesis 2? Oh brother I am confused.
To save them as .duf material presets, you need to put them on a figure -- it can be either V4 or Genesis, but not everyone has V4.
SereneNight- help me out here- I'm lost. I buy that product that does the V4 skins for the Genesis 2 figure, I know it said the skins had to be dufs, so that would be materials preset? And why are we putting them on Genesis- how does that get to Genesis 2? Oh brother I am confused.
You can apply to V4 or genesis. There is one material zone that is unique to V4, an eye reflection I think, so there is a mild advantage to applying to V4 first.(cause you would lose this one zone if you apply to genesis and not V4, but it can be replaced later easily honestly) Anyway save the preset, then apply that preset to Genesis2.
I have a suggestion. Just do them as you need them. At least for now. I bet that of the 24 that aren't in DUF format you won't use 20 of them this week. and you might not use a dozen of them in the next 2 months...
But maybe you do need 24 textures ASAP. I know I don't. Takes the stress out when you pace it though, if you can. And you never know someone may come up with a script. Maybe. But not in the next 5 minutes.
I see it a lot in the forum, folks want to convert everything they have at once, sometimes it's just not possible.
BTW is anyone else noticing seems at the thighs when they convert from V4 to genesis 2? Or is it just me.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/24152/P120/#358518
You are probably right. I tend to get a wee bit 'oh I must bring them all over now' Yarz, and then get intimidated, because of everything involved. It took me an hour to do 3, and well, I only get a few hours to render in the evening.
I haven't looked at the thighs closely, but my current Vicky is wearing a flight suit. I'll check her out next time she's in a bikini.
SereneNight- help me out here- I'm lost. I buy that product that does the V4 skins for the Genesis 2 figure, I know it said the skins had to be dufs, so that would be materials preset? And why are we putting them on Genesis- how does that get to Genesis 2? Oh brother I am confused.
You open gen 1 genesis. Load the skin. Make sure it aligns properly (I forgot one time), File Menu>Save as Material Preset>
Load Gen 2 V-6. Select her. File>Merge>Navigate to folder preset and it does its thing.
Mmm makes ya wonder why they did it that way when you consider that the V4 and M4 Shapes for Genesis were done by Daz themselves. But for V4 to G2 they went the third party route.
...just noticed that.
So much for PC coupons and discounts to help defray a bit of the cost. One more reason I think I'll let my membership lapse when it expires.
...one more reason to stick with "Genesis Classic" and Gen3/4 as well.
Thanks folks. One last question- what do you mean make sure it aligns? Aligns how, and if it doesn't what did you do?
I give it till mid late 2014.
LOL And then the storm of griping will shift its direction onto the new figure.
Seriously, I haven't even had a chance to load this Genesis 2 critter yet, but reading through this thread has left my original impression unchanged. Unless the new one does something amazing for me, I'm going to stick with my good buddy Genesis and be happy.
...bugger, I'm just beginning to enjoy working with "Genesis Classic". Not about to redesign all my characters all over again because they won't be compatible.
Make sure the UVset is set to V4
As someone who prefers the single figure, I hope my reasons are a bit more mature than that.
More mature than "Look at all I have. It's all right. : ) "? That sounds like an immensely reasonable and mature response to me.
-heads off to the unreasonable and immature corner-
...so far:
Genesis2/Victoria6 new releases = 45.
New releases of other content = 0.
...gonna be a long weekend.
*cue light hearted humor*
KK totally could tease you right now about how you shouldn't be worrying about new releases ATM anyway...consider it a blessing *wink*
And honestly that's how it is for me. All the new releases haven't caught my attention at all. And I do like V6 and am looking for goods. But am not impressed...releasing boots I have for genesis yesterday was a slap in the face. But I should have seen it coming.