Realistic Renders.... NOT! 14: A new frontier.....

1235737

Comments

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,041
    edited December 1969

    I really really REALLY wish Carrara and Daz3d worked together a lot better. When I came back to CGI stuff a few months back (after many years away), I bought Carrara, thinking (foolishly) 'oh hey, I can do all sorts of cool shader elevations, and terrain generation, and whatever, and have it work in Daz! I'm sure they are compatible.'

    sigh

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,050
    edited December 1969

    I really really REALLY wish Carrara and Daz3d worked together a lot better. When I came back to CGI stuff a few months back (after many years away), I bought Carrara, thinking (foolishly) 'oh hey, I can do all sorts of cool shader elevations, and terrain generation, and whatever, and have it work in Daz! I'm sure they are compatible.'

    sigh

    Most Carrara folks use it the other way around, with Studio acting almost as a plugin for Carrara. The included biased render engine is (arguably) much faster than Studio's, so there's not much incentive to go the other way, especially when you consider the other functions that Carrara has that Studio does not. I'm not saying this as a diss to Studio or saying it is inferior. It is simply designed with a different goal. There are some features in Studio that would be nice to have in Carrara, but for me, I like big scenes, and Studio just does not have the ability to do the scenes I tend to like to do.

    Now that Carrara has the ability to use Lux and Octane render engines via plugins, I'm seeing more new folks popping in, which is a good thing. If somebody could do that for Bryce, then I think the Brycers would see an influx of new users as well.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited April 2015

    ...yeah, what is a bit disappointing is I used to be able to send Daz characters/scene "subsets" into Carrara (6.1) with no trouble and all materials translated properly. Recently when I sent my G2F version of Leela over, all the skin maps were messed up, the transparency maps for the eyelashes didn't translate, the eyes had no details (even after rendering) Furthermore her scaling/proportions looked wrong as well (used the Growing Up morphs as well as a number of morph resource kits).

    Sad because I bought a bunch of Carrara environment sets to use for illustrating my story.


    ETA. Bryce also needs to be updated to 64 bit. The 32 bit memory ceiling seriously limits it's full potential .

    At least with Bryce there is an export bridge from Daz Studio.

    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,050
    edited December 1969

    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...yeah, what is a bit disappointing is I used to be able to send Daz characters/scene "subsets" into Carrara (6.1) with no trouble and all materials translated properly. Recently when I sent my G2F version of Leela over, all the skin maps were messed up, the transparency maps for the eyelashes didn't translate, the eyes had no details (even after rendering) Furthermore her scaling/proportions looked wrong as well (used the Growing Up morphs as well as a number of morph resource kits).

    Sad because I bought a bunch of Carrara environment sets to use for illustrating my story.


    ETA. Bryce also needs to be updated to 64 bit. The 32 bit memory ceiling seriously limits it's full potential .

    At least with Bryce there is an export bridge from Daz Studio.

    I have installed Studio with my version of C8.5, but haven't felt the need to bring anything over from it, but I've only had it for a week. No one was able to help you out with the morphs and other issues you mentioned in the Carrara Discussion Forum?

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited December 1969

    ...no. it seems I would need to recreate the characters from scratch in Carrara which would be difficult as it tends to draw from it's own content library and the Poser Runtime. Zev0's Growing Up and many of the morph resources I use are only found in the Daz Studio library.

  • evilproducerevilproducer Posts: 9,050
    edited April 2015

    I have Studio's library show up in my Smart Content tab- when I remember to either start the CMS or Studio first. ;-)

    It was a bit dodgy at first though. That whole Valentina/PostOHCRAP database thingy.

    Can't speak to the morphs though. Are they one of the HD morphs? Perhaps start a thread specifically asking about these figures/morphs? Maybe someone like Wendy has used them?

    Post edited by evilproducer on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited December 1969

    ...as to the morphs, they are the various Genesis and G2 morph resource kits by Thorne as well as and the Growing Up morphs by Zev0 (both Genesis and G2) and Die Trying's 182 morphs.. Never bothered with the HD morphs as I understand they can be real memory hogs.

    ...ach, forgot the CMS also affects Carrara. It tends to crap out on me from time to time in Daz Studio (PostgreSQL).


    I'm just disappointed by all the trouble I've had trying to import a finished character from Studio into Carrara.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited April 2015

    ...OK break in the discussion, time to post something "Realistic...Not".

    Was on a thread concerning wedding dresses. So took a bit of time to work this one up for my little virtuoso demolitionist.

    Used Ravenhair's Fayre changed the textures with the Fabricator and Fisty's Sparkles. Added a stylised veil using a freebie medieval headpiece and Willmap's Lace shaders and a flutterby (they seem to follow her all over these days). Also used Emma and Jordi's Elven Circlets, Necklaces, and Earrings

    Set it in Merlin's Church adding an extra Advanced Spotlight.

    Rendered in 3DL.

    Leela_wedding_test.png
    636 x 900 - 964K
    Post edited by kyoto kid on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    I like doing portrait or photo studio type scenes from time to time. Especially when I have a bit of "render" block. There's nothing wrong with it. I've done a few more than I normally do lately as I just updated to Carrara 8.5, and I have been experimenting with using Genesis, and getting used to the minor interface changes.

    That being said, I have also been experimenting with using different procedural shader functions, such as functions that utilize elevation to create foam on the tops of the waves in the Ocean primitive:
    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/55137/

    This is great, reminds me of The Prisoner.

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Here is another of my Iray renders of Gareth https://www.daz3d.com/gareth-hd-for-michael-6

    I really like this character, and have been adjusting skin shader and bump map settings. I think this is my most photorealistic render yet using Iray.

    :cheese:

    To my mind it still looks like a Daz render. If Mec4D could post a tutorial outlining what she does then Iray would really take off.

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    I have Studio's library show up in my Smart Content tab- when I remember to either start the CMS or Studio first. ;-)

    It was a bit dodgy at first though. That whole Valentina/PostOHCRAP database thingy.

    Can't speak to the morphs though. Are they one of the HD morphs? Perhaps start a thread specifically asking about these figures/morphs? Maybe someone like Wendy has used them?

    Even though I never use the CMS, switching from Valentina to Postgre was the best move I ever made. I used to think that my system was a little laggy and it turned out that Valentina was the culprit, hanging around when not needed. After uninstalling her and putting Postgre in, my machine has sped up no end. It's only now that I can see the true performance of my machine.

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Kyoto Kid said:

    ETA. Bryce also needs to be updated to 64 bit. The 32 bit memory ceiling seriously limits it's full potential .

    At least with Bryce there is an export bridge from Daz Studio.

    Sadly I can't see this happening, as far as I can recall, the developers of Bryce were a third party that is no longer around and nobody at Daz worked on it.

    CHEERS!

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    Kyoto Kid said:
    ...OK break in the discussion, time to post something "Realistic...Not".

    Was on a thread concerning wedding dresses. So took a bit of time to work this one up for my little virtuoso demolitionist.

    Used Ravenhair's Fayre changed the textures with the Fabricator and Fisty's Sparkles. Added a stylised veil using a freebie medieval headpiece and Willmap's Lace shaders and a flutterby (they seem to follow her all over these days). Also used Emma and Jordi's Elven Circlets, Necklaces, and Earrings

    Set it in Merlin's Church adding an extra Advanced Spotlight.

    Rendered in 3DL.

    LOL! Thanks for that, she looks great. I don't mind you guys having a natter actually. Call it part of the NOT part!

    CHEERS!

    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:
    Kyoto Kid said:

    ETA. Bryce also needs to be updated to 64 bit. The 32 bit memory ceiling seriously limits it's full potential .

    At least with Bryce there is an export bridge from Daz Studio.

    Sadly I can't see this happening, as far as I can recall, the developers of Bryce were a third party that is no longer around and nobody at Daz worked on it.

    CHEERS!
    ...someone must have otherwise we'd still be using ver 5.5.

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    There is a thread here that goes into it a bit:

    http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/52743/P30

    If Daz could get someone to work on it....

    CHEERS!

  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:

    The one way to forever make Daz figures look unrealistic is to pose them in front of photo backdrops. Until Daz figures break the 'uncanny valley' which, even with Iray, they are a long way off doing, they should never pose with things that are from real life. Daz assets look best in Daz settings.

    Don't know about that. :)

    Pickup_Dred.jpg
    1450 x 815 - 901K
  • MusicplayerMusicplayer Posts: 515
    edited April 2015

    Rogerbee said:
    Here is another of my Iray renders of Gareth https://www.daz3d.com/gareth-hd-for-michael-6

    I really like this character, and have been adjusting skin shader and bump map settings. I think this is my most photorealistic render yet using Iray.

    :cheese:

    To my mind it still looks like a Daz render. If Mec4D could post a tutorial outlining what she does then Iray would really take off.

    CHEERS!

    Hi Rogerbee,

    Now I'm in tears, not because of what you said after all my hours of work on this character, but because I can see you are right. I must have been looking at this for so long, and just got too tired. To my eyes he does look a very detailed render, but now I have had a nights sleep and looked at him again, he does look more 3Delight than Iray. :-/

    Yes, I agree, Mec4D has come from a background of using Octane and similar unbiased renderers, and is producing some amazing Iray renders. She has produced some great products over the years that I have purchased, and I am looking forward to seeing what Iray products appear in the DAZ shop from her. I think if she published an Iray tutorial then that would be one of the first items in my shopping cart.

    :-)

    Post edited by Musicplayer on
  • MusicplayerMusicplayer Posts: 515
    edited April 2015

    wowie said:
    Rogerbee said:

    The one way to forever make Daz figures look unrealistic is to pose them in front of photo backdrops. Until Daz figures break the 'uncanny valley' which, even with Iray, they are a long way off doing, they should never pose with things that are from real life. Daz assets look best in Daz settings.

    Don't know about that. :)

    Very nice wowie that does look photorealistic. From what I have seen Iray really does wonders with cars, and like your render, they blend quite realistically with HDRI background images. What I have found is that human subjects are so difficult to make convincingly realistic in front of real life images.
    I guess I should start to look into making my humans more like 'transformers' :lol:

    :-)

    Post edited by Musicplayer on
  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited December 1969


    Very nice wowie that does look photorealistic. From what I have seen Iray really does wonders with cars, and like your render, they blend quite realistically with HDRI background images. What I have found is that human subjects are so difficult to make convincingly realistic in front of real life images.
    I guess I should start to look into making my humans more like 'transformers' :lol:

    :-)

    Hehehe. Not an Iray render. Pure 3delight. :)

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    wowie said:
    Rogerbee said:

    The one way to forever make Daz figures look unrealistic is to pose them in front of photo backdrops. Until Daz figures break the 'uncanny valley' which, even with Iray, they are a long way off doing, they should never pose with things that are from real life. Daz assets look best in Daz settings.

    Don't know about that. :)

    Mmm, I see what you're trying to get at, but, it still looks CGI to me. Maybe I'm better at spotting it than others...

    Anyway, welcome to the madhouse that is my thread. It's like the Hotel California, you can check in, but you'll never leave.... until we hit page 100 that is, LOL!

    CHEERS!

    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    Hi Rogerbee,

    Now I'm in tears, not because of what you said after all my hours of work on this character, but because I can see you are right. I must have been looking at this for so long, and just got too tired. To my eyes he does look a very detailed render, but now I have had a nights sleep and looked at him again, he does look more 3Delight than Iray. :-/

    Yes, I agree, Mec4D has come from a background of using Octane and similar unbiased renderers, and is producing some amazing Iray renders. She has produced some great products over the years that I have purchased, and I am looking forward to seeing what Iray products appear in the DAZ shop from her. I think if she published an Iray tutorial then that would be one of the first items in my shopping cart.

    :-)

    Heyyy,

    Don't get down, we've all been there. I look back at stuff I thought was awesome and I want to cry too! I guess I shoot from the hip and say what I see. You'll never see me flim flam or blow smoke.

    You just continue learning and you do get better

    CHEERS!

    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • wowiewowie Posts: 2,029
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:

    Mmm, I see what you're trying to get at, but, it still looks CGI to me. Maybe I'm better at spotting it than others...

    It's the PWCatch and probably to the too clean reflection on the rims. Plus the light setup wasn't tweaked to the HDRI.-

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited April 2015

    Possibly but, there are some great scene assets you can get into which you can put Daz assets and have them look good. When you see CGI in a movie, a lot of it has been set into CGI backrounds. That's why you see so much green screen work in movies these days. Photo real CG looks good in a photo real 3D setting and not composited into a photo..

    CHEERS!

    Post edited by Rogerbee on
  • jestmartjestmart Posts: 4,449
    edited December 1969

    I need to use deformers on the tires to make them look like they have weight on them.

  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Weight mapped tires, could be a goer!

    CHEERS!

  • Oso3DOso3D Posts: 15,041
    edited December 1969

    What's really helping Mec4d, besides being really really good at what she does, is the HAIR.

    The hair on her models is often just top-notch. I've gotten ok results with the hair I've used, but just not the same.

  • kyoto kidkyoto kid Posts: 41,202
    edited December 1969

    Rogerbee said:
    wowie said:
    Rogerbee said:

    The one way to forever make Daz figures look unrealistic is to pose them in front of photo backdrops. Until Daz figures break the 'uncanny valley' which, even with Iray, they are a long way off doing, they should never pose with things that are from real life. Daz assets look best in Daz settings.

    Don't know about that. :)

    Mmm, I see what you're trying to get at, but, it still looks CGI to me. Maybe I'm better at spotting it than others...

    Anyway, welcome to the madhouse that is my thread. It's like the Hotel California, you can check in, but you'll never leave.... until we hit page 100 that is, LOL!

    CHEERS!
    ...good point. In just about every film trailer where it is used, I can spot the CGI. Some of it is really bad too. One would think with the huge bankrolls film studios throw into epics and blockbusters, they'd at least get the GI, AO, and particle physics right.

    However the average viewer doesn't seem to notice (unless the effect looks glaringly out of place) as the images move by so fast on the screen, especially during action scenes.

    Personally, I tend to enjoy Pixar's efforts more as the entire world is CG generated and thus the look is more consistent.

  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 9,669
    edited December 1969
    Kennedy03pic01.jpg
    1280 x 1024 - 340K
  • ArtiniArtini Posts: 9,669
    edited December 1969

    ... and another one with lights from http://www.daz3d.com/photo-studio-point-and-shoot-2

    Kennedy03pic03.jpg
    1280 x 1024 - 363K
  • RogerbeeRogerbee Posts: 4,460
    edited December 1969

    Got to say, I'm not keen on that Macro Skin at all. I've got far better results with UberSurface2 and Mustakettu's settings. He is also at work on a shader which does sound very promising.

    CHEERS!

Sign In or Register to comment.