Commerical Products forum gone?
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lol I know..But I'm not advertising an off site product in a thread, so I'm sure it is harmless. A lot of PA's have off site links in their sigs. If Daz goes down that route to remove it then I will make a scene lol....That would be going too far...
superintelligentmegasite would not hesitate to do so :)
I personally wish they'd still have a separate forum for discussing new products. I'm fine with them being all DAZ products; I just want to have a place where we can discuss products as they're released without a bunch of extra clutter making those discussions hard to find.
Dustrider, Appreciate your post.
There have been a couple of posts about concerns regarding plugins in this thread. I would add the caveat that the same rules apply. There ARE plugins that are sold on the DAZ site. We are only talking about those that are not offered on the site.
I also want to address that idea that because of this one change, the WHOLE DAZ forum is now no longer a place where some customers want to be.
You can believe that we looked at the forum traffic on these threads vs the overall forum traffic. And while the visits to that section were not what I would describe as trivial, (otherwise, we wouldn't be having this lengthy of a discussion about it) those visits were a VERY, VERY small percentage of the overall forum visits.
So to believe that the ENTIRE forum has changed because of these new limitations imposed on this ONE SECTION is overreacting at best and disingenuous at worst.
Customers are still able to share renders, tips and tricks, ask for help, offer help, and do everything they could previously do with one small exception.
The only thing that has changed is that we want to emphasize and focus the commercial thread discussions on DAZ and DAZ PA products and not competitive or 3rd party products.
Even so, I think what I hear you saying is that this will be an inconvenience to you because now you will have to visit other sites to get information on 3rd party products that you are interested in.
If it helps at all let me just say again, we think this change is in the best interest of DAZ PA's and DAZ itself and sincerely add... we apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.
There is. It's just got a new name and is limited to products in the DAZ Store.
There is. It's just got a new name and is limited to products in the DAZ Store.
Oh! Huh. I was seeing threads for products in the commons... Well, I guess no complaints, then ^^;
Wish Granted!!!
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/categories/508/
The commercial threads section does still exist. We have now just limited it to DAZ PA products offered on the DAZ store.
DAZ_BHowell,
There is still the question (posed several times in here and in another thread) of if non-vendors can answer "Who is this character" or "I'm looking for X" with links to products in other stores. This would not be in a commercial thread, but in any non-commerical thread where someone is asking for information.
I'm hoping we can at least still say "Oh yeah, that's X outfit by Y over at (othersite)"
Dustrider, Appreciate your post.
There have been a couple of posts about concerns regarding plugins in this thread. I would add the caveat that the same rules apply. There ARE plugins that are sold on the DAZ site. We are only talking about those that are not offered on the site.
I also want to address that idea that because of this one change, the WHOLE DAZ forum is now no longer a place where some customers want to be.
You can believe that we looked at the forum traffic on these threads vs the overall forum traffic. And while the visits to that section were not what I would describe as trivial, (otherwise, we wouldn't be having this lengthy of a discussion about it) those visits were a VERY, VERY small percentage of the overall forum visits.
So to believe that the ENTIRE forum has changed because of these new limitations imposed on this ONE SECTION is overreacting at best and disingenuous at worst.
Customers are still able to share renders, tips and tricks, ask for help, offer help, and do everything they could previously do with one small exception.
The only thing that has changed is that we want to emphasize and focus the commercial thread discussions on DAZ and DAZ PA products and not competitive or 3rd party products.
Even so, I think what I hear you saying is that this will be an inconvenience to you because now you will have to visit other sites to get information on 3rd party products that you are interested in.
If it helps at all let me just say again, we think this change is in the best interest of DAZ PA's and DAZ itself and sincerely add... we apologize for any inconvenience this may cause you.
That small, tiny, minute, miniscule percentage could be some of your most valued customers taking a dip. That could be equal to a lot more money than it is traffic. And doesn't that small, very, very small percentage still equal traffic? People are traffic right? Doesn't that mean this move is bringing down your traffic? What was the move for? To bring up the traffic? Its not working. If numbers and percentages are the defining factor then why is a loss of customers the correct approach? You have to understand by now that it isn't suddenly this change that is going to make people leave. It is the endless change for the betterment of the company and not the customers. The customers are what make the company though. There has to be common ground or you have a perfect, flawless business that is making no money. I think its time to stop blaming the economy and other store sites for what is happening here. I shopped even in bad economy and I made DAZ my #1 go to place. If you want to know what changed that, check out the last year here. I'm beginning to lose hope that things will become better at this point.
"Premier" was used as an adjective... it should have been "Premier Published Artists." Nobody is changing the name to "Premier Artists".
Well, the store right now is a bit confusing in the respect to names:
Ahhh, sorry I thought someone was quoting a post where we were talking about the best... "Premier" artists in this market.
Marketing has been using "Premier" on the web site for a while now because new users had no idea what a "Published Artist" was but could at least grasp what a "Premier Artist" might be.
It seems like the need for a genuine community-based 3D discussion forum is growing, one free from the control of individual businesses.
Does anyone have experience of free forum hostings such as Forumotion or Freeforums.org?
John
Wish Granted!!!
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/categories/508/
The commercial threads section does still exist. We have now just limited it to DAZ PA products offered on the DAZ store.
This is not what we asked for.
I will support that question. Can we link to other sites from non-commercial, non-dedicated, informative/discussion/contest/other like that threads?
I have about 20 gigs of unused webspace with a pro hoster in switzerland, unlimited bandwith. Could set up something if I find help... Can upgrade if need be.
Discuss?...
Our intention is to encourage promotion and discussion of DAZ and DAZ PA products and limit the PROMOTION of competing products and sites, not ban every post or link to another site.
So we would not expect every post that says "hey what hair did you use on that figure?" "Oh its that hair .... on xyz site" to be removed.
However, if it appears that someone is really just trying to get around the TOS to promote a product then posts may be deleted. Our forum mods are very astute and judicious.
I see nothing to keep genuine community based discussion from happening, guess many want much more than that. I have been here quite awhile and get everything I need from the forums, users and the site, more so that any other site..
As a forum mod in other communities, I have to commend DAZ BHowell for keeping his cool in the midst of all this vitriol.
I have about 20 gigs of unused webspace with a pro hoster in switzerland, unlimited bandwith. Could set up something if I find help... Can upgrade if need be.
Discuss?...
The problem here will be to a) make users to register into new place b) find a good and cheap forum code with comfortable design and good appeal c) to find dedicated moderators.
DITTO!
Excessively astute and judicious sometimes at my opinion.
So we _can_ link other products in non-commercial threads as long as it doesn't violate common sense and purpose of this thread?
Often those products are things DAZ won't sell in their store. Increasingly, I have to look elsewhere for products I want since the number of products that interest me here continues to decline.
Sad though, because if DAZ provided the products I wanted, I'd spend my money here first.
The problem here will be to a) make users to register into new place b) find a good and cheap forum code with comfortable design and good appeal c) to find dedicated moderators.
Kattey;
In short before I go to bed:
a) True, but if they want it they will I hope
b) not really a problem, Joomla has some good forum extensions, or there are some reliable yet cheap forum codes around
c) definitely true!
I know it won't be easy. But we can't just wish for something without trying to make it come true, right? ;-)
Good night!
Excessively astute and judicious sometimes at my opinion.
So we _can_ link other products in non-commercial threads as long as it doesn't violate common sense and purpose of this thread?
Yes... we don't view a link in a thread somewhere that comes up in a conversation the same as a promotional thread in a designated "commercial" section.
Seems to me that posts referring to products on other sites took far less precedence here already than in the past. I'm not sure if the posts to off-site products were really hurting DAZ PAs. It is possible (though I hope this doesn't prove true) that PAs will lose more sales by the alienation this might cause with several community members than the threads linking elsewhere ever caused.
I've never NOT bought something I wanted here at DAZ because I bought something I wanted elsewhere, and I doubt many others have done this either.
Yes... we don't view a link in a thread somewhere that comes up in a conversation the same as a promotional thread in a designated "commercial" section.
Thank you, Brian, in a light of other circumstances those are at least some good news.
Personally I hate to live under witchhunt policy.
I want to reinterate that wonderful point.
If people click away from your site to see somewhere else, it means that they came to your site first. Oppressive, bland, sterile environment that you are creating with the new policy won't make people come to your site at the first place. Why would they even care much about oppressive, bland, sterile environment and PAs who sell for it?
And I want to reiterate it again.
There is still the question (posed several times in here and in another thread) of if non-vendors can answer "Who is this character" or "I'm looking for X" with links to products in other stores. This would not be in a commercial thread, but in any non-commerical thread where someone is asking for information.
I'm hoping we can at least still say "Oh yeah, that's X outfit by Y over at (othersite)"
Our intention is to encourage promotion and discussion of DAZ and DAZ PA products and limit the PROMOTION of competing products and sites, not ban every post or link to another site.
So we would not expect every post that says "hey what hair did you use on that figure?" "Oh its that hair .... on xyz site" to be removed.
However, if it appears that someone is really just trying to get around the TOS to promote a product then posts may be deleted. Our forum mods are very astute and judicious.
So let me get this straight - as a customer, I am allowed to MENTION a product not sold here, I'm just not allowed to praise it or thing it's great, or show an image of it. Am I getting that? If the mods think I'm being, as a customer, too appreciative of another store's item, my post will be deleted? Because I know there has been at least one thread that was deleted because the customer did just that,
You can link to it and name it and (not 100% sure here) praise it but as soon as "very astute and judicious" forum mods will think it is a clever way to avoid 3rd party promotion ban it will be purged.
Not sure about images still.
I'm trying to collect some official word in this thread
Thanks, Kattey - I saw the ok about linking so had deleted it from my post. I am glad the Garabaldi thread was returned but wonder how long it will be allowed to remain....
I'm sad that Reality thread is gone still. I just started to learn it, and *poof* :-/
Could it at least be resurrected on DS Discussion forums? Please? Pretty please?
Exactly my experience. What's insane is that these people make their living off Victoria 4, which is a DAZ product, yet linking to DAZ is verboten...
I do NOT blame DAZ for implementing this policy at all.
You're only correct if you are discussing other sites' forums, specifically.
If I link to Daz products in my gallery credits or vendors link to Daz products in their stores because their product depends on a Daz product such as V4 or a V4-specific item produced by a Daz PA on other sites (specifically, Renderosity, but I have seen it on several other sites I frequent, including DeviantArt and others), it's permitted. I've never seen the links removed and have, in fact, been encouraged to post links to items used in gallery renders that are available at Daz.
So basically, I'll still credit vendors who sell here (because it's the right thing to do and anything less would be asinine and punish good vendors for craptastic garbage policy that is not their fault), but I will be darned if I will specify that those items are available through Daz--because if the policy is good enough for Daz, it's good enough to apply TO Daz. Sorry if any PA's get hurt by it, you can thank Daz...because it's only fair and right and justified, right? If any vendor has their own site, I will most definitely be linking the vendor's site in my credits, though, reagardless of whether the material came from Daz or the vendor's site, because it's the vendor's hard work, and Daz shouldn't profit from it anyway, in my opinion, if the vendor can profit 100%.
Not sure if I blame Daz, per se for this policy specifically, but they're clearly implementing it because they aren't doing spectacularly in this economy. Part of it is due to the economic realities in the world, but much of it is due to absolutely idiotic mismanagement over the past year or more--and that, I most certainly do blame Daz for. Every bad decision they've made, they've doubled down on and compounded to make it spectacularly worse. Is it any wonder I've gone to Poser and started learning it instead because there are other companies who manage to at least pretend that, aside from one of their customer support people (yes, I do mean Britney Creek, who is the one shining light at Daz right now), they give a darn about the people who give them money?